well i'm all into options and i've taken a liking to the idea of running a little spray. i've found in my research that nitrous and f/i are not all that differnt end result wise. i know there may be arguments related to my statement but i could care less.

that being said my baby is all about daily driving. although a 2.2 turbo seems to be the best route i want to go NA on this car as i wont be needing constant boost all the time. i want a daily driven weekend warrior. as that is the case what engine and tranny mods am i looking at that will give me a quick but overall durable setup.

the durability of course has to do with the addition of spray. i'm most certainly getting a wet kit soon and will be running a 35 shot to break myself in. my goal is to safely run a 100 shot without worry of the engine componets breaking down prematurely.

halfcent i know you got some advise for a brotha' please do speak up. i'm not looking to break the bank but i will not put cheap shit in my car.

Not A Bad Idea, How Much For The The Wet Kit?

haven't priced kits yet. looking for more info at the moment. i'll take the time tomorrow(later today) to actually search for a good kit at a good price.

edit: well, started looking and a complete setup is just over $1000 and gets you 35-50-75 shot with the NX wet kit, so that's up to 75hp give or take.:cssNET: that setup also includes the purge system, bottle warmer and other very useful goodies. i'm sorry but you can't beat that with a charger of any kind.:poke: just playing with you ss/sc onwers out there. if you want just the wet kit its around $600 and still gives you up to 75hp. i'm all in on this one.




edited for content

well good luck with that, let us know how it goes, your tranny should hold fine as well as the engine up to 100 shot not holding it in for more than 10 seconds, youll probably wanna invest in a few gauges mainly air/fuel ratio to make sure you dont run lean at any time, possibly bigger injectors for when you get up to that 100 shot as well as some other type of fuel mods , you have a good exhaust and intake already so you should be set

a/f isn't going to do a damn thing, the fuel isn't adjustable on a nitrous kit, it's fixed via jets. a vaccuum gauge is going to be more helpful to meter what if any damage you may have incurred.

your stock injectors should still be fine with the 100 shot, as would the fuel pump. if anything you could go with a piggyback controller to richen things up for peace of mind, but I honestly don't think that would be an issue. what you would need to consider is timing control at that large of a shot. timing is pretty coservative as it is now, but you still may want to pull a few degrees when it comes to running a 100 shot

where are you getting your pricing for everything? I think I estimated around 1100 at first, but spent about 800 total if that on my install.

def pull the timing a lil if need be and for sure run some colder plugs.

def pull the timing a lil if need be and for sure run some colder plugs.

+1

I might have left that out bymistake in a PM to him, thanks for bringing that up. I'd go at least 2 steps colder and close the gap quite a bit. you guys are gapped stock to .045 also right?

.04 or .045 something like that.

i got the pricing between some unknown website (forgot it was late), gravana, and cobalt-addiction. i know i can a killer deal sooner or later but i wanted to get an idea of what i would be working with.

i was hoping by the time i get going on all this the unichip reflash or a similar product would be out. wishful thinking i know but hey a nigga can dream cant he. anyway back to business. from the sounds of it the stock engine/tranny can handle the load. so what about durability how long is that really gonna last?

also dont forget i am interested in a better equiped NA engine then stock so again where do i start?

I duno how 100 shot will affect internals etc. If u plan on just running juice I'd go with some forge pistons. Is there gona be a S/C or Turbo kit releasing for the 2.2's? How much would that cost and how much would a Naaawwwwwwwzz setup run you? If its more than half way to a FI kit then I'd save up for that cause that would be more reliable and usable. With the juice ur limited to short burts and the amount u have in your tank. Remember...once u run out u got nothing...NOTHING! hahah But in the end its up to you.

I say do both, FI and N2O, works for me...

I honestly don't know that much about tuning a NOS equipped car. As far as beefing up the engine, that' easy. If the day comes when you actually want to tear it open, as always, replace those rods and pistons. It just makes sense. Rods; $350. Pistons; $550. I am also a big advocate of switching to ARP head studs as well now. $125 and they are reusable, unlike bolts. Those are the 3 cheapest and easiest things to do to the inside of an Ecotec if you open it up.

running out of spray aint the issue really. i want it for the track/strip which means i wont need a lot in the first place. i dont plan on racing on the daily drive to work and while running errands. the daily driving will be covered by the NA build up which nobody seems to know much about.

i've thought this through and i have decided if i'm going turbo i will get a turbo'd car before i drop an ass-load of money to turbo this one out. that said i haven't seen any full turbo kits for the 2.2 running at $1600 to $2000, not to mention install which will throw the price way up. the nitrous i can do myself and like slowion2 stated he paid roughly $800 in all w/ install.

hey halfcent home from work? anyway i'm not building around the nos cause it will work with any setup you run i'd like to build a decent torque'y engine for my spirited daily drives and add the spray for my track days. i know you can help me build the engine i want so give up the goods bro, i need knowledge.

how long can we handle the 100 shot? how is the clutch going to handle the 100 shot? that is the only thing that would bother me...a 75 shot on top of bolt ons should give you turbo numbers anyway, just not there all the time. but really, you don't need it to be.

you could run a simple wet kit for the 100 shot, but of course direct port would be the best option.

get the 2 step colder plugs, the accessories kit with the purge, bottle warmer, etc, a window switch, and an msd dis 2 and you should be all set.

Personally I'd be worried about the clutch though with a 100shot, thats a lot of torque hittin the tranny all at once. You might want to consider that an upgrade...

highest shot i would do is 75 since thats the safest and it says that in the 2.2 gm build book. i would only run a 100 shot if i had upgraded internals.

first off i dont have a clutch. maybe i should have clarified that in the first post.

for the love of god does anyone read the entire post and think through before they answer? i suppose not my original post was about a NA build up plus nitrous. only a few responses have come in relation to the build up and very little was actually mentioned as far as what to do and the possible gains.

can someone with the knowledge give me direction as where to go with this build up? is that really too much to ask? i'm looking to change cams, pistons, rods, etc to get a little more out of my 2.2 auto. does anyone have real answers or just opinions on the nitrous?

first off i dont have a clutch. maybe i should have clarified that in the first post.

for the love of god does anyone read the entire post and think through before they answer? i suppose not my original post was about a NA build up plus nitrous. only a few responses have come in relation to the build up and very little was actually mentioned as far as what to do and the possible gains.

can someone with the knowledge give me direction as where to go with this build up? is that really too much to ask? i'm looking to change cams, pistons, rods, etc to get a little more out of my 2.2 auto. does anyone have real answers or just opinions on the nitrous?

i understand the auto thing, anyway if you are dead set on making it to a 100 shot, forged pistons wouldnt be a bad idea since you will be opening the engine for a new cam anyway, get the street/strip cam but only after someone puts out a ecu for you tune fine tune with or i think the motor may run bad, also you might wanna think about a progressive nitrous setup so all that tq doesnt hit the tranny at once for durability reason make it come on slow then progressivly build up, make sure you have a blow down tube as well since tracks wont let you run without one, also to compliment it and have more power without nitrous get a header

now we're talking. keep in mind the 100 shot is way down the road. when i get the kit i'm running the 35 shot til i am satisfied with the engine build up and tune as soon as one drops.

my intent in the near future is a performance header and possible cat. at this point i like the sound of a high flow cat but are they emissions legal? i will be getting the wet kit and header around then same time and going with the 35 shot until i can get a tune.

I guess that you ll need to change yours head gasket and put something like the one sold buy turbo tech racing and put the arp studs in,in my opinion its the best way to take the 100 shots cause the stock rods can take up to 250hp and the pistons can handle 300 hp as the gm build book says.So with new gasket studs and colder plugs with the right gap you should be on your way for a 14sec pass with only the 100 shot.

I guess that you ll need to change yours head gasket and put something like the one sold buy turbo tech racing and put the arp studs in,in my opinion its the best way to take the 100 shots cause the stock rods can take up to 250hp and the pistons can handle 300 hp as the gm build book says.So with new gasket studs and colder plugs with the right gap you should be on your way for a 14sec pass with only the 100 shot.


not to be a dick, no really i mean this, but how are the studs and head gasket going to make my 2.2 a faster car. i already stated that i've gotten mostly opinions on the nitrous and this proves it. i want to make it faster without the nitrous for my daily driving. so what have you to say on making it a quicker NA car?

well my advice is this, run 35 shot until you can pickup some kind of engine managemnt that has 2 programs, 1 for n/a driving then a switch on the side for nitrous driving to get the most out of your car depending what u are doing at that time. your putting down like what 125 whp stock? 100 shot puts you at 225 whp or so maybe a lil less, the engine stock can handle that if you keep it well maintainenced

I didnt read the enitre thread. And i will soon. I just wanted to point out to you that by you wanting to go with a 35 wet shot to break yourself in is a great thing to read in my mind. I had a 13 second 76 c-10 that i raced at sears point in highschool and just out of high school. A peer of mine who hated me had a 90's mazda pickup that he would always race me with and i would KILL it every time. so he got mad and spent a ton of money on his NOS system. First time he hit the button he blew his motor. Thats why i say if you want to spray please BABY STEPS!

first off i dont have a clutch. maybe i should have clarified that in the first post.

for the love of god does anyone read the entire post and think through before they answer? i suppose not my original post was about a NA build up plus nitrous. only a few responses have come in relation to the build up and very little was actually mentioned as far as what to do and the possible gains.

can someone with the knowledge give me direction as where to go with this build up? is that really too much to ask? i'm looking to change cams, pistons, rods, etc to get a little more out of my 2.2 auto. does anyone have real answers or just opinions on the nitrous?

I'm sorry, I will hold back from posting in your threads for now on since I can't read.

i want a daily driven weekend warrior. as that is the case what engine and tranny mods am i looking at that will give me a quick but overall durable setup.

cams,header,light weight crank pully, light weight flywheel, high flow cat, and some type of tunning to get a better shifting range for your auto.

http://www.gm.com/company/gmtunersource/html/race_shop_build_book.htm

All the info you need! Just click on the stock 250hp link.

highest shot i would do is 75 since thats the safest and it says that in the 2.2 gm build book. i would only run a 100 shot if i had upgraded internals.
X 2

250 hp is the max safe hp recommended by gm, pick up a copy of the ecotec build book, its full of lots of good info. the book recommends 75 shot max.

GM did run the ecotec up to 280hp on stock internals on nitrous before the rods failed.

i personally prefer to use a progressive nitrous controller. it just makes it that much safer than throwing the large amount of extra load on the stock internals everytime you want a little kick.

I'm sorry, I will hold back from posting in your threads for now on since I can't read.


dude its not that serious. i still wanna be your friend. i just need help is all i was trying to say. didnt mean to come off wrong but i tend to speak my mind and it dont always come out in a nice manner. can you forgive a fool?

cams,header,light weight crank pully, light weight flywheel, high flow cat, and some type of tunning to get a better shifting range for your auto.


Correct me if I'm wrong but automatics don't have flywheels do they.

They have a flexplate and torque converter,which together give the flywheel effect needed. A torque converter change can make a big difference.

Correct me if I'm wrong but automatics don't have flywheels do they.

word. i was just thinking of things i was gonna do to my car so i posted them down. didnt htink it all the way through. good call out tho :twothumbs

Dosent Anybody Buy The N.o.s. Kits Any More?

so he got mad and spent a ton of money on his NOS system. First time he hit the button he blew his motor.

Thats fricken great, i'd have lughed my balls off if that happened to someone i knew.

:twothumbs for having the money to afford Nitrous, i wish i had enough cash to foot the bill for a system, I like the step up idea

its only a weeks pay........but then there are the bills and that goddamn mortgage.....uh yeah property take too. yeah its gonna be a while.

i am considering getting a sneaky-pete dry shot for my LS.....i know the SP is a minor shot, but i am just looking for a little extra here and there.....and i dont wanna fry my internals....what im asking is if any of you know how difficult it would be to install and if you have any advice on how to install it in the intake somehow so i wont have to mess with the injectors......any1 wanna lend me some advice

i am considering getting a sneaky-pete dry shot for my LS.....i know the SP is a minor shot, but i am just looking for a little extra here and there.....and i dont wanna fry my internals....what im asking is if any of you know how difficult it would be to install and if you have any advice on how to install it in the intake somehow so i wont have to mess with the injectors......any1 wanna lend me some advice


thread jacker:nono: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

i am considering getting a sneaky-pete dry shot for my LS.....i know the SP is a minor shot, but i am just looking for a little extra here and there.....and i dont wanna fry my internals....what im asking is if any of you know how difficult it would be to install and if you have any advice on how to install it in the intake somehow so i wont have to mess with the injectors......any1 wanna lend me some advice

sneaky-pete system is basicly a same set up as a regular dry shot nitrous system only that the sneaky pete has a smaller bottle that is very easily hidden and also people that hide the nitrous lines in the car so people cant see them. Not to menion the nitrous button is also hidden and not just some giant toggle switch that says NO2 like fast furious style. and if you want smaller amount of spray for like a 35 shot just buy the smaller nozzles for the intake where it shoots out of

Do what I did.

thread jacker:nono: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Come on Cowboy......you know i meant no disrespect....

You can run an OEM head gasket fine for what you're planning.

I do like the suggestion of the head studs just in case you need to pull the head more than once. They are definitely worth the money.

Stock cams would work fine, possibly look at retarding them slightly (not too much since you have an automatic and it could cause idle issues for you), but the stock grind isn't all that bad actually. If anything, get a set of stock ones reground for more duration on the exhaust side to help it breathe when you're using your nitrous.

Not every track requires a blow-down tube.

High-flow Cat would help out definitely. Legality of them depends on the state statuates for where you're at. Also the stock ECU isn't as bad as far as the tune as some are making it sound, you would be suprised. If anything get your a/f ratio either from a dyno place or by borrowing someone's wideband o2 so you can at least make sure you're not having a trend of leaning out as you pull through the powerband. There are quite a few guys with 2.2 Ions on stock tune running a minimum of a 50 shot with colder plugs gapped to .035 and there have been no problems.

Progressive controllers are great units, and most solenoids are designed to pulse (which is how the controller works), but you don't need one to run your kit. With the auto your first gear is taller as it is so it shouldn't be too bad. And for whoever mentioned it, even on a 35 shot the sudden jolt of power is going to happen, so the controller would not protect against it, just would help the holeshot.

I personally feel the Sneaky Pete system is a waste of money. You get one pass (if that) out of a bottle. Just doesn't seem worth it.

Oh and not everyone's switches look like shit :rolleyes:

Come on Cowboy......you know i meant no disrespect....


i know, but i had to :poke:

If you have a working knowledge of nitrous and kits. Just piece together your own. you'll save A LOT.

I mean look at the pieces I've bought for a small $270.
--NOS HiFlow 10lb bottle(half filled)
--ZEX nozzle
--4 jets .032-.036
--Nitrous solenoid
--Brackets
--Mainline
--Liquid filled gauge
--Remote bottle opener with three way switch

Still piecing it together to run a wet kit. Total amount for EVERYTHING off the wall guess would be $400 for me. Helps to have a buddy who is getting rid of his kit. :D Oh yeah...forgot to mention I'm picking up a whole set of jets if I can. baby steps as I saw previous posts...and plus I want to change it around some.

Iight people's..I'm new to the Nitrous shots and I'm really tryin to get some juice in my 2.2 though...If there's anything anybody can help me with please don't hold back...Tip pointers anything...

that's not bad, I only paid 500 for my kit, but it was the rest of the electronics that addes up. don't cheap out, you'll regret it later.

what exactly do you want to know damon? best tip I could give you is to read and research until you think you've done enough, and then start over. don't skimp on parts, don't "rig" stuff up, install things properly, show self control. manage all that and you'll go far.

Holy dead thread,

But to the original poster if you are still looking at doing a complete N/A build you should seriously look at all the numbers involved. Even if you only intend to do pistons, rods, and head studs you are looking at a minimum of $1000. And that number could almost double depending on who does the work.

If you are unable to do this type of work yourself, and do not have a hookup with an engine builder you could be looking at a huge labor bill. Add cams, and some head work and you see where we are going with this. Now if you have the tools and know how to this work yourself than you can really stretch a budget, so if that is the case most of what I have to say won't apply.

Add the nitrous kit on top of the pistons/rods and you could be looking at 3k or more just to do a mild N/A build and nitrous. With cams and head work you could easily drop 4-5k into this thing, with someone else doing the work.

For the same price you could go FI and have that power available all the time. If GM releases a SC kit for you guys you could even keep your warranty.

My point is that N/A builds on small 4 cyl engines are not for the budget minded enthusiast, not starting with an eco anyhow. I would personally rather spend that money setting up a nice intercooled 10 psi turbo set-up. Then if you ever want more power, just do the internals and turn up the boost.

^^With all that said,, as long as you don't surpass the 75 shot you could get away with running stock internals. That would be a really nice hp/$ setup.

But trying to push an N/A eco much beyond that is going to cost more than it is worth IMHO.

either way, these guys need a way to tune, that's the largest issue that needs to be overcome

Very true. I wonder what Hahn is doing on theirs,,, AFPR?

If HPtuners supports the cavaliers and sunfires it can only be a matter of time til the 2.2l cobalts get some love

that's what I'm hoping.

I just feel people in my situation might be screwed, the 2.2 Ions with speed density over airflow metering :(

^^I'll keep my fingers crossed for ya

haha thanks :D

that's not bad, I only paid 500 for my kit, but it was the rest of the electronics that addes up. don't cheap out, you'll regret it later.

what exactly do you want to know damon? best tip I could give you is to read and research until you think you've done enough, and then start over. don't skimp on parts, don't "rig" stuff up, install things properly, show self control. manage all that and you'll go far.


Appreciate it man...Respect!!!
Yea I do read...lmao...

if you have questions PM me here or get me online, I'll be more than happy to help you out

either way, these guys need a way to tune, that's the largest issue that needs to be overcome

Exactly. That is where my low cost kit will just turn out to be like everyone elses. Yeah I know I am getting low prices...well my friend is piecing out his kit(already have half of it and dibs on the rest) so yeah I'm using the money I saved on the electronics. Not cheaping out...and not paying TOP dollar on everything a good medium-high range is acceptable. Just good honest companies who back up their stuff 100%.

You should be able to tune all you need with jets. If you're going to go with a big shot later on I'd invest in some strong valves and possibly some forged pistons if you want it to be absolutely reliable. If you're buying a kit for your car, it should come with a sheet that tells you which jets to mix and match for the correct shot to run safely. You don't want to change your overall tune because then it'll mess with you when you're off the nitrous.

Anyway you cook it putting nitrous on your car is going to make it less reliable. Anytime you add more hp to a motor it makes it wear faster. things like your fuel pump, timing belt, motor mounts, etc are all going to feel extra stress from this.

make sure if this is the first time ur messing with nitrous that you make it as safe as possible. A WOT switch and fuel pressure cut-out switch are almost a must. Of course, since you're buying a high dollar kit, it'll more than likely come with all that stuff.

I want a RPM activation switch that way I can zero in on when I want it to turn on and shut off. It will really be shutting off WAY before redline so I don't go BOOM.

Our peek HP is @ 5600 so I may have it stop there. Since nitrous afterall gives more torque than it does hp...which is why you should try to stay out of hitting it at low speed and rpm.

ZEX has the jet calculation sheet in their online catalog. By tune I mean be at the dyno and have it watch my A/F ratio that way I can look at my gauge and get an idea of where lean for our engines is, etc. And to see how much power I make as well. :D

I want a RPM activation switch that way I can zero in on when I want it to turn on and shut off. It will really be shutting off WAY before redline so I don't go BOOM.

Our peek HP is @ 5600 so I may have it stop there. Since nitrous afterall gives more torque than it does hp...which is why you should try to stay out of hitting it at low speed and rpm.

ZEX has the jet calculation sheet in their online catalog. By tune I mean be at the dyno and have it watch my A/F ratio that way I can look at my gauge and get an idea of where lean for our engines is, etc. And to see how much power I make as well. :D

go for it. RPM activation is always the best way to go. Just costs more $$$ than people want to spend on a weekend warrior.

Dynos get expensive for that kind of thing. I'd suggest rolling it down to your local performance shop for a wideband tune instead. Thats just if you don't care if you don't know max hp. Might save you a few hundred bux for the same effect though...

go for it. RPM activation is always the best way to go. Just costs more $$$ than people want to spend on a weekend warrior.

Dynos get expensive for that kind of thing. I'd suggest rolling it down to your local performance shop for a wideband tune instead. Thats just if you don't care if you don't know max hp. Might save you a few hundred bux for the same effect though...

Well I rather spend that money knowing that my nitrous will be cut off there instead of hit redline and BOOM. Because sometimes I've gotten pretty close to redline.

And about the dyno I may do only 10 pulls lets say. First one base to know where I'm at N/A. 2nd one 35shot, etc.