Coba

Link to my original new member thread:: https://www.cobaltss.net/forums/new-...n-area-318757/

The LCV is used in the base model ats, and i believe the malibu. It is direct injection. But i was wondering. If someone was going to aim for a high hp build. The gen3 block has many benefits. Its strength is its main benefit. As i was not thinking about hypothetically using the LCV head. Instead, what if the direct injection ports were sealed up. Then use the LE5 head and LE5 hardware. Build the bottom end with the ZZP 4340 rods and the forged and coated LE5 pistons from ZZP. These components are tested to well over 800whp. The pistons are well designed for port injection. Seeing as both the engines have the same 88mm bore. The crank is what is different. The LE5 has a 98mm stroke vs 101mm stroke on the LCV which makes up the displacement difference. Run the LE5 crank if possible. dropping the compression slightly more. In the end it seems like a motor capable of 600+whp reliably. Maybe more??

Would be nice for some LE5 experts to chime in.

We are talking about this as a "possible" route to discuss if this is even reasonable. Seems like if it did work it would be a good peace of mind engine. On youtube there are several 1000hp ecotecs i have seen. So this could be useful to the drag racing community. For a slightly more budget build.


GM 2.5L I4 Ecotec LCV Engine Specs
Type: 2.5L I4
Displacement: 2457 cc (150 ci)
Engine Orientation: Longitudinal or Transverse
Compression ratio: 11.3:1
Valve configuration: Dual overhead camshafts
Valves per cylinder 4
Assembly site: Tonawanda, NY, Spring Hill, TN
Valve lifters: Hydraulic roller finger follower
Firing order: 1 – 3 – 4 – 2
Bore x Stroke: 88.00 x 101.00mm
Fuel system: SIDI (Spark Ignited Direct Injection)
Fuel Type: Regular unleaded
Applications Horsepower hp ( kw )
Cadillac ATS 202 hp (151 kW) @ 6300 rpm SAE Certified
Applications Torque lb-ft. ( Nm )
Cadillac ATS 191 lb-ft. (259 Nm) @ 4400 rpm SAE Certified
Maximum Engine Speed: 7000 rpm
Emissions controls: Evaporative system
Catalytic converters (close coupled and underfloor)
Positive crankcase ventilation
Secondary air injection
Materials
Block: Cast aluminum 319T7
Cylinder head: Cast aluminum 356T6
Intake manifold: Composite
Exhaust manifold: High silicon molybdenum, cast nodular iron
Main bearing caps: Iron inserts cast into Bedplate
Crankshaft: Steel
Camshaft: Assembled steel
Connecting rods: Forged powdered metal
Additional features: Extended life spark plugs
Extended life coolant
Electronic throttle control
Variable valve timing
Belt Alternator Starter system capable
2-stage thermostat (90 C & 105 C)
2-stage variable displacement oil pump
Modular balance shaft system in oil pan
Precision sand cast block with cast-in-place iron liners
Spin on oil filter
Integrated N&V cover on intake manifold
Integrated front engine mount for transverse installation
Exhaust on left-hand side and intake on right-hand side


2007 Ecotec 2.4L I4 VVT ( LE5 ) 51106
Type: Ecotec 2.4L I-4
Displacement: 2393cc (146 ci)
Engine Orientation: L ( longitudinal ) T ( transverse ) L / T
Compression ratio: 10.4:1
Valve configuration: dual overhead camshafts
valves per cylinder: 4
Assembly site: Spring Hill, Tenn.
Valve lifters: hydraulic roller finger follower
Firing order: 1 - 3 - 4 - 2
Bore x stroke: 88.00 x 98.00mm
Fuel system: sequential fuel injection
Fuel Type: Premium recommended not required
Applications: Horsepower: hp ( kW )
Fuel shut off: 6800 rpm (7000 rpm Solstice)
Emissions controls: evaporative system
catalytic converter
positive crankcase ventilation
MATERIALS
Block: cast aluminum
Cylinder head: cast aluminum
Intake manifold: composite
Exhaust manifold: high silicon molybdenum, cast nodular iron
Main bearing caps: aluminum bedplate
Crankshaft: cast nodular iron
Camshaft: cast nodular iron
Connecting rods: forged steel
Additional features: extended life spark plugs
extended life coolant
electronic throttle control
variable valve timing
unitized exhaust manifold/catalyst (G6)





Ecotec 2.2L runs 6.49 @209

JapEatr

iTrader: (9)

the block and head would work, not sure about the PCM and VVT

Coba

Hypothetically was thinking of using a built f23. The LCV does only come on automatic cars at this point. Do you think that the cobalt PCM and LCV with the the f23 would not like to work together?

All input appreciated

07blackg5

iTrader: (8)

it sounds like you just want the 88mm gen3 block, correct me if I'm wrong.

You said you want the le5 head, le5 crank, le5 internals, etc. there are already gen 3 88mm blocks floating around for ~800 bucks. you could build that with whatever crank/stroke combination you want, and use whatever head you want as well. the only thing in the way is vvt, but that can be worked around, or added if necessary. Depends on what ecu/harness you have

88mm gen 3 blocks have been used in quite a few builds with different combinations of cranks and displacements. If you wanted to use le5 parts, they will all swap right in off the shelf

blueLNFftw

iTrader: (16)

Buddy has an LCV block with a ported LSJ head. Stroked. Final was 2.1.

Slowbalt2000

iTrader: (1)

Isnt it pretty much a completely different engine? I guess it could work

blueLNFftw

iTrader: (16)

What trans came on the block, and the block itself, have no bearing on the PCM.

Coba

Yeah just the block with all the proven aftermarket LE5 parts. I would definitely go through ZZP for the bottom end parts. 800 dollars seems like a great deal.. More affordable than i was expecting. I like the vvt alot. Good torque down low should help spool also. With the LE5 head shouldnt the motor be tune-able with the factory computer? Already have the ZZP 1.0 file.
Good info thanks

Coba

Ah, alright thats good to know. Wasnt sure what japeatr was saying about the pcm not working.

blueLNFftw

iTrader: (16)

He was assuming that you meant using the head as well I believe and tuning the VVT

Coba

That makes sense but the head on the LCV is for direct injection. ZZP has tuning these cars down to a science. Port injection is definitely the way to go. With direct injection dont you need to change cams that have a bigger fuel pump lobe when making big power? Which i doubt would exist for the lcv head. The only reason to do this build would be to make 5-600whp safely. If i wanted 400whp i could probably just get by with a junkyard 06-07 le5.

I just hate the idea of being stuck at a power level. I want room to grow. Im not starting anything yet. Will see what i decide to go with in the spring.

Just really curious about this route for the build.

07blackg5

iTrader: (8)

if you just want the 88mm gen 3 block, get ahold of mongorat427 on here.

he has them all the time for 800ish

Coba

Ill keep that in mind man. Im just really not ready to start filling the garage with parts. I dont plan on getting started till all the snow ice and salt are gone

Want to get it going march-april. Just making sure i have my plan all thought out.

This block seems like the way to go!

KMO43

From what I've read everything is different the head is backwards to ours the blocks have the balance shafts lower but the 2.5 uses a forged crank which is really interesting if it'll fit our blocks

Slowbalt2000

iTrader: (1)

Zzp claims it will

Slowbalt2000

iTrader: (1)

Check junkyards. You can get the whole engine for that money

KMO43

Turbo on the wrong side

http://s1.cdn.autoevolution.com/imag...-gallery_6.jpg

Slowbalt2000

iTrader: (1)

That has nothing to do with the crankshaft

KMO43

I thought he wanted basically the whole thing. If the crank works I'll be buying one really soon for my build!!!

Coba

I havent being around for a few days because i got real sick. My temp was between 103-101 degrees. It all started from drinking a **** craft beer..

Anyway, so it seems like we have come to a conclusion on using the LCV block. As it will not work because the engine is essentially flipped 180 and everything is backwards. Some one on here mentioned that they knew of somebody using this engine with the port injection heads. Was there just a misunderstanding on what block was being used??

Coba

Also i would like to come to a conclusion on which Gen3 88mm blocks will work with the LE5 head. So users could see higher hp builds more safely. Than with the Gen2 LE5 block. So this thread will be useful to future builds.

Any input appreciated.

07blackg5

iTrader: (8)

Im still thinking it would be a safe assumption that the block is the same. The flipped intake and exhaust sides are all theoretically dealing with the head exclusively.

Any of the gen3 88mm blocks will bolt up to the le5 head fine. All the current heads and blocks are compatible in terms of stud spacing and everything lining up. the gen 3 blocks, both in 86 and 88mm bore configurations are not a new thing. There are quite a large number of people running them in all sorts of head/block configs.

Slowbalt2000

iTrader: (1)

Its not though. The balance shafts are no longer in the block, theyre in the pan, the heads they use are different too so im not sure theyd bolt right on. We really have to see some pics/measurements of the new blocks.

Slowbalt2000

iTrader: (1)

Different oil pump too, variable displacement

07blackg5

iTrader: (8)

ah, well then any pre-lcv gen 3.