2.4L Intake Manifold In Development
Senior Member
Joined: 07-09-07
Posts: 559
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From: Cleveland
Ecoboost is the only vendor I ever see actually keeping up with their clients. Its service like that which would cause someone to purchase a product. Keep it up.
I had an Experience with R.T. from Fujita. Guy always willing to answer questions for me. I happened to have been sold a wrong intake and he took care of me. If he would have had an option for my car at the time, I would have 100% purchased from him.
I had an Experience with R.T. from Fujita. Guy always willing to answer questions for me. I happened to have been sold a wrong intake and he took care of me. If he would have had an option for my car at the time, I would have 100% purchased from him.
Senior Member
Joined: 10-28-07
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From: Tall Timbers, MD
So we seem to have two different schools of thought here, and both of them very adamant!
The one position states a rerouting of the intake piping to air filter (in order to accomodate a repositioned throttle body) would be acceptable, and the other finds this concept less than pleasing.
I'd like to offer that should we build a short-runner manifold for 2.4 with a left-facing throttle body, we'd do so to maintain what has proven to be an effective design, and also keep costs down. It would not be an adaption of the 2.0 intake, any more than the 2.0 intake is an adaption of its earlier cousin, the Cavalier-Sunfire 2.2 intake, which is also not an adaption of ITS earlier cousin, the 2.0 Neon intake, and so on...
As one can see, the overall point being that this is a pedigreed, proven design concept not unique to just 2.0 LSJ. Tooling up to develop an entirely different concept could prove to be cost prohibitive, which could prevent any option from emerging.
That being said, I will continue to explore the concept of a manifold that retains the stock TB location and features longer runners.
Keep those likes / dislikes / desires / objectives coming, I really appreciate it!
The one position states a rerouting of the intake piping to air filter (in order to accomodate a repositioned throttle body) would be acceptable, and the other finds this concept less than pleasing.
I'd like to offer that should we build a short-runner manifold for 2.4 with a left-facing throttle body, we'd do so to maintain what has proven to be an effective design, and also keep costs down. It would not be an adaption of the 2.0 intake, any more than the 2.0 intake is an adaption of its earlier cousin, the Cavalier-Sunfire 2.2 intake, which is also not an adaption of ITS earlier cousin, the 2.0 Neon intake, and so on...
As one can see, the overall point being that this is a pedigreed, proven design concept not unique to just 2.0 LSJ. Tooling up to develop an entirely different concept could prove to be cost prohibitive, which could prevent any option from emerging.
That being said, I will continue to explore the concept of a manifold that retains the stock TB location and features longer runners.
Keep those likes / dislikes / desires / objectives coming, I really appreciate it!
i see your point but can't you "flip" the manifold over and change a few things for fitment?
Former Vendor
Joined: 07-07-06
Posts: 1,430
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From: Chicago, IL
Well, you (or your installer) already had to extend the wires for the MAF to accomodate the turbosystem...doing this for the T/Body would be similarly easy. Frankly, it's about a 15 minute job, and done with a soldering iron and heat-shrink tube, it's as dependable as the stock harness ever was!
Last edited by Hahn RaceCraft; Apr 3, 2008 at 10:42 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
New Member
Joined: 01-14-08
Posts: 4
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From: Wasaga Beach
i know i don't own a cobalt, and probably never will, IMO, Bill, if someone is going to spend the money on a 2500 dollar turbo upgrade on a motor that wasn't built for turbo, build the motor for turbo, is going to spend 1g note on a custom proven sexy turbo manifold, so build a sweet ass, left facing, short runner, big plenum, big TB bore (70mm at least, 90mm as option), port fueler ports, nitrous ports intake manifold.
PERIOD!
All of you N/A guys should not be bothering with this at all. You should be getting bill to mock up a ITB setup
PERIOD!
All of you N/A guys should not be bothering with this at all. You should be getting bill to mock up a ITB setup
Senior Member
Joined: 10-28-07
Posts: 3,713
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From: Tall Timbers, MD
i know i don't own a cobalt, and probably never will, IMO, Bill, if someone is going to spend the money on a 2500 dollar turbo upgrade on a motor that wasn't built for turbo, build the motor for turbo, is going to spend 1g note on a custom proven sexy turbo manifold, so build a sweet ass, left facing, short runner, big plenum, big TB bore (70mm at least, 90mm as option), port fueler ports, nitrous ports intake manifold.
PERIOD!
All of you N/A guys should not be bothering with this at all. You should be getting bill to mock up a ITB setup
PERIOD!
All of you N/A guys should not be bothering with this at all. You should be getting bill to mock up a ITB setup
the neon kid makes a good point, a ITB would be a nice option, that is if you could provide the whole set up. i would make a good amount for that, then the only problem after that would be tuning.
i know i don't own a cobalt, and probably never will, IMO, Bill, if someone is going to spend the money on a 2500 dollar turbo upgrade on a motor that wasn't built for turbo, build the motor for turbo, is going to spend 1g note on a custom proven sexy turbo manifold, so build a sweet ass, left facing, short runner, big plenum, big TB bore (70mm at least, 90mm as option), port fueler ports, nitrous ports intake manifold.
PERIOD!
All of you N/A guys should not be bothering with this at all. You should be getting bill to mock up a ITB setup
PERIOD!
All of you N/A guys should not be bothering with this at all. You should be getting bill to mock up a ITB setup
ITB or a mani would only be needed if we decided:
"Hey let's rev like Hondas."
Because that is the way you make N/A power. Period.
If you have the cams to flow up that high along with the rest of the upper half of the motor built and blah then a good high flowing mani would be great.
A mani isn't a CAI...it isn't as simple as slapping it on and going...tuning and proper mods to accomodate where the powerband was shifted are needed.
You can yield gains on a close to stock car...but a mani swap is best used when a car is built.
Not necessarily for a juiced or boosted ap only though
Senior Member
Joined: 02-26-07
Posts: 532
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From: chicago
No, he has a point.
ITB or a mani would only be needed if we decided:
"Hey let's rev like Hondas."
Because that is the way you make N/A power. Period.
If you have the cams to flow up that high along with the rest of the upper half of the motor built and blah then a good high flowing mani would be great.
A mani isn't a CAI...it isn't as simple as slapping it on and going...tuning and proper mods to accomodate where the powerband was shifted are needed.
You can yield gains on a close to stock car...but a mani swap is best used when a car is built.
Not necessarily for a juiced or boosted ap only though
ITB or a mani would only be needed if we decided:
"Hey let's rev like Hondas."
Because that is the way you make N/A power. Period.
If you have the cams to flow up that high along with the rest of the upper half of the motor built and blah then a good high flowing mani would be great.
A mani isn't a CAI...it isn't as simple as slapping it on and going...tuning and proper mods to accomodate where the powerband was shifted are needed.
You can yield gains on a close to stock car...but a mani swap is best used when a car is built.
Not necessarily for a juiced or boosted ap only though
Senior Member
Joined: 10-28-07
Posts: 3,713
Likes: 0
From: Tall Timbers, MD
No, he has a point.
ITB or a mani would only be needed if we decided:
"Hey let's rev like Hondas."
Because that is the way you make N/A power. Period.
If you have the cams to flow up that high along with the rest of the upper half of the motor built and blah then a good high flowing mani would be great.
A mani isn't a CAI...it isn't as simple as slapping it on and going...tuning and proper mods to accomodate where the powerband was shifted are needed.
You can yield gains on a close to stock car...but a mani swap is best used when a car is built.
Not necessarily for a juiced or boosted ap only though
ITB or a mani would only be needed if we decided:
"Hey let's rev like Hondas."
Because that is the way you make N/A power. Period.
If you have the cams to flow up that high along with the rest of the upper half of the motor built and blah then a good high flowing mani would be great.
A mani isn't a CAI...it isn't as simple as slapping it on and going...tuning and proper mods to accomodate where the powerband was shifted are needed.
You can yield gains on a close to stock car...but a mani swap is best used when a car is built.
Not necessarily for a juiced or boosted ap only though
Stock cars have been built N/A since the beginning of their inception. They do not turn 10K to make power, the power is down low when coming of the corner, trust me I know as I have built several.
I do not drive a Honda nor would I ever want to. The Japanese have found a way to make horsepower by revving the **** out of their engines, but again, I do not have a Japanese car nor would I want to own one.
ITB's are horrid on low end power and would never be a consideration for a driver.
New Member
Joined: 01-14-08
Posts: 4
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From: Wasaga Beach
just inserting opinion using experience. not flaming, or trolling. My buddy has a SS/SC, keeping up with the info so i can stay ahead of the bullshit.
Senior Member
Joined: 11-22-06
Posts: 1,505
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From: Orlando, FL
I well designed N/A intake mani for the Ecotec and you will not lose anything down low but gain a lot up top. Cosworth has proven that on other N/A 4 bangers. And I am sure Hahn can too. But it is going to take some R&D to get it right.
I was basing my statemnet on the fact that Mr Hahn said something along the lines of "2.0 style" intake for the 2.4 That intake(as well as the 2.2 one before it) do not work very well on moderately modified NA engines, and it actually loses A LOT of bottom end, even though it does allow the engine to breathe to rpm's well beyond the limits of the stock valvetrains capabilites
Senior Member
Joined: 10-28-07
Posts: 3,713
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From: Tall Timbers, MD
Senior Member
Joined: 02-26-07
Posts: 532
Likes: 0
From: chicago
So ITB is like tunnel ram? if so that would be absolute ass for a street car as you would have 0% low end where you need it for daily driving.
Granted gathered all of this from glimpsing @ that pic.
Granted gathered all of this from glimpsing @ that pic.