09ssbeast

i was wondering what are the pros and cons for these two turbos. Ive been doing research and i want to change my stock turbo for an upgraded turbo. All i have right now is a K&N CAI. im installing the ZZP full intercooler package soon with their catless DP to my stock exhaust since its sedan is my daily driver. Any advice would be nice

Snail_SS

iTrader: (3)

For the R unless you have access to e85 or you are willing to install a meth kit i wouldn't bother

T-Man

iTrader: (3)

Two totally different turbos.... One is a nice upgrade from stock and the other is going to want some RPM to take advantage of it's later spool characteristics....

Good luck buddy

09ssbeast

I know nothing about meth kits so i probably dont wanna mess with that since its my daily driver adn there is no E85 near me that convenient unless i wanna drive over an hour

09ssbeast

I just want to have the potential to make 400whp long term with this set up. I might wait till the stock turbo goes since im a broke college kid and i think my timing chain started making noise today -___-. so i gotta address that issue soon

Snail_SS

iTrader: (3)

Yeah if you want more power out of that turbo you need one of the 2 options. Don't know much of the other turbo tho and yeah get that taken care off

63 Nova SS

iTrader: (3)

252 has a lot more potential than an R but will spoil a little later. Like others have said-unless you run e or race gas the r isn't worth it.

CudaJoe

iTrader: (1)

Pros and Cons eh?

Heres some pros and cons.

S252
Pros: you'll more than likely hit your desired 400whp goal.

Cons: later spool but who cares. Not a direct bolt on, will need BOV (i believe), charge piping, turbo manifold.


K04r
Pros: Its a turbo.

Cons: Its a stock turbo with a slightly bigger compressor. little power gains. Doesnt even compare to the S252. your not hitting 400 whp even maxing out everything you could possibly max out.


I dont even think K04r should be a choice for someone looking to upgrade. Its an oem replacement at best.

better comparison would be S252 vs a Precision 5858 or the lower tier ZFR turbo.

09ssbeast

well i already have a full inter-cooler kit from zzp that fits the stock turbo. However it is not installed yet. i dont want to buy another turbo kit just to fit a slighter bigger turbo. My car is going to be tuned on 93 soon after i get the body work done. So in other words im looking for a bolt on turbo that bigger then the stock KO4. isnt the ZFR turbo's around 1500+$?

royce777

iTrader: (29)

If you already invested in the intercooler kit then your best bet is to go with a ZFR.

The 6758 ZFR is $1900. The 7163 ZFR $2300.

09ssbeast

Welp i guess i wont be getting a turbo until next summer then! The 6758 ZFR will probably be the best solution. This summers goals is to replace the suspension all the way around (at 106K) with Powell yyz lowering spring paired with the factory structs. Might get a new set of rims depending on how much it costs to repaint the stock rims, with Enkei M52s rims paired with Michelin pilot super sports 235/40/18.

royce777

iTrader: (29)

You would need a clutch also if your still rocking a factory one. Honestly, I would just do bolt ons and tuned and you'll have fun with the car. Especially if you are planning on doing other maintenance stuff such as suspension. You will probably have to replace other odds and ends as you go too.

09ssbeast

i already have a K&N CAI installed. My catless DP and ZZP intercooler kit is in my garage, i gotta buy the upgraded 3 bar sensors before i get it tuned. Already replaced brakes and control arms. Im going to rock my stock clutch until it starts slipping since its perfect right now. The more immediate things i need are to figure out my timing chain issue, it was making noise yesterday. But i got my oil changed today and i cannot hear it anymore..... which is kind of worrying. just ordered the VVT sensors since i keep throwing codes for them. Wheel bearing and steering column need to be replaced as well.

royce777

iTrader: (29)

I would worry for about maintenance parts first before planning on doing a big turbo just my input!

09ssbeast

That exactly what im doing!!! just a lot of maintenance cause from the looks of things the previous owner never took care of my car. So ive been playing catch up over the last year and a half. I love my car because its the LNF sedan and always wanted one since they came out.

royce777

iTrader: (29)

That's me with my sedan. I always wanted a yellow sedan and now I finally have. I have a lot of work into my sedan. Literally more than half the stuff on the car is new.

09ssbeast

my sedan is black with the two tones white and black interior. Cant wait till it gets repainted

Omiotek

iTrader: (2)

ko4r will never hit 400whp.

CudaJoe

iTrader: (1)

Timing chain noise maybe broken guides. Its the most likely thing to occur on an LNF. The old style tensioner which you probably still have on the car exerts a lot of force briefly on cold starts that causes the chain to grind the guides. It is regulated by oil flow. Since you just had your oil changed, you may have had some thick oil causing the tensioner to put more force on the chain than usual making your noise. Just a theory. Dont take it as fact.

If anyone know more about tensioners, chime in. I only regurgitate what I read.

You dont need new intercooler piping if you bought some. I only listed that as a need for the S252 because it needs a BOV. you could always get the BOV flange welded on the zzp charge piping you have.

There are 3 ZFRs available and they are all direct bolt on fit. There are other direct bolt on option too. I remember BNR did a bigger compressor wheel and housing mated to a K04 turbine as a hybrid turbo. I dont think it could hit 400whp easily though.

The ZFRs are 6258, 6758, 7163.

The 6258 and 6758 are the same price but one has a smaller OD compressor wheel (62mm vs 67mm) obviously by the name. It spools quicker and according to zzps claim is about >90% of the potential power output of the 6758.

If you could make 400whp with a 6758, the 6258 could make 360+ whp. They also claimed full bolt ons, tune, and e85, they made 510whp with a 6258. Im sure they have a fully built motor running it with upgraded fueling and cams.

Direct comparison to a 6758, same car made 540whp. BUT since they are the same price, why not just go with the 6758 over a 6258. I dont see the selling point. I read quicker spool as in quicker torque spike and boom goes the transmission if your tuner didnt restrict boost in lower rpm.

Omiotek

iTrader: (2)

The 6258 making 510........ either thats one happy dyno or its overboosted by a lot. Turbo flows at 45 lbs/min. The 6758 is 50 lbs/min

The 6258 is the perfect turbo in my opinion..... made 416whp 427 ft lbs on my old setup with a tubular manifold before the nolt on turbos even exsisted. Ii road race so anything passed a 6758 is a total waste especially on smaller tracks. However if you like high pulling the bigger version would suit you better.

Half the trans failures are due to aggressive clutches and poor driving. Sure their is a point where delivering torque will kill it but i have had 2 cars now making in excess of 400 ft lbs and never have i had a trans fail... then again both were 09s never had porus block issues or had to build the engine either. Most of the battle os involved in tuning, maitenence and doing your modifications correctly and driver

63 Nova SS

iTrader: (3)

I think the trans that lnfwagonSS is starting to build will make a big difference. Brace, and getting 3rd gear aligned along with giving it more support on the shaft could be a game changer.

CudaJoe

iTrader: (1)

I can see quicker spool time helps with the road racing but is it that much quicker than the 6758? I dont know, Im really asking. When does full boost come on with both turbos? I was always under the impression that the 6758 was pretty close to stock, maybe 3000 rpms.

Omiotek

iTrader: (2)

The reaponse os bette by atleast 300 rpm. I dont need the peak power of the 6758. Why have it? I can rum the turbo very well into its efficiency range and utilize its power through the power band. Putting it to the ground is the most important thing.

CudaJoe

iTrader: (1)

So I just want to add to my previous post about turbo options. Seems Hahn Racecraft and Precision teamed up. You can get a decent Precision turbo in the same price range as a ZFR but you will need to add a BOV.

Very tempted to throw money at this next time I have it lol.

https://www.hahnracecraft.com/collec...-turbo-upgrade

Omiotek

iTrader: (2)

With the hahn kit the drain line needs to be changed to something better . His fitting pertrudes up into the oil return of the turbo. Put that on like that and pte will not be happy as its possible for oil to back up with a fitting like that.

Also note that any of his exhaust stuff, is mild steel flanges with stainless tubing. You get what you pay for without a doubt. Pte turbos can be bought from a number of authorized dealers. Hahn just paid their buy in to become a dealer and the kit is all hahn designed.