2.0 LSJ Stroker
02-19-2009, 02:20 PM
#1
Haz l33t wheelz.
Thread Starter
2.0 LSJ Stroker
What i have gathered so far, still reading on RLF. apparently someone did do it, but i have yet to find any verifiable numbers or results.
Youre going to be fishing into unknown territory if you start playing with rods, youll wanna go long enough to not have extreme angles so you dont wear piston skirts but you dont wanna knick the sleeve either. I still think its a better option than having to bore the **** out of the CC on the head though since 2.4 rods arent real cheap anyway as they are mass produced to the extent any custom 4 banger rod is.
The reluctor rings between the two cranks will swap. They are actually both the same rings (60-2 or 58x) but on different centers and use different sensors, the 2.4L uses a hall effect and the LSJ uses a variable reluctance (mag) both located in slightly different positions on the block.
The reluctor rings between the two cranks will swap. They are actually both the same rings (60-2 or 58x) but on different centers and use different sensors, the 2.4L uses a hall effect and the LSJ uses a variable reluctance (mag) both located in slightly different positions on the block.
The other difference between the LSJ crank and the L61 crank is the crankshaft position reluctor ring. The 2.2l L61 crank ring looks like this:
and the LSJ crank looks like this:
The reluctor ring bolts to the LSJ crank, so if you got a 2.2L crak you could machine it off and bolt on the reluctor ring. but this is the job for an engine builder that knows what they are doing.
Eagle says their 2.2L crank cannot be easily machined to take the reluctor ring either.
Here is what GM racing had to say about the cranks:
"Old L61 cranks have a 7x (pulses per rev), casted in. You can't use those, unless you machine it, use the LSJ reluctor wheel and match the index off the LSJ. The more recent L61 have the same 58x reluctor wheel as the LSJ, but we don't think that they are indexed the same. We don't have them here to look at, but you should be able to do that. You'd need to adjust the reluctor wheel on the L61 to match how the LSJ is indexed. We do know that the L61 reluctor wheel is indexed 3.5degrees off the #1 pin.
The Eagle crank is a replacement for the 2.2L L61 crank (similar stroke, same bolt pattern).
"
As for flywheel bolt patterns, this is what SPEC has to say about the issue on using their flywheel at clutch (stage 3) for the LSJ with a 2.2L crank and the F35 transmission
"The SC893F-2 and SC98A should be fine. There is a .210 (two hundred ten thousandths) difference in stackup height, but the 2.2L crank may make up that difference. Check the crank snout/flywheel mounting flange and see if it protrudes further from the block than the 2.0L crank. If not, a spacer can likely be used to make up that difference."
and the LSJ crank looks like this:
The reluctor ring bolts to the LSJ crank, so if you got a 2.2L crak you could machine it off and bolt on the reluctor ring. but this is the job for an engine builder that knows what they are doing.
Eagle says their 2.2L crank cannot be easily machined to take the reluctor ring either.
Here is what GM racing had to say about the cranks:
"Old L61 cranks have a 7x (pulses per rev), casted in. You can't use those, unless you machine it, use the LSJ reluctor wheel and match the index off the LSJ. The more recent L61 have the same 58x reluctor wheel as the LSJ, but we don't think that they are indexed the same. We don't have them here to look at, but you should be able to do that. You'd need to adjust the reluctor wheel on the L61 to match how the LSJ is indexed. We do know that the L61 reluctor wheel is indexed 3.5degrees off the #1 pin.
The Eagle crank is a replacement for the 2.2L L61 crank (similar stroke, same bolt pattern).
"
As for flywheel bolt patterns, this is what SPEC has to say about the issue on using their flywheel at clutch (stage 3) for the LSJ with a 2.2L crank and the F35 transmission
"The SC893F-2 and SC98A should be fine. There is a .210 (two hundred ten thousandths) difference in stackup height, but the 2.2L crank may make up that difference. Check the crank snout/flywheel mounting flange and see if it protrudes further from the block than the 2.0L crank. If not, a spacer can likely be used to make up that difference."
Last edited by ls1fbody; 02-19-2009 at 02:56 PM.
02-19-2009, 02:43 PM
#5
Haz l33t wheelz.
Thread Starter
no, its not.
The LSJ may be a similar motor, but there is much more to it that just being de-stroked
Does anyone have the specs for both the LSJ crank and the LE5 crank? maybe i could get a custom crank made to avoid the ruluctor and flywheel issues.
I gather that the LE5 rods are NOT forged, so to the 2.4 guys, are there any aftermarket rods for you?
And since the possiblity of a custom crank is there, would it be best to bore out to 91mm and increase stroke to 91?
hmm... i'll conglomerate some stuff.
The LSJ may be a similar motor, but there is much more to it that just being de-stroked
Does anyone have the specs for both the LSJ crank and the LE5 crank? maybe i could get a custom crank made to avoid the ruluctor and flywheel issues.
I gather that the LE5 rods are NOT forged, so to the 2.4 guys, are there any aftermarket rods for you?
And since the possiblity of a custom crank is there, would it be best to bore out to 91mm and increase stroke to 91?
hmm... i'll conglomerate some stuff.
Last edited by ls1fbody; 02-19-2009 at 02:43 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
02-19-2009, 03:04 PM
#8
Haz l33t wheelz.
Thread Starter
come on Cam, i'm not shooting for numbers like that. Just looking for better performance withut building a race engine.
yes yes, start talking guys haha. But the extra torque from the longer stroke, would help with low end, especially with the tvs moving the powerband up slightly.
i'm out for the night, i'll re-visit this is the morning when i get to work and have time to really dig around.
yes yes, start talking guys haha. But the extra torque from the longer stroke, would help with low end, especially with the tvs moving the powerband up slightly.
i'm out for the night, i'll re-visit this is the morning when i get to work and have time to really dig around.
Last edited by ls1fbody; 02-19-2009 at 03:04 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
02-19-2009, 06:41 PM
#15
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If the LE5 crank fits in the LSJ girdle, you could get a set of custom rods and pistons. Theoretically (if my math is right), you could have a 2.5L if you replaced the sleeves and bored it out to 90mm x the 98mm stroke. Of course, you may need to make a custom crank trigger so the stock/aftermarket ECU can read the timing.
02-19-2009, 06:45 PM
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You need to look at the rod to stroke ratio. If you stroke you going to kill the ratio and it will not be as happy in the high rev range. What these cars need is a ported head, and cams to make power up as high as these things should be revving.
02-19-2009, 06:47 PM
#17
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The more you stroke, the more stress on the rods and side-load on the cylinder walls. Not good for revving.
02-19-2009, 06:48 PM
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Exactly. No one is running a big enough turbo where they need the extra .3 L.
02-19-2009, 08:30 PM
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excellent thread. Good info also. I'll tag this for more knowledge.
Last edited by ralliartist; 02-19-2009 at 08:30 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
02-19-2009, 09:02 PM
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LS1, to tell you the truth, you should just order a cheap shortblock and LE5 crank. Since no one has done this yet, your best bet is to bring it in partly assembled to a good engine builder and have them grab some spec's for you. We can talk all we want on our keyboards, but until someone grabs the parts and finds he rod length/wrist pin locations that are needed, nothing is going to happen.
I guess I could ask one of the Sentra community's best engine builders what his suggestions are. He managed to destroke the QR25DE in the Spec-V with an SR20DET crank.... two completely different engine families.
I guess I could ask one of the Sentra community's best engine builders what his suggestions are. He managed to destroke the QR25DE in the Spec-V with an SR20DET crank.... two completely different engine families.
02-19-2009, 10:17 PM
#21
i gotta ask...why are you doing this? This is an expensive ass project that involves machining and custom parts...and the gains will be minimal for the cost.
I understand beingunique is awesome and all...hell, look at my car, but at what point do you cross the line of being unique and enter the world of just wasting money?
I understand beingunique is awesome and all...hell, look at my car, but at what point do you cross the line of being unique and enter the world of just wasting money?
Last edited by HunterKiller89; 02-19-2009 at 11:08 PM.
02-19-2009, 10:45 PM
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Displacement isn't everything.
02-19-2009, 10:51 PM
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. They asked the same thing when we were building 2.7L 4cyl Sentra engines....
02-20-2009, 01:29 AM
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02-20-2009, 01:50 AM
#25
Haz l33t wheelz.
Thread Starter
ok guys, seriously, this is a four cylinder engine, i'm not gonna be revving past 7500rpm, so your higher rev arguements are null and void.
code Red, excellent point on bringing in the two blocks to a good engine shop, i think that is something i should consider.
why not? the cobalt is just as good a performance platform as any vehicle. Minimal gains? a smaller pulley by itself has minimal gains, but mods build off each other. You could argue any direction you want, but i'm looking for info man, not opinions. 
code Red, excellent point on bringing in the two blocks to a good engine shop, i think that is something i should consider.
i gotta ask...why are you doing this? This is an expensive ass project that involves machining and custom parts...and the gains will be minimal for the cost.
I understand beingunique is awesome and all...hell, look at my car, but at what point do you cross the line of being unique and enter the world of just wasting money?
I understand beingunique is awesome and all...hell, look at my car, but at what point do you cross the line of being unique and enter the world of just wasting money?
Last edited by ls1fbody; 02-20-2009 at 01:50 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost