Official Powell Harness Bar Thread
06-11-2015, 03:48 PM
#81
yeah if you didnt install it correctly .... you need to put all 6 middle bar bolts in at the same time (3 on each side).
you cant do one side then the other cuz it pulls the car out of proportion. It helps if you have someone in the car holding it.
start the 3 bolts in on the one side, then move to the other side. Now you have all 6 in but very loosely just enough to hold the bar up so your hands are free.
Now i did 1 turn on the left, 1 turn on the right, then back to bolt #2 on the left, #2 on the right and so forth until they were all torqued down... a bit tedious ... hell yeah but my doors close perfectly.
you cant do one side then the other cuz it pulls the car out of proportion. It helps if you have someone in the car holding it.
start the 3 bolts in on the one side, then move to the other side. Now you have all 6 in but very loosely just enough to hold the bar up so your hands are free.
Now i did 1 turn on the left, 1 turn on the right, then back to bolt #2 on the left, #2 on the right and so forth until they were all torqued down... a bit tedious ... hell yeah but my doors close perfectly.
06-11-2015, 08:01 PM
#82
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Thanks yellowsupercharged06. Another couple of questions. I have TC seats in my LSJ. I am guessing that a 4 point harness would work best can some people recommend what would work? I imagine that the lap part would bold into the seat belt bolts?
Thanks in advance!
Thanks in advance!
06-12-2015, 09:28 AM
#83
again im so **** its not even funny lol .... i would not run anything other than stock seat belts if you can not run a 5 or 6 pt harness. I have the stock belts still in my car and use them with R100's for safety reasons. I feel the stock belts are safer than a 4 pt harness.
The other thing that kind of scares me is having a harness with a recline-able seat.
The other thing that kind of scares me is having a harness with a recline-able seat.
06-12-2015, 09:45 AM
#84
again im so **** its not even funny lol .... i would not run anything other than stock seat belts if you can not run a 5 or 6 pt harness. I have the stock belts still in my car and use them with R100's for safety reasons. I feel the stock belts are safer than a 4 pt harness.
The other thing that kind of scares me is having a harness with a recline-able seat.
The other thing that kind of scares me is having a harness with a recline-able seat.
Being an engineer, and not being able to test the crash worthiness of a 4 point harness or other change to the vehicles systems would leave an uneasy feeling in my gut.
06-12-2015, 10:06 AM
#85
yeah ive seen plenty of videos and read plenty of info on racing sites showing the difference between the 4 pt and 5/6 to keep myself away from a 4 pt.
And if Fidget has LNF seats i wouldnt run anything other than oem seatbelts due to the layout of the stock seats.
And if Fidget has LNF seats i wouldnt run anything other than oem seatbelts due to the layout of the stock seats.
06-12-2015, 10:23 AM
#86
yeah ive seen plenty of videos and read plenty of info on racing sites showing the difference between the 4 pt and 5/6 to keep myself away from a 4 pt.
And if Fidget has LNF seats i wouldnt run anything other than oem seatbelts due to the layout of the stock seats.
And if Fidget has LNF seats i wouldnt run anything other than oem seatbelts due to the layout of the stock seats.
Didnt listen. I guess it looks all fast and furious and stuff so that's cooler than safety.
06-12-2015, 02:16 PM
#89
A 4 point "rollbar" is not necessarily unsafe. It all comes down to installation. A properly fabricated/boxed out rollbar is fine. The issues come from cages that bolt into the floorpan and punch through in the event of a serious crash/rollover. Like Alan said, its more about how its installed than just being a 4 point.
If you are concerned with safety, a harness bar is fine for a normal collision. In the event of a rollover, you are actually at greater risk of injury with a harness on. The harness and seats hold you perfectly upright, and if the roof collapses in a rollover, you are stuck stationary with the roof mashing into your head. The factory 3 point harness lets your body fold down to the side and hopefully avoid a serious spinal injury in a rollover. I'll wait for someone to say "how often are you going to actually be in a rollover?!?!", but it only takes one.
The only reason I haven't gotten a harness bar is for what was stated above. I would only feel "safe" with a proper 4 point+ installation when using harnesses. That being said, it is a very slippery slope. A "proper" rollbar needs to be within a certain distance of the back of the seat (i believe 8 inches but im not sure). SFI padding is meant to be mashed with a helmet, not your skull. While better than the bare bar, the padding doesn't necessarily make it safe. At that point the airbags are next to useless, and can actually do more harm than good. Basically if you want to pull the safety card, its all or nothing. Either keep the full factory restrain system, or go full racecar with a cage/rollbar with padding, proper seats, a helmet, and airbag delete at minimum. haha which is why I don't have either
There are always trade offs to safety when building a street car, and there will always be risks to take. The problem is the question of where do you draw the line? I am in no way bashing this product, as it is fantastic. My only issue is that in the event of a serious rollover, you would be in some real trouble.
EDIT: I Just realized you were referring to 4 vs 5-6point harnesses, not rollbar/cage. Understanding>me. But yes, you want an anti-submarine belt if you run a harness
If you are concerned with safety, a harness bar is fine for a normal collision. In the event of a rollover, you are actually at greater risk of injury with a harness on. The harness and seats hold you perfectly upright, and if the roof collapses in a rollover, you are stuck stationary with the roof mashing into your head. The factory 3 point harness lets your body fold down to the side and hopefully avoid a serious spinal injury in a rollover. I'll wait for someone to say "how often are you going to actually be in a rollover?!?!", but it only takes one.
The only reason I haven't gotten a harness bar is for what was stated above. I would only feel "safe" with a proper 4 point+ installation when using harnesses. That being said, it is a very slippery slope. A "proper" rollbar needs to be within a certain distance of the back of the seat (i believe 8 inches but im not sure). SFI padding is meant to be mashed with a helmet, not your skull. While better than the bare bar, the padding doesn't necessarily make it safe. At that point the airbags are next to useless, and can actually do more harm than good. Basically if you want to pull the safety card, its all or nothing. Either keep the full factory restrain system, or go full racecar with a cage/rollbar with padding, proper seats, a helmet, and airbag delete at minimum. haha which is why I don't have either
There are always trade offs to safety when building a street car, and there will always be risks to take. The problem is the question of where do you draw the line? I am in no way bashing this product, as it is fantastic. My only issue is that in the event of a serious rollover, you would be in some real trouble.
EDIT: I Just realized you were referring to 4 vs 5-6point harnesses, not rollbar/cage. Understanding>me. But yes, you want an anti-submarine belt if you run a harness
Last edited by 07blackg5; 06-12-2015 at 02:28 PM.
06-12-2015, 02:41 PM
#90
A 4 point "rollbar" is not necessarily unsafe. It all comes down to installation. A properly fabricated/boxed out rollbar is fine. The issues come from cages that bolt into the floorpan and punch through in the event of a serious crash/rollover. Like Alan said, its more about how its installed than just being a 4 point.
If you are concerned with safety, a harness bar is fine for a normal collision. In the event of a rollover, you are actually at greater risk of injury with a harness on. The harness and seats hold you perfectly upright, and if the roof collapses in a rollover, you are stuck stationary with the roof mashing into your head. The factory 3 point harness lets your body fold down to the side and hopefully avoid a serious spinal injury in a rollover. I'll wait for someone to say "how often are you going to actually be in a rollover?!?!", but it only takes one.
The only reason I haven't gotten a harness bar is for what was stated above. I would only feel "safe" with a proper 4 point+ installation when using harnesses. That being said, it is a very slippery slope. A "proper" rollbar needs to be within a certain distance of the back of the seat (i believe 8 inches but im not sure). SFI padding is meant to be mashed with a helmet, not your skull. While better than the bare bar, the padding doesn't necessarily make it safe. At that point the airbags are next to useless, and can actually do more harm than good. Basically if you want to pull the safety card, its all or nothing. Either keep the full factory restrain system, or go full racecar with a cage/rollbar with padding, proper seats, a helmet, and airbag delete at minimum. haha which is why I don't have either
There are always trade offs to safety when building a street car, and there will always be risks to take. The problem is the question of where do you draw the line? I am in no way bashing this product, as it is fantastic. My only issue is that in the event of a serious rollover, you would be in some real trouble.
EDIT: I Just realized you were referring to 4 vs 5-6point harnesses, not rollbar/cage. Understanding>me. But yes, you want an anti-submarine belt if you run a harness
If you are concerned with safety, a harness bar is fine for a normal collision. In the event of a rollover, you are actually at greater risk of injury with a harness on. The harness and seats hold you perfectly upright, and if the roof collapses in a rollover, you are stuck stationary with the roof mashing into your head. The factory 3 point harness lets your body fold down to the side and hopefully avoid a serious spinal injury in a rollover. I'll wait for someone to say "how often are you going to actually be in a rollover?!?!", but it only takes one.
The only reason I haven't gotten a harness bar is for what was stated above. I would only feel "safe" with a proper 4 point+ installation when using harnesses. That being said, it is a very slippery slope. A "proper" rollbar needs to be within a certain distance of the back of the seat (i believe 8 inches but im not sure). SFI padding is meant to be mashed with a helmet, not your skull. While better than the bare bar, the padding doesn't necessarily make it safe. At that point the airbags are next to useless, and can actually do more harm than good. Basically if you want to pull the safety card, its all or nothing. Either keep the full factory restrain system, or go full racecar with a cage/rollbar with padding, proper seats, a helmet, and airbag delete at minimum. haha which is why I don't have either
There are always trade offs to safety when building a street car, and there will always be risks to take. The problem is the question of where do you draw the line? I am in no way bashing this product, as it is fantastic. My only issue is that in the event of a serious rollover, you would be in some real trouble.
EDIT: I Just realized you were referring to 4 vs 5-6point harnesses, not rollbar/cage. Understanding>me. But yes, you want an anti-submarine belt if you run a harness
Good point about the rollover risk.
06-12-2015, 03:01 PM
#91
hahaha at 07blackg5 lmao ... i read the first sentence and the last one of your post its all good though.
As to Arms post, the points are very important as to their position and angle at which the belt is being anchored. Along with the location of mounting points, the 5/6 pt harnesses have the anti-submarine straps that go between your legs ... here are a few good things i have found explaining it for everyone.
6 Things You Need to Consider Before Buying Harnesses - OG Racing Blog
Using 5 and 6 point harnesses with reclining seats ( not trying to push a non vendor .. they just have some good info on this page concerning the seat)
http://www.schrothracing.com/sdocs/2...structions.pdf
As to Arms post, the points are very important as to their position and angle at which the belt is being anchored. Along with the location of mounting points, the 5/6 pt harnesses have the anti-submarine straps that go between your legs ... here are a few good things i have found explaining it for everyone.
6 Things You Need to Consider Before Buying Harnesses - OG Racing Blog
Using 5 and 6 point harnesses with reclining seats ( not trying to push a non vendor .. they just have some good info on this page concerning the seat)
http://www.schrothracing.com/sdocs/2...structions.pdf
06-12-2015, 07:45 PM
#93
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Thanks guys. The reason that I want a harness is for the times that I go to the track to do some road racing. I would never use the harness for street driving only the stock seat belt. Everyone points are valid. I also own a helmet for when I do go to the track.
LOL at 07blackg5. No worries. If I was going to install a roll bar I would make sure that it would be designed built and installed by a professional.
With that being said has anyone installed a harness using TC seats? If so what brand? EMAC X 61 It looks like your harnesses are 4 pt but I could be mistaken.
LOL at 07blackg5. No worries. If I was going to install a roll bar I would make sure that it would be designed built and installed by a professional.
With that being said has anyone installed a harness using TC seats? If so what brand? EMAC X 61 It looks like your harnesses are 4 pt but I could be mistaken.
06-12-2015, 08:51 PM
#94
Finally got my harness bar. Huge thanks to John Powell and Andrew C. I was getting annoyed with the install as it did not align right. After reading instructions and receiving 1 piece of vital info. Went in smooth. Next is 4 point harness and seat install
06-13-2015, 08:01 AM
#95
Official Powell Harness Bar Thread
Originally Posted by Bass_Waves
Finally got my harness bar. Huge thanks to John Powell and Andrew C. I was getting annoyed with the install as it did not align right. After reading instructions and receiving 1 piece of vital info. Went in smooth. Next is 4 point harness and seat install
What seats are u going with? FYI johns seat brackets for sparco seats are bad ass i have a set.
Originally Posted by Fidget
Thanks guys. The reason that I want a harness is for the times that I go to the track to do some road racing. I would never use the harness for street driving only the stock seat belt. Everyone points are valid. I also own a helmet for when I do go to the track.
LOL at 07blackg5. No worries. If I was going to install a roll bar I would make sure that it would be designed built and installed by a professional.
With that being said has anyone installed a harness using TC seats? If so what brand? EMAC X 61 It looks like your harnesses are 4 pt but I could be mistaken.
LOL at 07blackg5. No worries. If I was going to install a roll bar I would make sure that it would be designed built and installed by a professional.
With that being said has anyone installed a harness using TC seats? If so what brand? EMAC X 61 It looks like your harnesses are 4 pt but I could be mistaken.
