07blackg5 Build Thread. Operation Moneypit
02-25-2015, 10:19 PM
#201
im so excited to get this bottom end off to the machine shop this weekend. boltons and the 75 shot felt so damn fast, and was only low mid 200's. high 300s/low 400s is going to be insane haha
and I think the moral of the story is that a dremel and/or a hacksaw can solve all my problems
and I think the moral of the story is that a dremel and/or a hacksaw can solve all my problems
02-26-2015, 12:53 PM
#203
Is dezod the only place that makes a braided clutch line? I thought there was another place that made one too.
And for the pcv system. The line off the valve cover is technically just a fresh air inlet, correct? So If I were to put a breather filter on the nipple, it shouldn't be a problem, correct? I know zzp does this with their blower kit, but I dont think they take the pcv into account as the stock manifold just blocks the outlet.
And for the pcv system. The line off the valve cover is technically just a fresh air inlet, correct? So If I were to put a breather filter on the nipple, it shouldn't be a problem, correct? I know zzp does this with their blower kit, but I dont think they take the pcv into account as the stock manifold just blocks the outlet.
02-26-2015, 03:19 PM
#205
I thought about this some more...
so when the check valve in the manifold closes under boost and blocks the pcv port, the crankcase pressure need to go somewhere. The only place it can go is out (without blowing seals) the "fresh air inlet" on the valve cover
So technically on our n/a cars the pcv in the manifold is always open, so the valve cover is always just an inlet. although some pressure will be released through the valve cover, just not all of it.
That being said, going WOT on the blower cars will force all crankcase pressure out of the fresh air inlet, because the pcv will be closed. So if I just put a breather on the port, it would collect all sorts of oil that would otherwise be routed to the intake (and probably drip). I could run a line to a vented "breather box/catch can to catch anything that may be forced out, but technically the baffles in the valve cover will keep large amounts of oil from exiting.
I have heard of people taking the baffles out of the valve cover and welding nipples/AN bungs directly above two of the pcv channels to provide the least amount of restriction for the venting gasses. This makes sense since the pcv closes under boost and the pressure needs somewhere to go.
I think I might weld bungs to the valve cover, and run 2 lines to a breather box. just have the original "fresh air inlet" removed and welded closed.
so when the check valve in the manifold closes under boost and blocks the pcv port, the crankcase pressure need to go somewhere. The only place it can go is out (without blowing seals) the "fresh air inlet" on the valve cover
So technically on our n/a cars the pcv in the manifold is always open, so the valve cover is always just an inlet. although some pressure will be released through the valve cover, just not all of it.
That being said, going WOT on the blower cars will force all crankcase pressure out of the fresh air inlet, because the pcv will be closed. So if I just put a breather on the port, it would collect all sorts of oil that would otherwise be routed to the intake (and probably drip). I could run a line to a vented "breather box/catch can to catch anything that may be forced out, but technically the baffles in the valve cover will keep large amounts of oil from exiting.
I have heard of people taking the baffles out of the valve cover and welding nipples/AN bungs directly above two of the pcv channels to provide the least amount of restriction for the venting gasses. This makes sense since the pcv closes under boost and the pressure needs somewhere to go.
I think I might weld bungs to the valve cover, and run 2 lines to a breather box. just have the original "fresh air inlet" removed and welded closed.
02-26-2015, 03:31 PM
#206
Your over thinking it :p the amount of time the car spends in boost should be minimal compared to the life of the breather. Try the breather filter for a while, see if it begins collecting anything. The NA cars PCV valve closes off too under high vacuum as well, the opposite way, all it is is a check valve with a ball inside that goes in the direct its forced. Perfect example, try sucking on one end of the PCV valve you will notice it closes off, then blow on it and see that it does the same thing.
02-26-2015, 03:53 PM
#207
The n/a cars have a restrictor plate, not a valve.
I understand how the check valve works. The issue is that the crankcase pressure is generated by blow from the rings. As the rpms/throttle increase, so does the blowby. Once the pcv check valve closes under boost, the pressure will build up in the crankcase, and will need somewhere to go (in this case it will exit at the valve cover). This is only really a concern during a pull because once you let off the throttle, the pcv in the manifold opens again.
My concern is that the vapors and residual oil that makes it into the filter may cause it to gum up quickly and limit incoming air when the pcv valve is open
I understand how the check valve works. The issue is that the crankcase pressure is generated by blow from the rings. As the rpms/throttle increase, so does the blowby. Once the pcv check valve closes under boost, the pressure will build up in the crankcase, and will need somewhere to go (in this case it will exit at the valve cover). This is only really a concern during a pull because once you let off the throttle, the pcv in the manifold opens again.
My concern is that the vapors and residual oil that makes it into the filter may cause it to gum up quickly and limit incoming air when the pcv valve is open
02-26-2015, 05:46 PM
#214
I've been trying to make some headway with the manifold alignment issue, it would be as simple as brass spacers being pressed into the head if I could get them sized correctly. The only M6 spacers mcmastercarr has are 13mm OD, but the manifold and phenolic spacer are 8.5 OD holes roughly, a perfect fit for an M8 bolt almost. Normally id say **** it and just bore the hole out on the manifold slightly larger but problem is the phenolic spacer doesnt have enough material for 13mm sleeves (to keep it centered with the manifold) without causing the spacer to crack.
02-26-2015, 06:04 PM
#217
You shouldnt need spacers at all. If you use the shoulder bolts to align the manifold while you tighten down the m6 bolts, there shouldn't be an issue.
Plus then if you use 2 shoulder bolts as final install bolts (and the rest just m6 bolts, it will keep everything centered, minus the spacer closest to the head, which wont move if everything else is tight.
I rushed 2 pics before I leave work. the one is to show final assembly. Notice how the shoulder isnt bottomed against the head so that it can be torqued properly. It will hold everything centered but the last gasket (which will be squeezed in and isnt going anywhere without loosening the bolts)
The other pic is using the very long bolts so that the shoulder does bottom out. this allows everything to be held centered, including the spacer against the head, while everything is being tightened down during install
Plus then if you use 2 shoulder bolts as final install bolts (and the rest just m6 bolts, it will keep everything centered, minus the spacer closest to the head, which wont move if everything else is tight.
I rushed 2 pics before I leave work. the one is to show final assembly. Notice how the shoulder isnt bottomed against the head so that it can be torqued properly. It will hold everything centered but the last gasket (which will be squeezed in and isnt going anywhere without loosening the bolts)
The other pic is using the very long bolts so that the shoulder does bottom out. this allows everything to be held centered, including the spacer against the head, while everything is being tightened down during install
02-26-2015, 06:14 PM
#218
Problem is I can only get shouldered bolts with 11mm of thread, we need somewhere in the ballpark of 29-30mm of thread to apply proper torque. I wouldnt want to leave it without a shouldered bolt as id be worried about the spacer moving out of alignment over time from vibrations.
02-26-2015, 06:20 PM
#219
that's why I suggested using regular m6 bolts on all but one or two. Ill bet if you just used one shoulder bolt in the middle hole, it would keep everything in position. the manifold would have to twist at that point, and it is bolted to the lower IM bracket.
The intake manifold to head tq spec is only 16ft/lbs. If it were just that one bolt with shallow threads, I'm sure it would be fine. Plus the one in the middle is least likely to lift once everything is all said and done.
It isnt optimal, but i think it still a good solution to the issue
The intake manifold to head tq spec is only 16ft/lbs. If it were just that one bolt with shallow threads, I'm sure it would be fine. Plus the one in the middle is least likely to lift once everything is all said and done.
It isnt optimal, but i think it still a good solution to the issue
02-26-2015, 06:24 PM
#220
Let me stop trying to do this in mm and see if i can come up with something in inches. Mcmastercarr tends to prefer standard units over metric when it comes to these things. I'm not talking about sleeving the entire thing, just the end two holes like your suggesting with the shouldered screw, I just dont feel the shouldered screw is going to work the way I want it.
02-26-2015, 06:59 PM
#221
what if you got a long threaded rod/stud in m6, and threaded some m6 to m8 helicoil type adapters over it to act like the spacer. then just use a nut on the end to tq the manifold
That would work as well and you could do it on all of them
That would work as well and you could do it on all of them
