Picking the right mount.
03-16-2010, 03:18 PM
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Picking the right mount.
So track season is starting again and I am replacing my clutch here in the next few weeks, while I do that I figured it would be time install one of OTTP rotated mounts.
Stuff you need to know:
-Running a 2.8 (well under 300hp) this may change over time though
-Not a fan of large vibrations
-Want to eliminate wheel hop when at the track.
Will the stage 1 mounts do this for me or should I go to the stage 2?
Stuff you need to know:
-Running a 2.8 (well under 300hp) this may change over time though
-Not a fan of large vibrations
-Want to eliminate wheel hop when at the track.
Will the stage 1 mounts do this for me or should I go to the stage 2?
03-16-2010, 05:01 PM
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03-16-2010, 07:50 PM
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vibe city. try the LNF rear mount that is way more interesting.( I have a few LNF inserts cheap to good home, if you want to experiment replacing your rear insert and use it with a stage 1 OTTP mount) Poly just shakes the crap outta ur car...
03-17-2010, 08:48 AM
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http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P2480C392.aspx
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P2479C392.aspx
Will these fit on our cars? and if so, has anyone tried them and what are the outcomes.
03-18-2010, 11:49 AM
#18
Haz l33t wheelz.
No, the GM mounts do not rotate the motor, just use LNF mounts. The stage 1 does the rotation, stage 2 makes it stiffer. Stage 1 + LNF might be somewhere in between.
03-18-2010, 12:14 PM
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This is a route I was considering. Another symptom I am trying to get rid of is that "clunking" feel/noise when shifting hard between gears, mainly between 1st-2nd or when down shifting to 2nd. Which mount will help eliminate this?
03-18-2010, 01:20 PM
#21
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I use a stage 1 OTTP mount set with an LNF rear mount. Works fine. You will still get pretty hard engagement 1-2 thats what happens when you reduce the amount of flexibility provided by the OEM mounts. You will get more harshness in this engagement than you will by retaining the softer LSJ rear mount.
It is not possible within the space available at the front, to use a rotated mount with an oem insert without cutting and welding on the front cradle location. That would however provide the best solution overall for NVH and axle alignment.
It is not possible within the space available at the front, to use a rotated mount with an oem insert without cutting and welding on the front cradle location. That would however provide the best solution overall for NVH and axle alignment.
03-18-2010, 05:23 PM
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I use a stage 1 OTTP mount set with an LNF rear mount. Works fine. You will still get pretty hard engagement 1-2 thats what happens when you reduce the amount of flexibility provided by the OEM mounts. You will get more harshness in this engagement than you will by retaining the softer LSJ rear mount.
It is not possible within the space available at the front, to use a rotated mount with an oem insert without cutting and welding on the front cradle location. That would however provide the best solution overall for NVH and axle alignment.
It is not possible within the space available at the front, to use a rotated mount with an oem insert without cutting and welding on the front cradle location. That would however provide the best solution overall for NVH and axle alignment.
03-18-2010, 06:33 PM
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Another mount to consider is the ttr stop mount. I will be trying them this track season and will let you know my thoughts. For the price if they work well, that would be my vote.
03-18-2010, 08:15 PM
#24
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I have run them all including the GM racing style, I developed them for racing under contract to GM to build race Cobalts FYI.
The race ones have stupid vibes. After two iterations, we went with Billet Stage 1 and 2 at the request of Josh at OTTP who had accepted my offer to sell them in the USA (after a similar offer was turned down by Aaron at TTR, who later copied the orientation, using Poly.
Thats background and history. Lets move on.
This is what I found about materials:
Poly has a lot of vibes. I didnt like that. Poly also degrades, and we could not use that material in the race cars, instead we used UHMW. Vibes are awful.
To take care of both positioning the motor effectively and isolated vibration, you have to find a good insert.
GM has experimented with many different shapes and duromoters (hardness) of mount insert. It was not economically feasible for GM to do the rotation, we did talk about it, for the LNF. Torque management is programming and easy, and #1 it costs too much to change the mounts and #2 the car would have to be crash tested again - very expensive.
FYI, all motor mounts are specifically designed with load path engineering parameters so that in a full frontal collision the mass of the engine transaxle travels down and underneath the car .
Back in the day if you crashed, the motor/trans ended up straight back roughly in your crotch.
To specifically answer your question: OTTP Stage 1 with LSJ mounts is relatively inexpensive, conquers day to day wheel hop, and has little to no vibes noticeable. At idle the interior DB on my car are less than 64 dbA, and talking to a passenger with the key off is 62 dbA. I have a 3 inch full CTI exhaust system.
The OTTP stage 1 with the LNF mount has the same little or no vibes, but when releasing the clutch from time to time you will get an agressive engagement thump, as there is not as much resilience in the LNF rear mount compared to the LSJ. If you decide to buy Stage 1 from OTTP and want an LNF mount I will donate free an LNF insert to help your cause. + shipping
I street dd in the summer and weekends (heck this week I was on the track) road race my RL, run on slick Hoosier R100's have over 300 whp, and use stage 1. Works for me.
But not at the drag strip. Hope this answers your question.
03-18-2010, 09:35 PM
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Yes. Background:
I have run them all including the GM racing style, I developed them for racing under contract to GM to build race Cobalts FYI.
The race ones have stupid vibes. After two iterations, we went with Billet Stage 1 and 2 at the request of Josh at OTTP who had accepted my offer to sell them in the USA (after a similar offer was turned down by Aaron at TTR, who later copied the orientation, using Poly.
Thats background and history. Lets move on.
This is what I found about materials:
Poly has a lot of vibes. I didnt like that. Poly also degrades, and we could not use that material in the race cars, instead we used UHMW. Vibes are awful.
To take care of both positioning the motor effectively and isolated vibration, you have to find a good insert.
GM has experimented with many different shapes and duromoters (hardness) of mount insert. It was not economically feasible for GM to do the rotation, we did talk about it, for the LNF. Torque management is programming and easy, and #1 it costs too much to change the mounts and #2 the car would have to be crash tested again - very expensive.
FYI, all motor mounts are specifically designed with load path engineering parameters so that in a full frontal collision the mass of the engine transaxle travels down and underneath the car .
Back in the day if you crashed, the motor/trans ended up straight back roughly in your crotch.
To specifically answer your question: OTTP Stage 1 with LSJ mounts is relatively inexpensive, conquers day to day wheel hop, and has little to no vibes noticeable. At idle the interior DB on my car are less than 64 dbA, and talking to a passenger with the key off is 62 dbA. I have a 3 inch full CTI exhaust system.
The OTTP stage 1 with the LNF mount has the same little or no vibes, but when releasing the clutch from time to time you will get an agressive engagement thump, as there is not as much resilience in the LNF rear mount compared to the LSJ. If you decide to buy Stage 1 from OTTP and want an LNF mount I will donate free an LNF insert to help your cause. + shipping
I street dd in the summer and weekends (heck this week I was on the track) road race my RL, run on slick Hoosier R100's have over 300 whp, and use stage 1. Works for me.
But not at the drag strip. Hope this answers your question.
I have run them all including the GM racing style, I developed them for racing under contract to GM to build race Cobalts FYI.
The race ones have stupid vibes. After two iterations, we went with Billet Stage 1 and 2 at the request of Josh at OTTP who had accepted my offer to sell them in the USA (after a similar offer was turned down by Aaron at TTR, who later copied the orientation, using Poly.
Thats background and history. Lets move on.
This is what I found about materials:
Poly has a lot of vibes. I didnt like that. Poly also degrades, and we could not use that material in the race cars, instead we used UHMW. Vibes are awful.
To take care of both positioning the motor effectively and isolated vibration, you have to find a good insert.
GM has experimented with many different shapes and duromoters (hardness) of mount insert. It was not economically feasible for GM to do the rotation, we did talk about it, for the LNF. Torque management is programming and easy, and #1 it costs too much to change the mounts and #2 the car would have to be crash tested again - very expensive.
FYI, all motor mounts are specifically designed with load path engineering parameters so that in a full frontal collision the mass of the engine transaxle travels down and underneath the car .
Back in the day if you crashed, the motor/trans ended up straight back roughly in your crotch.
To specifically answer your question: OTTP Stage 1 with LSJ mounts is relatively inexpensive, conquers day to day wheel hop, and has little to no vibes noticeable. At idle the interior DB on my car are less than 64 dbA, and talking to a passenger with the key off is 62 dbA. I have a 3 inch full CTI exhaust system.
The OTTP stage 1 with the LNF mount has the same little or no vibes, but when releasing the clutch from time to time you will get an agressive engagement thump, as there is not as much resilience in the LNF rear mount compared to the LSJ. If you decide to buy Stage 1 from OTTP and want an LNF mount I will donate free an LNF insert to help your cause. + shipping
I street dd in the summer and weekends (heck this week I was on the track) road race my RL, run on slick Hoosier R100's have over 300 whp, and use stage 1. Works for me.
But not at the drag strip. Hope this answers your question.