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Old 06-04-2009, 08:57 PM
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Holy Crap, look what I started...lol.

So I read someone say do the 3 body groups; legs, front and back upper body.

So which muscles would each goup cover?
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Old 06-04-2009, 09:01 PM
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ive been focusing on my arms, been at it for like 3 months now, they must be really out of shape, cause only my triceps show definition
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Old 06-04-2009, 10:09 PM
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ok i got a few i need to ask about. i went to gnc today. im already takeing whey protein (1 scoop 30 mins before and 1 after work out) everyone here is takeing nano vapor and loveing it so i grabed the 4pack bottles of it. then i asked the guy at the counter what he recomended that i take for a weight loss/ toneing up. he told me try primal drol 4000. anyone heard of it. i bought it but still not 100% sure on it. im not going to start it right away but anyone ever try it?
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Old 06-05-2009, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Ducky22287 View Post
Holy Crap, look what I started...lol.

So I read someone say do the 3 body groups; legs, front and back upper body.

So which muscles would each goup cover?
That doesn't make any sense, because that would make me think you would do chest, biceps, shoulders one day, then triceps and back the next...?

Legs
Chest/triceps
day off
Back/biceps
shoulders/abs
day off

That is a standard schedule to start on, very simple and effective.
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Old 06-05-2009, 02:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Ducky22287 View Post
Holy Crap, look what I started...lol.

So I read someone say do the 3 body groups; legs, front and back upper body.

So which muscles would each goup cover?
chest/back/legs its good to work triceps on chest day, biceps on back days and shoulders on leg days.

Originally Posted by silver187666 View Post
ive been focusing on my arms, been at it for like 3 months now, they must be really out of shape, cause only my triceps show definition
dont focus on arms, most new lifters want to start there because it is the only muscle the can sorta see right now... work on a strong chest/back/legs and the arms will come along.

Originally Posted by nosepressthebox View Post
That doesn't make any sense, because that would make me think you would do chest, biceps, shoulders one day, then triceps and back the next...?

Legs
Chest/triceps
day off
Back/biceps
shoulders/abs
day off

That is a standard schedule to start on, very simple and effective.
shoulders arent a major muscle group... ab's, calves, and forearms can be worked everyday.
your are on the right track but you just need to combine you legs and shoulders(i know it makes for a pretty long workout, but no pain no gain)
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Old 06-05-2009, 04:38 AM
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This is in response to the people who ACTUALLY know what they're talking about here, because I don't feel like discussing what people should already know. There's a lot of dietetical and physiological information when it comes to exercise science.

First it's good to see someone cleared up that whole creatine ADP-ATP issue because that was driving me crazy reading it. Also in reality most studies have shown that creatine has VERY POSITIVE effects on the human cardiovascular system (i wont' elaborate)

Second in regards to caloric intake, those numbers are very misleading from rainmaker... because obvoiusly you'd have to be using an illegal substance to be benefitting from anything remotely that high. It would also depend on your metabolic rate, and whether you're endo or ectomorphic. Some guys need a lot of food, some don't, but regardless that's entirely too much. You'd have to eat RIDICULOUSLY clean to see benefit from that amount. And recommending HGH as plausably safe to anyone over 26? Haha seriously? Most studies have shown it would really only be benefitial for falling test levels in roughly your 50's. Anything other than that and you're simply disrupting the natural development of a perfectly working human body.

Too many bodybuilders get concerned with looks, then regret it later down the road. The main goal should be to look good while still maintaining good health.

Also when you're at the gym, I wouldn't recommend letting your workout extend past 50 minutes if you can, so isolating indivdual muscle groups daily is ideal. However, in the real world we don't want to be obsessed and in the gym 5 days a week, so try to group your muscles and cut it as close to that as possible. The science behind that is if you plan on maintaining a low % bodyfat, your cortosol levels shoot up rapidly after that timeframe so you're essentially defeating the purpose of being at the gym. I always drop my weight after 50 minutes, if I'm done or not.

that's all i can think of right now. I didn't read this whole thread so sorry if i repeated anything
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Old 06-05-2009, 08:09 AM
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holy **** that nano vapor. i feel like i can go lift a ******* truck and im still wanting to work out. im so pumped right now worked out for 50mins. lifted 10lbs more then i normaly do on all my exercises
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Old 06-05-2009, 08:48 AM
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I didn't read this whole thread so I hope I don't repeat any thing.

I've been competing at Natural bodybuilding for 6 years now and training for nearly 10 and have seen and used a host of different products. For the most part in my experience most supplements are lots of sugar or stimulents and very little beneficial additives. Basically now I just use the pure different amino acids. I will take a multivitamin, beta alanine in the morning with l-glutamine. Creatine (purple k), beta alanine, and l-arginine pre worout. Creatine and protein right after a workout and l-glutamine before bed. Also take omega369 pills 3times daily. I make sure I get at least 6 25gram servings of protein from different sources(ie tuna,shakes, egg whites,chicken etc) throughout the day.
I eat 6 med size high protein low carb meals a day. I get most of my carbs from fruit and veg and none from breads, pastas etc. I avoid milk and milk prod, milk however high in protein and vitamins makes your skin thicker because of the lactose fat.
I train 6 days a week doing no cardio and all weighs. I super set my workout to keep my pulse up so i don't need to do the cardio.
Someone on here commented on using hgh and such. HGH and steroids are a great product if you want to inject yourself with illegal drugs, lose your hair and *****, compromise your health (kinda defeats the whole purpose of going to a gym) and in the end look like a total ******* douche. PERIOD.
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Old 06-05-2009, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by PimpLay2 View Post
ima small guy came out of highschool weighing 125.... i take all GNC products ( amplified wheyobolic extreme, amplified creatine pills) and i weighed 142 after 8 days of lifting ...... the main muscle builder is the Wheyobolic protein

i lift everyday and do about 5-6 reps but very heavy weight...... i went from benching 205 to 255 in about 2 weeks.. so in my case they work !!!!!
GNC is a ripoff man, look online. Most of the time I find the same products for half the price

Originally Posted by bamaarmyman19 View Post
ok i got a few i need to ask about. i went to gnc today. im already takeing whey protein (1 scoop 30 mins before and 1 after work out) everyone here is takeing nano vapor and loveing it so i grabed the 4pack bottles of it. then i asked the guy at the counter what he recomended that i take for a weight loss/ toneing up. he told me try primal drol 4000. anyone heard of it. i bought it but still not 100% sure on it. im not going to start it right away but anyone ever try it?
nanovapor is good but be careful, it made me shake after a while

Originally Posted by cblt12 View Post
chest/back/legs its good to work triceps on chest day, biceps on back days and shoulders on leg days.


dont focus on arms, most new lifters want to start there because it is the only muscle the can sorta see right now... work on a strong chest/back/legs and the arms will come along.


shoulders arent a major muscle group... ab's, calves, and forearms can be worked everyday.
your are on the right track but you just need to combine you legs and shoulders(i know it makes for a pretty long workout, but no pain no gain)
Good call

Originally Posted by BigEMU1 View Post
This is in response to the people who ACTUALLY know what they're talking about here, because I don't feel like discussing what people should already know. There's a lot of dietetical and physiological information when it comes to exercise science.

First it's good to see someone cleared up that whole creatine ADP-ATP issue because that was driving me crazy reading it. Also in reality most studies have shown that creatine has VERY POSITIVE effects on the human cardiovascular system (i wont' elaborate)

Second in regards to caloric intake, those numbers are very misleading from rainmaker... because obvoiusly you'd have to be using an illegal substance to be benefitting from anything remotely that high. It would also depend on your metabolic rate, and whether you're endo or ectomorphic. Some guys need a lot of food, some don't, but regardless that's entirely too much. You'd have to eat RIDICULOUSLY clean to see benefit from that amount. And recommending HGH as plausably safe to anyone over 26? Haha seriously? Most studies have shown it would really only be benefitial for falling test levels in roughly your 50's. Anything other than that and you're simply disrupting the natural development of a perfectly working human body.
I did not say everyone had to eat that much, I said I had to eat that much. I am on no illegal substances just very fast motabolism. I can eat 3500 calories a day and shread weight. Every individual has to play with the numbers to get what works for them. But I have seen most people need to consume about 4500 a day to really see any gains.

and males peak in natural HGH at like 19, from there its all down hill. I did not say it was completely safe to take it at 26 but that is what I have seen as the earliest advised people can take it.

Originally Posted by Flatgod View Post
Someone on here commented on using hgh and such. HGH and steroids are a great product if you want to inject yourself with illegal drugs, lose your hair and *****, compromise your health (kinda defeats the whole purpose of going to a gym) and in the end look like a total ******* douche. PERIOD.
Could not be more wrong. Both HGH and anabolic steroids are very safe under two circumstances, first that they are clean and free from any impurities. and second that you take them very carefully and regulate them very strictly.

First dont take roids from anyone other than a trained medical professional. Which you would have to go to Europe to find one who was willing to do so.

Its all in the regulation, Steroids are nothing more than Testosterone so when you take them your body does not produce as much, now if you dont regulate then you body stoppes producing testosterone and your testicules shrink and become worthless.

BUT if you regulate it and cycle it correctly then your body continues to produce it and you see no adverse affects.

Now on to HGH, once again same two requirements, but what most people dont understand is that HGH is not allways illegal. There are natural forms of it that come from plants. I think the root is called Dopamine or somehting liek that but it containes a natural form of HGH that is not quite as strong or potent as that which is produced in your body, but can still help. You can buy products with this for of HGH, OVER THE COUNTER.

Now as I stated above for lifters under 30 there is really no reason to take either, because your body is on full production of both and taking them can have negative effects, but once people get to their late 20's and up they are seeing lots of SAFE results.

Just because your on HGH or roids does not mean your sticking a needle in your leg 6 times a day and roid raging.

Doctors in europe proscribe anabolic steroids to those they feel its safe for. The reason we cant do that here in America is becaue people here are far more apt to abuse things like drugs, alcohol, and HGH/Steroids.

Educate yourself before saying its all bad.
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Old 06-05-2009, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by cblt12 View Post
chest/back/legs its good to work triceps on chest day, biceps on back days and shoulders on leg days.


dont focus on arms, most new lifters want to start there because it is the only muscle the can sorta see right now... work on a strong chest/back/legs and the arms will come along.


shoulders arent a major muscle group... ab's, calves, and forearms can be worked everyday.
your are on the right track but you just need to combine you legs and shoulders(i know it makes for a pretty long workout, but no pain no gain)
You are right, the only thing is you can put a lot of stress on your shoulders if you aren't careful what days you work them. The routine I posted allows you do have a day of a rest and a day of legs after doing your shoulders, so that you don't over strain them. If you do shoulders too close to chest or back days, you risk injury to your deltoids, rotator cuffs, labrum etc.

Yeah you can do abs every other day, but I found that if I do them once every rotation, I do a much better ab workout. If I do it every other day, I'm already tired by the time I do them, and I half ass it. Remember that that routine was for someone who was just starting lifting.
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Old 06-05-2009, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by nosepressthebox View Post
You are right, the only thing is you can put a lot of stress on your shoulders if you aren't careful what days you work them. The routine I posted allows you do have a day of a rest and a day of legs after doing your shoulders, so that you don't over strain them. If you do shoulders too close to chest or back days, you risk injury to your deltoids, rotator cuffs, labrum etc.

Yeah you can do abs every other day, but I found that if I do them once every rotation, I do a much better ab workout. If I do it every other day, I'm already tired by the time I do them, and I half ass it. Remember that that routine was for someone who was just starting lifting.
rue story, when you do things like bench press, and other pressing chest moves you are working your shoulders some
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Old 06-05-2009, 12:30 PM
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Now what is a good way to do reps?
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Old 06-05-2009, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Ducky22287 View Post
Now what is a good way to do reps?
it all depends on your expierence and your goals.

for a new lifter I would spend a full year doing low weight high reps 12-14. this will strengthern your tendons and ligimates.

other than that it is generally acceptable that low weight high reps will tone.

and high weight low reps will build more
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Old 06-05-2009, 01:38 PM
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Well I am currently 5' 9.5" about 195 lbs. I have a year to become a buff, trained, cardio god. AKA Be ready for Marine Corps boot camp. I'd like to be 170-175 lbs @ 7% body fat. To start, every other day, I go to the gym, and do ass loads of situps, I bench, do curls, triceps, back (for pull ups), and EVERYDAY I run at least 2 miles. Once 2 miles becomes easier, I'll go to 3 miles, and so forth. My recruiter said, I'll be ready for boot camp when I can do at least 8-10 pull ups, and can run 4 miles in 30-35 minutes. I started training on Monday. My legs hate me right now

I'm also on a high protein, low fat diet.
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Old 06-05-2009, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Blown 4-banger View Post
Well I am currently 5' 9.5" about 195 lbs. I have a year to become a buff, trained, cardio god. AKA Be ready for Marine Corps boot camp. I'd like to be 170-175 lbs @ 7% body fat. To start, every other day, I go to the gym, and do ass loads of situps, I bench, do curls, triceps, back (for pull ups), and EVERYDAY I run at least 2 miles. Once 2 miles becomes easier, I'll go to 3 miles, and so forth. My recruiter said, I'll be ready for boot camp when I can do at least 8-10 pull ups, and can run 4 miles in 30-35 minutes. I started training on Monday. My legs hate me right now

I'm also on a high protein, low fat diet.
for BCT you dont need to be buff. you should train endurance more than anything else.

I reccomend P90X. it will tear you up trust me
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Old 06-05-2009, 01:57 PM
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yes... yes it will lol. take his adv on that
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Old 06-05-2009, 01:57 PM
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Hey everyone one. Im going to start getting in shape. I hate the way my body looks and the sad thing is im depressed about it. I have a home gym in my basement. I have some questions tho. My diet is really bad. I'm addicted to soda like no tomorrow (case a day) and I eat burgers like every night and eat snack food all the time. Whats a good alt for this stuff? I love vitamin water but I hear that its bad because of all the sugar in it. Right now I'm turning 20 next month and am 6'5 around 255 lb and barely any muscle. Any tips will help.
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Old 06-05-2009, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by hinow41 View Post
Hey everyone one. Im going to start getting in shape. I hate the way my body looks and the sad thing is im depressed about it. I have a home gym in my basement. I have some questions tho. My diet is really bad. I'm addicted to soda like no tomorrow (case a day) and I eat burgers like every night and eat snack food all the time. Whats a good alt for this stuff? I love vitamin water but I hear that its bad because of all the sugar in it. Right now I'm turning 20 next month and am 6'5 around 255 lb and barely any muscle. Any tips will help.
start running and stope eating/ drinking that stuff.

I know it sucks, I am the same way, I was literally addicted to colas and sodas of all kinds. I fight every day with it.

but once you get off of it you will feel so much better.

Look for healthy alternatives I personally like quiznos and they are pretty healthy.

Look up a beginner workout that is complient with your workout equeptment.

I think the best thing a new lifter can do is start working out with someone who is already working out.

Once you start it saturates your life and becomes habit, if you can find someone to go with that is already set in routine then you can have someone tto push you.
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Old 06-05-2009, 02:43 PM
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I Just got done doing a little 30min work out and I can already feel it in my arms. I drank my last soda at 10 am and now its going to be just water. As for finding someone to work out with I really don't have anyone. Im just going to push my self mind over matter. What do you guys eat? I like salad and subway but I don't have the money to get subway everyday. What are some good snacks? Im going to start doing the hole 6 little health meals.
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Old 06-05-2009, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by the_rainmaker View Post
for BCT you dont need to be buff. you should train endurance more than anything else.

I reccomend P90X. it will tear you up trust me
Yeah, but I wanna be buff too. Helps get the chickas
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Old 06-05-2009, 02:54 PM
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where you going to bct at?
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Old 06-05-2009, 02:56 PM
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San Diego
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Old 06-05-2009, 07:26 PM
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Rainmaker, I will agree with you that in not all cases HGH and roids are bad. I will not ever condone them for the sole purpose of gaining mass and getting bigger/stronger. People that use roids for those reasons are no different then anorexic people just that their mental condition is the polar opposite.
Also it is correct that a person in good health that is strictly monitored by a doctor can properly cycle steroids. However I would venture to guess that nearly 100% of people that use illegal steroids do neither. Beyond having a medical condition that require one to use prescribed drugs there is no reason whatsoever for a person to use steroids or HGH. Other than having a mental self image problem.

Or because they are a failure at life and need to use them to compete with me, a natural bodybuilder.LOL
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Old 06-06-2009, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by the_rainmaker View Post
I did not say everyone had to eat that much, I said I had to eat that much. I am on no illegal substances just very fast motabolism. I can eat 3500 calories a day and shread weight. Every individual has to play with the numbers to get what works for them. But I have seen most people need to consume about 4500 a day to really see any gains.

and males peak in natural HGH at like 19, from there its all down hill. I did not say it was completely safe to take it at 26 but that is what I have seen as the earliest advised people can take it.



Could not be more wrong. Both HGH and anabolic steroids are very safe under two circumstances, first that they are clean and free from any impurities. and second that you take them very carefully and regulate them very strictly.

First dont take roids from anyone other than a trained medical professional. Which you would have to go to Europe to find one who was willing to do so.

Its all in the regulation, Steroids are nothing more than Testosterone so when you take them your body does not produce as much, now if you dont regulate then you body stoppes producing testosterone and your testicules shrink and become worthless.

BUT if you regulate it and cycle it correctly then your body continues to produce it and you see no adverse affects.

Now on to HGH, once again same two requirements, but what most people dont understand is that HGH is not allways illegal. There are natural forms of it that come from plants. I think the root is called Dopamine or somehting liek that but it containes a natural form of HGH that is not quite as strong or potent as that which is produced in your body, but can still help. You can buy products with this for of HGH, OVER THE COUNTER.

Now as I stated above for lifters under 30 there is really no reason to take either, because your body is on full production of both and taking them can have negative effects, but once people get to their late 20's and up they are seeing lots of SAFE results.

Just because your on HGH or roids does not mean your sticking a needle in your leg 6 times a day and roid raging.

Doctors in europe proscribe anabolic steroids to those they feel its safe for. The reason we cant do that here in America is becaue people here are far more apt to abuse things like drugs, alcohol, and HGH/Steroids.

Educate yourself before saying its all bad.
Wait. Males peak at age 19 you say? I find that an interesting statement considering roughly 90% of men are actually still growing well past that age, at their HGH levels are still very much active. The typical age for ending male growth is 25, but that's just adding more to your complete list of useless and even incorrect information in this thread. Maybe it's "peaked" but that's usless information considernig HGH levels are still HIGHLY active.

I'm thinking you're referencing the hormonal shift in testosterone. Which would obviously be the goal of HGH as a recreational supplement in the first place. Which would make anyone taking it an idiot. Do you not understand the basic functions of your natural pituitary? Why would you to throw unneccesary amounts of HGH to expand the size of your muscles when your heart, your organs, and every other essential part of your body come with it, and risk premmature failure?

Once again, for anyone reading, human growth hormone therapy has only shown to be benefitial later in life, when growth cycles are being reversed and testosterone levels are dropping at rapid decline. That's modern medicine. Not some pathetic, vain, bodybuilders science.

So I suggest to you, that YOU educate yourself. You've heard entirely too much from the grapevine. It's best to discover these things yourself if you're seriously not considering the severe rammifications. I'm not trying to pick on you, it just seems this is something people should understand because it's disturbing to hear about how many kids have completely ruined their lives with some of these supplements.

Also, there is no "over the counter" HGH. You can't digest HGH. Really it's as simple as that. If it's not an injection it's not HGH.

About the whole caloric intake issue, no, most people do not need to consume that much. Maybe the hardest of a hard gainer. It's about protein intake, not calories. The food gets your the protein for your muscles. You don't need that many calories to sustain appropriate energy levels to metabolize that protein properly. Just enough carbs to aid it, along with the other essentials.

In regards to anabolic steroids, yes, you WILL see a drop in your test levels even with the most advanced regulation. In Post Cycle Therapy, you can attempt correct these problems, but your natural hormone cycle will have shifted during the cycle, which is not good on your body.

Oh and let's not forget the oh so attractive receeding hairline you will be adding to the vainty repertoire. Better pick up a Hair Club For Men membership along with that YMCA pass.

I will however, say, in the defense of steroids that they're a lot safer IF USED IN ABSOLUTE MODERATION. Sometimes when I see the cycles people are taking it's completely ridiculous for what they're trying to achieve. But the odds of most people taking it safely are slim to none, and it's certainly something I'm not willing to risk. There's a good CNN report on demystifying steroids if you want to search.

But if you do go option 2, read up. I guarantee you, Jimmy the Bodybuilder (who knows somebody that knows somebody) doesn't know jack **** about steroids or cycling properly. Read up yourself, and keep it extremely regulated and in moderation.
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Old 06-06-2009, 12:36 PM
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^^bingo^^

Educate yourself

http://www.steroid.com/side.php

This is a pro steroid site. Disregard the moron in the video he literally says nothing of any merit, just read the article . Even though the article is trying to put steroids in a positive light, it fails miserably. In it every myth about steroid use is confirmed. Testicular atrophy, liver damage, high cholesterol, breast development, acne, roid rage, cardiovascular problems, hair loss, stunted growth, prostate enlargement, high blood pressure, kidney problems, immune system problems and sterility. These are some of the great rewards one may reap from the use of non prescription illegal steroids.

I personally have had two close friends use steroids and find out the great benefits. One went into insulin shock from over use. The other used hgh and roids and now suffers from erectile dysfunction and need Viagira to get it up. His wife also divorced him due to his erratic and violent mood swings when he was using. Both before age 28. Awesome. The real sad thing is they were both in supreme shape and just got suckered in by all the bullshit claims of the people that push these drugs.

There is no safe way to recreationally use steroids or HGH.

Last edited by Flatgod; 06-06-2009 at 01:18 PM.
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