Japeatr's knocking at the track rebuild thread
09-13-2014, 08:36 AM
#151
09-13-2014, 08:51 AM
#153
Wow that was interesting. Back on topic I prefer the stock oil cooler set up. I have seen too much wear from over cooled race engines on start up. The stock cooling system is pretty darn good. I did make a Ron davis radiator for test in 2005 eventually mike Kramer used it in his race redline but our testing showed no gain cooling performance / weight etc. It was heavy. If you look at performance / power/weight relationship , Vaughn ,losing weight can sure provide a less expensive gain in any build. Iirc we used to figure 10 lbs = 1 hp but that may be inaccurate. Time attack cobalt got Down to 2200 lbs without driver the toughest part was losing weight at the front ; rear weight loss is easy
09-14-2014, 06:26 PM
#161
It is NOT a fact that an ecotec can pull that off with a valve train not designed for solids. And I never said there wasn't power to be had. I just see absolutely no point in running them unless you're building a dyno queen and need every single available hp.
09-14-2014, 06:55 PM
#162
No one likes you. And once again, you have no idea what you're talking about.
It is NOT a fact that an ecotec can pull that off with a valve train not designed for solids. And I never said there wasn't power to be had. I just see absolutely no point in running them unless you're building a dyno queen and need every single available hp.
It is NOT a fact that an ecotec can pull that off with a valve train not designed for solids. And I never said there wasn't power to be had. I just see absolutely no point in running them unless you're building a dyno queen and need every single available hp.
MBut then in 1930's my dad ran the Shelsey Walsh hill ciimb in a CHAIN DRIVE Frazer-Nash and told me that at that time they twisted three main bearing crank engines to 7000 rpm.
SO
Why go backwards in technology for limited gains? If any. Just to troll the forums I am thinking. Folks on here don't have the cash to invest in solid lifters in a 3-8,000 dollar car
Be happy with what you have
09-14-2014, 07:07 PM
#163
actually there is a need but you need and not for dyno queen reasons the stock lash adjusters will not handle things very well and tend to collapse even the gen 2 lash adjusters are unstable the valve train does not care what it has its just metal and john powell solids are not going backwards they are going forward and even though most don't like spawne32 he is right
09-14-2014, 07:17 PM
#164
Now you're just being cantankerous. There's no reason to get worked up, I'm just stating my opinion.
By saying spawnee is right, you're calling your own facts armchair science, and we both know that's not true. So, save the drama.
At the end of the day ask 10 top engine builders if our setups need solids and most will tell you no. Just because you believe you need them does not mean Vaughn does. And on that note, from how you have described your issues, you're not collapsing the lifters anyway.
By saying spawnee is right, you're calling your own facts armchair science, and we both know that's not true. So, save the drama.
At the end of the day ask 10 top engine builders if our setups need solids and most will tell you no. Just because you believe you need them does not mean Vaughn does. And on that note, from how you have described your issues, you're not collapsing the lifters anyway.
09-14-2014, 07:24 PM
#165
Now you're just being cantankerous. There's no reason to get worked up, I'm just stating my opinion.
By saying spawnee is right, you're calling your own facts armchair science, and we both know that's not true. So, save the drama.
At the end of the day ask 10 top engine builders if our setups need solids and most will tell you no. Just because you believe you need them does not mean Vaughn does. And on that note, from how you have described your issues, you're not collapsing the lifters anyway.
By saying spawnee is right, you're calling your own facts armchair science, and we both know that's not true. So, save the drama.
At the end of the day ask 10 top engine builders if our setups need solids and most will tell you no. Just because you believe you need them does not mean Vaughn does. And on that note, from how you have described your issues, you're not collapsing the lifters anyway.
09-14-2014, 07:30 PM
#166
Now you're just being cantankerous. There's no reason to get worked up, I'm just stating my opinion.
By saying spawnee is right, you're calling your own facts armchair science, and we both know that's not true. So, save the drama.
At the end of the day ask 10 top engine builders if our setups need solids and most will tell you no. Just because you believe you need them does not mean Vaughn does. And on that note, from how you have described your issues, you're not collapsing the lifters anyway.
By saying spawnee is right, you're calling your own facts armchair science, and we both know that's not true. So, save the drama.
At the end of the day ask 10 top engine builders if our setups need solids and most will tell you no. Just because you believe you need them does not mean Vaughn does. And on that note, from how you have described your issues, you're not collapsing the lifters anyway.
im not being cantankerous in any way and its not armchair science the facts are there solids have been in use and still are in use longer then a hydraulic setups and they are more reliable I have had many discussions with the people who built ecotec race engines and a lot of what they said I already new from past experience there are good advantages to the solids the problem I have is lash adjuster related been verified
09-14-2014, 07:46 PM
#167
You are being cantankerous, because now you're saying the opposite of spawnee, but that's whatever. Moving on.
How was it verified you have lash adjuster problems? When one collapses slightly under pressure it takes it a while to build back up, and the engine runs like crap in the meantime. This IS how it works, not just a sometimes.
You never described whatever was happening at high rpm with yours in that way.
I really don't see why you're getting upset. I'm not saying you're WRONG. I'm just saying there's no proof that jap has even the slightest reasonable need to run solids.
If you want to run them, more power to you. I'll even help because I do think it would be fun to see what they can do if someone else is forking up the time and money, in addition to their longevity on a car that will see street use.
If you want me to take your word as fact than give me some evidence bud. That's really not so much to ask. Saying "go read" or "I've talked to people" doesn't cut it, you know me better than that.
And as a footnote, if we had a post mounted adjustable rocker, I'd be much more in favor of solids. The problem here is not that I don't think they work. I know they do. But it's not a set it and forget it for 200k type of deal and you know that. They are not forgiving in comparison to hydraulics and will need to be maintained.
How was it verified you have lash adjuster problems? When one collapses slightly under pressure it takes it a while to build back up, and the engine runs like crap in the meantime. This IS how it works, not just a sometimes.
You never described whatever was happening at high rpm with yours in that way.
I really don't see why you're getting upset. I'm not saying you're WRONG. I'm just saying there's no proof that jap has even the slightest reasonable need to run solids.
If you want to run them, more power to you. I'll even help because I do think it would be fun to see what they can do if someone else is forking up the time and money, in addition to their longevity on a car that will see street use.
If you want me to take your word as fact than give me some evidence bud. That's really not so much to ask. Saying "go read" or "I've talked to people" doesn't cut it, you know me better than that.
And as a footnote, if we had a post mounted adjustable rocker, I'd be much more in favor of solids. The problem here is not that I don't think they work. I know they do. But it's not a set it and forget it for 200k type of deal and you know that. They are not forgiving in comparison to hydraulics and will need to be maintained.
09-14-2014, 08:09 PM
#168
a lifter only takes time to recover if its been floated to full collapse they don't always fully collapse the main problem is on the exhaust side of the head as for posting proof im not going to im tired of people doing a copy and paste if they want the information then they need to take the time as I have and do the work themselves
as for running solids I bet a ecotec would go just as far on them as any Honda
if a person expects to get a bunch of miles out of a big cammed high rpm small cubic in engine then they are high as **** 90% are to lazy or dumb to do the upkeep
and I am yet to get upset
as for running solids I bet a ecotec would go just as far on them as any Honda
if a person expects to get a bunch of miles out of a big cammed high rpm small cubic in engine then they are high as **** 90% are to lazy or dumb to do the upkeep
and I am yet to get upset
09-14-2014, 10:11 PM
#169
a lifter only takes time to recover if its been floated to full collapse they don't always fully collapse the main problem is on the exhaust side of the head as for posting proof im not going to im tired of people doing a copy and paste if they want the information then they need to take the time as I have and do the work themselves
as for running solids I bet a ecotec would go just as far on them as any Honda
if a person expects to get a bunch of miles out of a big cammed high rpm small cubic in engine then they are high as **** 90% are to lazy or dumb to do the upkeep
and I am yet to get upset
and I am yet to get upset
This is why I'm pestering you. To make sure Vaughn gets all the info he needs to make the decision that is right for HIM.
You are aware of what it's going to take to run solids properly. He may not be.
So you can't just say hey you, you need this, so do it.
09-14-2014, 10:15 PM
#170
your pestering because you can nothing more and its not my fault people are lazy and to scared to step out and do **** but have to follow others
dose not matter if it was a hyd convert to solid or sold from the start the metal will never know or care about the difference but engine performance will
I don't have to rant about how reliable they usage and time has proven that
dose not matter if it was a hyd convert to solid or sold from the start the metal will never know or care about the difference but engine performance will
I don't have to rant about how reliable they usage and time has proven that
Last edited by mrbelvedere; 09-14-2014 at 10:20 PM.
09-14-2014, 10:26 PM
#171
That may be how it appears to you. But that is not the case.
Like I said, fine, but understand what the flip side is going to be.
Instead of telling jap what he needs to do based on what you've heard, do it yourself and be a leader.
it does matter. Engines designed for solids are much easier to adjust.
At one point you say 200k, then you say people are stupid if they expect it to last. I'm just digging for which is what you really feel.
and its not my fault people are lazy and to scared to step out and do **** but have to follow others
Instead of telling jap what he needs to do based on what you've heard, do it yourself and be a leader.
dose not matter if it was a hyd convert to solid or sold from the start the metal will never know or care about the difference but engine performance will
I don't have to rant about how reliable they usage and time has proven that
09-15-2014, 01:57 PM
#172
That may be how it appears to you. But that is not the case.
Like I said, fine, but understand what the flip side is going to be.
Instead of telling jap what he needs to do based on what you've heard, do it yourself and be a leader.
it does matter. Engines designed for solids are much easier to adjust.
At one point you say 200k, then you say people are stupid if they expect it to last. I'm just digging for which is what you really feel.
Like I said, fine, but understand what the flip side is going to be.
Instead of telling jap what he needs to do based on what you've heard, do it yourself and be a leader.
it does matter. Engines designed for solids are much easier to adjust.
At one point you say 200k, then you say people are stupid if they expect it to last. I'm just digging for which is what you really feel.
09-15-2014, 02:11 PM
#173
it is the case alan your digging to try and benefit yourself and its not what ive heard its what I know and as for the valve train it does not matter if it was converted from solid to hyd or hyd to solid it metal it has no feelings and as for mileage it does not matter if its sold or hyd lift/lash a high strung engine is not going to last a bunch of miles
The entire purpose of me debating this with you was to bring out information that Vaughn needs to make the choice that is best for him, not just whatever someone tells him to, be that you OR anyone else.
09-15-2014, 04:14 PM
#174
Well Bates made the decision for me, have neither time to wait, nor money for what they cost to have made at Bates.
Im running hydraulics after all...
I do APPRECIATE the passion from my friends that I trust - Walters, Powell, McClure. It is good to know they are discussing my engine as far as pros and cons.
I would have run them from the thinking outside the box and all out perspective, however im not going down that path in regard to the solids
Im running hydraulics after all...
I do APPRECIATE the passion from my friends that I trust - Walters, Powell, McClure. It is good to know they are discussing my engine as far as pros and cons.
I would have run them from the thinking outside the box and all out perspective, however im not going down that path in regard to the solids