Break in period?
09-18-2008, 01:09 PM
#26
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09-18-2008, 01:25 PM
#27
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How many new engines have you taken through validation testing on engine dynos using your break in method??
09-18-2008, 01:32 PM
#28
Honda is not bulletproof. Speaking from firsthand experience. I JUST came from an Acura which you know is Honda's premium brand.
At 70K miles it started throwing Oxy sensor codes. Replaced it with a quality Denso and a few weeks later same thing. Then it threw a V-Tec solenoid, and camshaft position sensor code as well. I tried to clear the codes to see if they would come back. Got them cleared and they didn't come back. At least not in the few weeks before I got rid of it. That's only like 20% of the reason I got rid of it. I just was ready for something new and the Cobalt SS looked like the one.
Broke an engine mount too. Front calipers went bad...
Overall it was a GREAT car and I still had confidence in it mechanically. But I was getting worried it might become an electrical nightmare.
Keeping on topic... I believe in following the manual. As stated I think GM would put the absolute best method that they think would give them the least amount of warranty work to do down the road.
At 70K miles it started throwing Oxy sensor codes. Replaced it with a quality Denso and a few weeks later same thing. Then it threw a V-Tec solenoid, and camshaft position sensor code as well. I tried to clear the codes to see if they would come back. Got them cleared and they didn't come back. At least not in the few weeks before I got rid of it. That's only like 20% of the reason I got rid of it. I just was ready for something new and the Cobalt SS looked like the one.
Broke an engine mount too. Front calipers went bad...
Overall it was a GREAT car and I still had confidence in it mechanically. But I was getting worried it might become an electrical nightmare.
Keeping on topic... I believe in following the manual. As stated I think GM would put the absolute best method that they think would give them the least amount of warranty work to do down the road.
09-18-2008, 02:54 PM
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09-18-2008, 03:29 PM
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I see where you are coming from...the fact that they have a reputation, etc, etc...but from a business perspective, this is not the attitude manufacturers take. It is a awfully big gamble to assume everyone has some experience with your brand and will know its quality without any type of warranty to back it up.
Additionally, you are just feeding the media's "anything that was made by the Japanese in the 80's was better than the crap America was building and must still be because companies don't change in 25 years" attitude. There were issues in the past with quality, but they are nonexistent now.
Take a look at some reliability and initial quality studies on recent models and stop living in the 80's like every other mainstream media outlet...
Additionally, you are just feeding the media's "anything that was made by the Japanese in the 80's was better than the crap America was building and must still be because companies don't change in 25 years" attitude. There were issues in the past with quality, but they are nonexistent now.
Take a look at some reliability and initial quality studies on recent models and stop living in the 80's like every other mainstream media outlet...
Ummm, no. If you look at most studies, including the big one (consumer reports), you will still see that the American car companies are still below average in reliability and tend to have more problems. Lexus, Honda, BMW, Acura, Toyota are always at the top year after year. So yes 2008, these companies still have the better reputation from their better manufactured cars. Don't get me wrong, every car company has their issues, but some just have more than others.
American car companies have come a long way since the 80's, but they are still not at the level of other car companies.
The funny part is why do all the lower car makers provide great warranties, and the best ones in consumer reports offer the least. Kia, Hyundai, GM, and Dogde all have a minimum of 100,000 warranties. Lexus, Toyota, Infiniti, BMW, Honda, and Acura all have less millage warranties.
I guess the Kia, Hyndai and so on make better cars, and their engineers have more faith than the Lexus, Honda, BMW boys.
The biggest reason that these manufacturers put these big warranties on their cars is not because they make better cars, but so they can sell more of their cars. It is a great selling feature (hense a reason why I'm driving my cobalt). The ones doing it are the ones that are hurting the worst. GM, Dodge, have to do anything they can to help push vehicles off their lots.. They are even throwing out GM employee prices to help move these cars. You don't often see the BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Honda do any of these incentives. If they do, it's for a short period of time.
Resale value has a ton to do with reliability. Why do you think all Kia, Hyundai, GM all have resale issues. They have terrible resale value. Why does Lexus and Honda have way better resale values. Is it because they look better? Probably not.
09-18-2008, 03:49 PM
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Ummm, no. If you look at most studies, including the big one (consumer reports), you will still see that the American car companies are still below average in reliability and tend to have more problems. Lexus, Honda, BMW, Acura, Toyota are always at the top year after year. So yes 2008, these companies still have the better reputation from their better manufactured cars. Don't get me wrong, every car company has their issues, but some just have more than others.
American car companies have come a long way since the 80's, but they are still not at the level of other car companies.
The funny part is why do all the lower car makers provide great warranties, and the best ones in consumer reports offer the least. Kia, Hyundai, GM, and Dogde all have a minimum of 100,000 warranties. Lexus, Toyota, Infiniti, BMW, Honda, and Acura all have less millage warranties.
I guess the Kia, Hyndai and so on make better cars, and their engineers have more faith than the Lexus, Honda, BMW boys.
The biggest reason that these manufacturers put these big warranties on their cars is not because they make better cars, but so they can sell more of their cars. It is a great selling feature (hense a reason why I'm driving my cobalt). The ones doing it are the ones that are hurting the worst. GM, Dodge, have to do anything they can to help push vehicles off their lots.. They are even throwing out GM employee prices to help move these cars. You don't often see the BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Honda do any of these incentives. If they do, it's for a short period of time.
Resale value has a ton to do with reliability. Why do you think all Kia, Hyundai, GM all have resale issues. They have terrible resale value. Why does Lexus and Honda have way better resale values. Is it because they look better? Probably not.
American car companies have come a long way since the 80's, but they are still not at the level of other car companies.
The funny part is why do all the lower car makers provide great warranties, and the best ones in consumer reports offer the least. Kia, Hyundai, GM, and Dogde all have a minimum of 100,000 warranties. Lexus, Toyota, Infiniti, BMW, Honda, and Acura all have less millage warranties.
I guess the Kia, Hyndai and so on make better cars, and their engineers have more faith than the Lexus, Honda, BMW boys.
The biggest reason that these manufacturers put these big warranties on their cars is not because they make better cars, but so they can sell more of their cars. It is a great selling feature (hense a reason why I'm driving my cobalt). The ones doing it are the ones that are hurting the worst. GM, Dodge, have to do anything they can to help push vehicles off their lots.. They are even throwing out GM employee prices to help move these cars. You don't often see the BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Honda do any of these incentives. If they do, it's for a short period of time.
Resale value has a ton to do with reliability. Why do you think all Kia, Hyundai, GM all have resale issues. They have terrible resale value. Why does Lexus and Honda have way better resale values. Is it because they look better? Probably not.
As for resale value...that is all a matter of perception of reliability.
09-18-2008, 03:49 PM
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The others have a higher resale value because of the public's misconceptions and because there are a lot of idiots that think it is cool to drive '95 Civics with huge mufflers!
09-18-2008, 04:28 PM
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Because the market is flooded with them due to their popularity with rental companies! That is why GM has reduced their fleet sales to rental places...
The others have a higher resale value because of the public's misconceptions and because there are a lot of idiots that think it is cool to drive '95 Civics with huge mufflers!
The others have a higher resale value because of the public's misconceptions and because there are a lot of idiots that think it is cool to drive '95 Civics with huge mufflers!
I bought a GM because I like to buy American. I like to help this economy and country any way possible. I like my vehicles price, looks, fun factor, and warranty, but is it as good quality as the others I mentioned.......no!
09-18-2008, 04:44 PM
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I do know about most of the data from huge critiquing magazines and publishers, and I do know that most agree. They all state that the reasonably prices vehicles, Toyota, Honda, and Acura are always at the top for resale value, quality, and least problems per 100 vehicles. I know that there are a ton of rubes on here stating that GM is just as good blah blah blah, but I'm just stating the facts.
I bought a GM because I like to buy American. I like to help this economy and country any way possible. I like my vehicles price, looks, fun factor, and warranty, but is it as good quality as the others I mentioned.......no!
I bought a GM because I like to buy American. I like to help this economy and country any way possible. I like my vehicles price, looks, fun factor, and warranty, but is it as good quality as the others I mentioned.......no!
JD Power and Associates gave the 2008 Chevy Malibu and Silverado top honors for 2008...least problems per 100 vehicles...
http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings...ry/midsize-car
09-18-2008, 06:42 PM
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Facts...really?
JD Power and Associates gave the 2008 Chevy Malibu and Silverado top honors for 2008...least problems per 100 vehicles...
http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings...ry/midsize-car
JD Power and Associates gave the 2008 Chevy Malibu and Silverado top honors for 2008...least problems per 100 vehicles...
http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings...ry/midsize-car
Also, if that is the case on the Malibu model, why are they so shitty on resale value.
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