Has anyone tried modifying the pump on the engines like diesel guys do? Or modifying the injectors to flow more? This could easily allow full E-85 use and bigger turbos oh and more power.

 

Trifecta raises the fuel pressure if you request it. 2800 psi on E85 was still too lean on mine in the midrange. Stock is 2150 psi.

 

Very good question, I sent a used injector to industrial injection who said it's possible to rework the injector (they are similar to the bosch injectors used by both Isuzu and cummins common rail motors) The problem isn't the injectors though, I noticed that in some cases fuel pressure just isn't there.

E85 guys can confirm or deny if at near 100% duty cycle the fuel pressure stays high enough. I suspect the pump is not strong enough to support high pressure (2800 or so) at 100% duty.

Furthermore, I see little reason the newest version of the UHPFP (CP4) pumps in the latest version of the duramax and ford 6.4 motors wouldn't work with the built in regulator and tuning. From what I see the injectors will still function beyond 5,000 psi. However, it's entirely likely at such an enhanced fuel pressure the spray pattern becomes less than ideal.

PS

You CANNOT use the cp3 belt driven pumps currently on the market, they require lubricated fuel, the cp4 uses a ceramic internal eccentric cam piston pump and needs no lubrication (a common standard with ultra low sulfur diesel)

 

Army Greywolf you read my mind. But you should be able to mod the stock pump to flow more and run higher pressure? And why not run a external factory pump with a belt so if the stock pump is good for 600 fwhp then two would be good for 1200 fwhp? right? And if the spray patterns suck at higher pressure that where the injector mods come in at. And couldn't you run a boost a pump to push more fuel thru the stock pump?

 

could u just get an aftermarket fuel pump?

 

ok to clarify, no and no.

supply more fuel to the hpfp wont result in a higher flow rate or pressure, the system regulates the pressure and the flow rate is limited to cc per stroke, so, basically its the displacement times half the rpm. supplying more fuel means removing the pump and modifying in such a way as to increase the bore or stroke. Same methods used to increase effective displacement in an engine work for increasing flow rate of our pumps.

 

You would think you could just add a booster pump but I think its so much you could try to push before it becomes a restriction or the fuel gets to hot.

 

I also wonder how the 2.4 DI pumps and 3.6 DI pumps are and is the 3.6 a bolt in swap or easy mod to make work?

 

Ok so I dug around, if you could FIND a roller style piston pumped nippondenso it can be converted to run belt driven HOWEVER it will require an external regulator. It has a 223 liter/hr rate @3600 rpm and while there is no rating beyond that, you can imagine what it's capable of, and I see nothing internally limiting it's rpm potential, although I see no reason at all to fuel beyond 200-220 liters/hr

 

Well I can't wait to someones figure this fuel thing out wouldn't mind seeing 400+ fwhp on E-85 on stock turbos.

 

Also would the regulator have to be in between the two pumps?

 

E-85 would need the injector to flow more than the 22.2mg (I think it converts to .0166cc) at 10mpa, so lets see whats 2800... little under 20mPa so for the sake of it lets say 20... since flow rate is linear to pressure (2 psi flows twice the rate as 1 psi and so forth...) of course there is a MAJOR loss to internals and even the time it takes to open and close the injector electronically. I would say if you ran the system at or near 5,000 peak psi (im sure the injectors can handle that) there would be no fueling problems on gasoline or e85

 

i think zzp is devolping a auxillery port fuel system that should solve the fuel problems

 

You are correct, Sir,at least in my case anyway. When I did get a good 4.4 sec 60-100 mph pull it popped a Low fuel rail pressure CEL and reduced engine power at around 6500 rpm. Fully bolted with the HPFP set to 2800 psi >160% load it just would not keep up in the highest boost section of the midrange. Injector DC skyrocketed and my .89 lambda setpoint controlled to ~.94.

60% E is about the most I can get enough flow for reliably. 70% E is pushing it's limits here.

I have since found an injector seal missing on #3 and has been repaired, hoping for better results next spring. The mechanical fit on the injector held a good enough seal for ~50k miles than decided to start leaking. When I removed the fuel rail and injectors, there was no teflon seal on #3. Compression had always been a bit lower on it, not any more.

 

so as I suspected, the problem is the flow rate of the hpfp not the injectors. If I could confirm a diesel hpfp that would work on gasoline, belt driven it would solve the problem of fueling and nullify the inability to run aftermarket cams. I also want to add, that in most cases even if lubricated fuel is required, there are additives made for that function that wouldn't hurt the motor or the injectors at all.

 

I like the way you guys are thinking.

 

I'm an outside the box kind of guy, working on zr2 duramax s10 project, for the luls dammit. (s10 frames arent as wide as the zr2 s10, which means the max can be mounted lower and further rearward without firewall mods, which is win.

 

pics on the s10.

 

nothin to show, havent got far other than acquisition but im gonna sell my dodge to fund the project, I can give some pics of that, it is an interesting beast

 

would raising the fuel pressure with stock turbo help anything?

 

I am on the stock turbo... see post #14 above.

 

army greywolf and iambroke you guys are ******* genious. A few of the only members on this site with useful info.

 

i mean on like 93 octane, not e85

 

No reason to raise the fuel pressure on 93.

 

Iam Broke, (whatever your real name is), I read your problems about fuel rail pressure issues while running e47. Have you tried to get a meth kit on top of you e47. Maybe you can inject a 50/50 mix and that will make up the extra for the injectiors not getting enough fuel in. Maybe a thought to improve on the 4.4 second run?

I thought about going half e85/100% meth, but the nearest e85 is an hour away in guelph. Unless I get a 60 litre gas can and fill it up with e85 and mix and match here during the summer, its' not going to work.

so 94 Octane plus 100% meth it is for me. My friend at work told me he can get me race gas in toronto, i might do a race gas combo plus 100% meth. (And my buddies still don't think I will beat my friends stock c63 amg in a roll race).