New injectors and tune!
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New Member
Joined: 08-27-06
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From: tucson, arizona
New injectors and tune!
Well psykostevo and I finally got done instally stock ss/sc injectors(34lb) and tuning the ecu/tcm in my car. All I can say is WOW. What a big differnce tha tranny tune made. All you guys were posting on your changes and I didn't think it would be that good, but it definitly is. When me and Steve first tried this, we weren't able to put the injectors in do to the clips being different, so he just tuned the tcm and slightly tuned the ecu. On our first attempt with the tranny, he increased the firmness, raised the shift point(now 7k), and increased the downshft firmness. This made a good difference and cool to see the tach go that high. But we did notice that on the stock 24lb injectors, the IDC was high in the 90's after the tune in third gear. 1st n 2nd were ok, mid 80's, but could be better. We also notice slight knock in the motor. I found a harness to fit the ss/sc injectors in the motor.Well after the new injectores, everthing got cured. No more knock and the IDC is in the mid 70's at any gear.
All said and done, these mods made a good difference and now on downshifts it actually breaks the tires loose if I hit right. I know this cause we had a little get together in Phoenix and went to the mountains on some twistys. When I would stomp it out of a corner to accelerate through the end of a turn, I could feel the tires break loose and the low traction light came on. Oh one more thing. Anyone getting this done might want to consider a tranny cooler also.
All said and done, these mods made a good difference and now on downshifts it actually breaks the tires loose if I hit right. I know this cause we had a little get together in Phoenix and went to the mountains on some twistys. When I would stomp it out of a corner to accelerate through the end of a turn, I could feel the tires break loose and the low traction light came on. Oh one more thing. Anyone getting this done might want to consider a tranny cooler also.
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Joined: 08-27-06
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From: tucson, arizona
Actually I didn't put them in untill after the meet. The trip to mountains were without the injectors. After we got done with the group pics, I met Steve at the pavs and we put them in there and then reflashed the car.
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Joined: 08-27-06
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From: tucson, arizona
Actually colbaltcrusin, I don't know where you could find out about tunes. I learned all my info from pyskostevo here in AZ.
Well I'm gonna let you guys in on a little secret. There is no special wire splicing or cutting needed. Don't even need to take out the electical tape. The special harness needed is none the less a 2.2l harness. Everthing is plug and play and I have to say the easist mode. Only took 10-15mins max. Then you just have to have it tuned.
I say $50 is a fair price. Our buddy is getting some for around that price. By the way the price for the 2.2l harness was $31.00 my cost. Don't know list price since I get employee discount.
Well I'm gonna let you guys in on a little secret. There is no special wire splicing or cutting needed. Don't even need to take out the electical tape. The special harness needed is none the less a 2.2l harness. Everthing is plug and play and I have to say the easist mode. Only took 10-15mins max. Then you just have to have it tuned.
I say $50 is a fair price. Our buddy is getting some for around that price. By the way the price for the 2.2l harness was $31.00 my cost. Don't know list price since I get employee discount.
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Joined: 02-09-06
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From: Abita Springs, Louisiana
Actually colbaltcrusin, I don't know where you could find out about tunes. I learned all my info from pyskostevo here in AZ.
Well I'm gonna let you guys in on a little secret. There is no special wire splicing or cutting needed. Don't even need to take out the electical tape. The special harness needed is none the less a 2.2l harness. Everthing is plug and play and I have to say the easist mode. Only took 10-15mins max. Then you just have to have it tuned.
I say $50 is a fair price. Our buddy is getting some for around that price. By the way the price for the 2.2l harness was $31.00 my cost. Don't know list price since I get employee discount.
Well I'm gonna let you guys in on a little secret. There is no special wire splicing or cutting needed. Don't even need to take out the electical tape. The special harness needed is none the less a 2.2l harness. Everthing is plug and play and I have to say the easist mode. Only took 10-15mins max. Then you just have to have it tuned.
I say $50 is a fair price. Our buddy is getting some for around that price. By the way the price for the 2.2l harness was $31.00 my cost. Don't know list price since I get employee discount.
I've got a set of ss/sc injectors that I'd love to slip into my ride after hearing your great results.
sushi i am looking forward to your projects then your dyno pull, one of my first post was about adding the basic bolt on's and upgrading the injectors i was quickly falmed about it being stupid, i think other wise now
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Joined: 02-09-06
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From: Abita Springs, Louisiana
You wouldn't believe all the heat I get because of my e-rams. People PM me just to flame me. lol Hey, but that's ok. The guys in front of the pack will make the mistakes, learn from them, and pave the way for others to follow. Nothing ventured nothing gained.
Here's a case of someone with a 90%+dc from simple bolt-ons and tuning having problems with KR from leaning out on top. All the armchair tuners said that no, it won't happen - you've got to run boost to need bigger injectors. But it's the guys in the trenches actually logging the data and doing the work that gets the good results. Don't let anyone dissuade you from following a course of action that you know is right.
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Joined: 04-17-04
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From: Calgary Alberta Canada
Well psykostevo and I finally got done instally stock ss/sc injectors(34lb) and tuning the ecu/tcm in my car.
All I can say is WOW. What a big differnce tha tranny tune made. All you guys were posting on your changes and I didn't think it would be that good, but it definitly is. When me and Steve first tried this, we weren't able to put the injectors in do to the clips being different, so he just tuned the tcm and slightly tuned the ecu.
On our first attempt with the tranny, he increased the firmness, raised the shift point(now 7k), and increased the downshft firmness. This made a good difference and cool to see the tach go that high. But we did notice that on the stock 24lb injectors, the IDC was high in the 90's after the tune in third gear.
1st n 2nd were ok, mid 80's, but could be better. We also notice slight knock in the motor. I found a harness to fit the ss/sc injectors in the motor.Well after the new injectores, everthing got cured. No more knock and the IDC is in the mid 70's at any gear.
All said and done, these mods made a good difference and now on downshifts it actually breaks the tires loose if I hit right. I know this cause we had a little get together in Phoenix and went to the mountains on some twistys.
When I would stomp it out of a corner to accelerate through the end of a turn, I could feel the tires break loose and the low traction light came on. Oh one more thing. Anyone getting this done might want to consider a tranny cooler also.
All I can say is WOW. What a big differnce tha tranny tune made. All you guys were posting on your changes and I didn't think it would be that good, but it definitly is. When me and Steve first tried this, we weren't able to put the injectors in do to the clips being different, so he just tuned the tcm and slightly tuned the ecu.
On our first attempt with the tranny, he increased the firmness, raised the shift point(now 7k), and increased the downshft firmness. This made a good difference and cool to see the tach go that high. But we did notice that on the stock 24lb injectors, the IDC was high in the 90's after the tune in third gear.
1st n 2nd were ok, mid 80's, but could be better. We also notice slight knock in the motor. I found a harness to fit the ss/sc injectors in the motor.Well after the new injectores, everthing got cured. No more knock and the IDC is in the mid 70's at any gear.
All said and done, these mods made a good difference and now on downshifts it actually breaks the tires loose if I hit right. I know this cause we had a little get together in Phoenix and went to the mountains on some twistys.
When I would stomp it out of a corner to accelerate through the end of a turn, I could feel the tires break loose and the low traction light came on. Oh one more thing. Anyone getting this done might want to consider a tranny cooler also.
Whats the IDC?? You said it was high in 3rd gear...
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Joined: 11-16-05
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From: Sunrise, Florida
IDC = Injector Duty Cycle, measured in a percentage
When IDC = 100, your injectors have gone static....very bad! Closer to 100, worse you are.
70 is a very good number! Good idea, gonna have to look into this myself.
When IDC = 100, your injectors have gone static....very bad! Closer to 100, worse you are.
70 is a very good number! Good idea, gonna have to look into this myself.
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Joined: 05-20-06
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From: Phoenix, AZ
I am the guy doing the tuning. This car has turned into quite the impressive 4-door. Not just looks, but the performance is starting to match. If any of you live in Arizona, I don't charge much to tune.
The car redlines now at 7,075rpm's, and shifts at 7000-7050rpms. The Powerband is estimated to be raised to the 6,700 mark, from its previous ~6,400.
The tranny definitely needs a cooler with my reprogramming. It is safe to drive normally, but if you get hard into it, like Familywagon sometimes does, your tranny fluid will get hot. The Shifts are quicker than I think you could do manually, and throw you forward with each upshift, and back with each downshift.
Definitely snag up some stock SC injectors and go to your dealer and offer them no more than $40+tax for the 2.2L harness. It will save you time and frustration. Don't try to cut wires with such an easy and safe option available.
With the Redline set so high, the IDC was up to 98% in 3rd gear, and we started seeing knock as soon as the IDC went above 90-92%. Only 2.8* of knock, but still not a good thing. Luckily all the knock went away with the new injectors, because 1-2 gear was about 72% max IDC, and 3rd Maxed at 76% with 3 people in the car. Since there was no knock, we added some more timing, and drove it without any further knock.
My next goal is to reprogram the VVT, but as you can guess, that's not an easy task.
The car redlines now at 7,075rpm's, and shifts at 7000-7050rpms. The Powerband is estimated to be raised to the 6,700 mark, from its previous ~6,400.
The tranny definitely needs a cooler with my reprogramming. It is safe to drive normally, but if you get hard into it, like Familywagon sometimes does, your tranny fluid will get hot. The Shifts are quicker than I think you could do manually, and throw you forward with each upshift, and back with each downshift.
Definitely snag up some stock SC injectors and go to your dealer and offer them no more than $40+tax for the 2.2L harness. It will save you time and frustration. Don't try to cut wires with such an easy and safe option available.
With the Redline set so high, the IDC was up to 98% in 3rd gear, and we started seeing knock as soon as the IDC went above 90-92%. Only 2.8* of knock, but still not a good thing. Luckily all the knock went away with the new injectors, because 1-2 gear was about 72% max IDC, and 3rd Maxed at 76% with 3 people in the car. Since there was no knock, we added some more timing, and drove it without any further knock.
My next goal is to reprogram the VVT, but as you can guess, that's not an easy task.
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From: Pittsburgh, PA
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From: Phoenix, AZ
It is poosible. I can see the tables in HPTuners. Version 2.1.14 allows you to tap the VVT and change it however you want, but I am still making sense of them since it is new to me.
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From: Phoenix, AZ
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From: Pittsburgh, PA
Yes, those are fueling values for calculating speed density MAP based fueling. Those numbers can be changed, but they are fueling numbers only, not actual changes to VVT values, plus changing those numbers will yield almost unpredictable results for several reasons. First the actual speed density table consists of 30 smaller tables, those table boundaries are listed under the dynamic airflow tab. Changing one without changing them all will result in horrible lean/rich spikes when transitioning from one table to another. Also, there is no way to log cam phasing nor lock it to one value for logging purposes to be able to compare changes in any values you edit.
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Joined: 05-20-06
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From: Phoenix, AZ
Yes, those are fueling values for calculating speed density MAP based fueling. Those numbers can be changed, but they are fueling numbers only, not actual changes to VVT values, plus changing those numbers will yield almost unpredictable results for several reasons. First the actual speed density table consists of 30 smaller tables, those table boundaries are listed under the dynamic airflow tab. Changing one without changing them all will result in horrible lean/rich spikes when transitioning from one table to another. Also, there is no way to log cam phasing nor lock it to one value for logging purposes to be able to compare changes in any values you edit.
