shows his previous then he redynoed so they recalibrated the dyno better, and he pulled

http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/showthread.php3?s=720c445d09dadbcd8803c03e4a46c631&threadid=43296

someone can do the pics, i dunno how

http://www.cs-servers.com/ion/dyno1.jpg
there ya go

http://www.cs-servers.com/ion/dyno1.jpg

Nice. I'm really liking the numbers these engines are putting down. Power delivery and torque seem pretty good for a 4 cylinder engine, smooth and not too peaky. Looks as if 3600-3700 RPM is where it really starts to pull.

Notice also that the car is still gaining power at the redline, and the torque drop-off at redline isn't too bad, so even without more tuning a simple chip to increase the redline a few hundred RPM would probably result in some extra power.

LOL beat me by 1 minute.

http://www.cs-servers.com/ion/dyno1.jpg

Nice. I'm really liking the numbers these engines are putting down. Power delivery and torque seem pretty good for a 4 cylinder engine, smooth and not too peaky. Looks as if 3600-3700 RPM is where it really starts to pull.

Notice also that the car is still gaining power at the redline, and the torque drop-off at redline isn't too bad, so even without more tuning a simple chip to increase the redline a few hundred RPM would probably result in some extra power.

Yes. Especially in first gear. It hits the limiter a little too quick in first IMO.

Maybe GM will refine this with the Cobalt. I hope so. That means that I can have them do it to my Redline too. :mrgreen:

All I'm getting are red X's. :(

Edit: Working now. Awesome results. :bow:

Those are really nice numbers. I like the way how domestic companys underrate the hp ratings. My gf is looking to get one once it comes out.

what was done to the car to get the extra 15hp?

he said it was recalibrated, no mods.

although simply removing the airbox and strapping on the K&N filter nets around 9 hp, which is nice, probobly more on the road as you're getting cooler air when the car is in motion

thats a damn good re-cal. look at the power diff at like 3200RPMS thats like 100hp &75 lb.ft. of Tq ......damn thats a rocket of the line

never mind i must be high :lol:

not bad....not bad.... :cssNET:

Did anyone notice that the dyno graph posted here isn't quite right? Maybe, it's just me looking at it funny, but all dyno graphs HP & Torque figures should cross at 5250...this one crosses at somewhere around 5800.

Correct me if I'm wrong on this one.

Did anyone notice that the dyno graph posted here isn't quite right? Maybe, it's just me looking at it funny, but all dyno graphs HP & Torque figures should cross at 5250...this one crosses at somewhere around 5800.

Correct me if I'm wrong on this one.

no, that depends on the car
:lol:

no, that depends on the car
:lol:


What do you mean? HP is HP and Torque is Torque...doesn't matter what kind of car it is. Dynos measure torque at the wheels and convert it to HP...the formula is to multiply torque by rpm/5250. Because of this, any valid dyno graph will always have HP & torque cross at 5250. The HP & torque figure maybe 50 or 550, but at 5250 RPM they should be equal.

What do you mean? HP is HP and Torque is Torque...doesn't matter what kind of car it is. Dynos measure torque at the wheels and convert it to HP...the formula is to multiply torque by rpm/5250. Because of this, any valid dyno graph will always have HP & torque cross at 5250. The HP & torque figure maybe 50 or 550, but at 5250 RPM they should be equal.

Actually horsepower is torque applied over distance/time. :)

What the question is about is where the HP and TQ curves cross. It had to do with the power band of the engine ect. I know just enough to know thats what the question is about. :red:

Did anyone notice that the dyno graph posted here isn't quite right? Maybe, it's just me looking at it funny, but all dyno graphs HP & Torque figures should cross at 5250...this one crosses at somewhere around 5800.

Correct me if I'm wrong on this one.


that is werid.... I have always heard the 5252- rpm thing too

Actually horsepower is torque applied over distance/time. :)

What the question is about is where the HP and TQ curves cross. It had to do with the power band of the engine ect. I know just enough to know thats what the question is about. :red:

I agree that HP is TQ applied over distance/time...but that's not what I was trying to say. Again dynos only measure torque. To give HP numbers the dyno software uses the formula torque multiplied by rpm/5250 (actually 5252 as someone pointed out). Maybe the math wizs out there can explain why 5252...I'm guessing it has something to do with rpm into distance/time, but I could be way out in LF on that point.

Look at the AEM intake thread elsewhere in this forum. Although the HP & TQ graphs are seperate, you'll see at 5252 they are close...and if you could overlay the graphs I'm betting they would cross at 5252 rpm.

Hope I'm not stepping on anyone's toes here...just looking for an explaination.

http://www.revsearch.com/dynamometer/torque_vs_horsepower.html
some math behind it...

being the chart shows SAE and not metric then the numbers should cross earlier if they are scaled the same

http://www.revsearch.com/dynamometer/torque_vs_horsepower.html
some math behind it...

being the chart shows SAE and not metric then the numbers should cross earlier if they are scaled the same

From the site you posted above...

Here's an interesting bit of trivia; below 5252 rpm any engine's torque number will always be higher than its horsepower number, and above 5252 rpm any engine's horsepower number will always be higher than its torque number. At 5252 rpm the horsepower and torque numbers will be exactly the same.

Why should it matter if it's SAE or Metric...I don't understand that part, but then again all the math on the site is giving me a headache ;) At least I know that my thinking was on the right track and that 5252 is a constant involving changing rpm to time/distance.

that just doesnt happen in realy life tho
diff engines have diff powerbands and numbers
all dyno's are different and such and such

Power = Torque * RPM / 5252

ALWAYS. That does NOT change from car to car.

Look more carefully at the graph. The torque curve is on a secondary axis on the right side of the graph. If you follow it out, on the blue curve, at 5252 RPM, the horsepower and torque numbers are exactly equal. About 187hp/lbft.

I can write out the math for you, if you like! :)

Power = Torque * RPM / 5252

ALWAYS. That does NOT change from car to car.

Look more carefully at the graph. The torque curve is on a secondary axis on the right side of the graph. If you follow it out, on the blue curve, at 5252 RPM, the horsepower and torque numbers are exactly equal. About 187hp/lbft.

I can write out the math for you, if you like! :)


Thanks DanM...I see where I made my mistake now.

Power = Torque * RPM / 5252

ALWAYS. That does NOT change from car to car.

Look more carefully at the graph. The torque curve is on a secondary axis on the right side of the graph. If you follow it out, on the blue curve, at 5252 RPM, the horsepower and torque numbers are exactly equal. About 187hp/lbft.

I can write out the math for you, if you like! :)


I may not be looking at the graph correctly.. but both runs seem to cross at 5.9K RPMs?

I may not be looking at the graph correctly.. but both runs seem to cross at 5.9K RPMs?
I think you can attribute that to the different legends for horsepower and torque. If the HP and the TQ scales were the same they would cross at the same spot on the graph. As you can see the TQ scale is a bit larger so it's going to move the point where the lines cross.

At 5252 RPM both the HP and TQ are ~180 . Since the scales are different tho the lines doesn't actually cross at that point.

Whew...glad that got settled!! I was about to go crazy!! As stated, 5252 is the function of plotting both BOTH HP and Torque no matter what...EVER. 5252 is the number that the two will always intersect. In fact, some builders build their motors specifically so that 5252 (or in that neighborhood) is the shift point and they gear the car accordingly. Go math! :cool:

Who knows where 5252 comes from though. I do :)

James Watt said an average horse can lift 550lbs. 1ft in one second (Equals 550ft/lbs. per second or 33,000 ft/lbs. per minute)
The measure of torque is one revolution assuming 1 pound of resistance. (Pi x 2ft circle)
So assuming that one pound resistance over one full revolution you get 6.2832 ft/lbs of work.
Now divide 33,000 ft/lbs of horsepower by the work it takes to turn one pound of resistance over one full revolution (6.2832) and you get 5252 rotations per minute to equal one horsepower. That is why HP and Torque have to meet at 5252 to justify the equation. They have to eqaul 1.

Therefore Horsepower = (Torquex Rpm) /5252

So now everyone knows :cssNET:

wow, emperial system blows. thank Goddness for SI units, go metric.