Makes perfect sense to me. I was thinking that I might've been on the fence for upgrades, but never really thought about the common knowledge that two speakers make more noise than one, so I'd need less power to run them (duh). *Facepalm* I should use my powers of deduction and get cracking on that "Meaning of life" question. Especially since we all know the answer is 42 anyway. Thank you Deep Thought!

 

lol yup in car audio the theory, "doubling either cone area or power will double the volume (3db)" is generally true. So 1 L5s on 500w should be as loud as 2 on 250w. the only gray area is box volume. since 2 12s require more airspace and generally more airspace means more volume as well. So it would take a bit of math to figure out the correct airspace for both to get that theory 100% correct

also remember the L5 square has more cone area then a round speaker. So 2 of them is probably close to triple the cone area of a single round 12

also the box plays a very big role in how loud either one is. so given the right setup that rule can easily be "broken"

 

Just some general info about my old setup stuff.

Those L5's were originally in a ported enclosure, but that box wouldn't fit in the 'balt, so I grabbed a sealed enclosure with 1.21 cubit foot chambers before displacement. After you factor in the sub volume it was probably closer to .8 or so, which is bare minimum for those in a sealed enclosure. I wasn't really thinking much/didn't know as much when I bought that box. It served it's purpose though.

When I bought this sub I knew a little bit more about box displacement and sizing, so I got a box (I was going to build one, but became so busy that I just wanted to get it in there) that was a little bit bigger than max requirements so I could factor in sub displacement. I guess I thought too much about the box, and not enough about the number of subs lol.

The L5's were loud, that's for sure, but sounded a little loose no matter what I did to try and tweak them. Probably due to the smaller box and square cone. I wanted something with about the same amount of ouput power, but with a tighter sound. The Pioneer, while not the best, does sound tighter and more responsive to me. That could also be because there's only one of them though. I wanted to make a move toward loud and clear, as opposed to just loud, and the L5's weren't really doing it for me. I probably could've MADE them sound clear, but I also just wanted something new to play with at the time. I'd had them for a few years, time to move on. LOL

Once I get this stuff straightened out, I'll probably move on to a mid-range component kit for the doors, and probably rip out the 6x9's in the back and replace them with some 6 1/2's or 6 3/4's. At the rate I move, once I'm ready to even think about midbass, I'll be getting rid of the 'balt anyway and starting all over again. ROFL

 

lol well while the l5 squares are loud subs they really sound like ass no matter what. what you need my friend is my setup. lol jk

 

well basically your running too much power than yor alternator can handle alot of people solve this with a cap or extra batteries but that is a small fix and it works since they dont run it all the time if you run it all the time the alternator charges the battery and the cap get a stronger alternator if all of your connections are good and the cap is working good

 

Man your setup is sick. I probably wouldn't hear any of the rattles in the interior anymore, that's for sure. Had a rattle in the front by the sunroof, fixed that by actually putting the bolt back in where they left it out when I had my sunroof replaced. Buzzing from the seatbelt clips/B pillar that drive me nuts. Got a box of second skin waiting on that one. That rear deck is the major pain in the ass though. Vibrates at certain frequencies, other times it sounds so nice in there. Pieced some second skin over the flat areas on the top and bottom, took out the XM receiver, put towels and weather seal under the lid so that it would stop slapping around, and it's still annoying. Found one spot back on the passenger side back by the window that was two metal pieces just rubbing together. Threw some second skin inbetween and around it, which helped some, but there's still buzzing back there. Haven't found all the places where that spot welded pos is buzzing yet. Do you still have issues with yours, or can you even hear it now?

 

lol ya i dont hear anything at all in my car. well the engine noise is very noticeable compared to the rest but all i have is gm stage2 and cai so pretty much "stock" sounds going on there. Once i get my car back im going to use some Motor mat pro and damp pro on the hood and possibly finally go for the firewall. at that point the only piece of metal on my car that hasnt been sound dampened is the fenders. everything else has been or is plastic

 

Oh that reminds me. When I threw that Pioneer in, and was playing some bass tracks to test it out, I was standing back by the trunk and heard my rear bumper rattling. I could push on it and it subsided a lot. I remember reading in one of the threads you posted in that you had a similar issue. Did you ever resolve that? If so, how?

 

nope thats the only rattle i have... and its only herd from outside the car not inside. I really need to take it apart and see what i can do with it but i really dont want to mess with taking the bumper off.

 

Well, damn. I've since turned it down so it doesn't really rattle anymore, so it's not a huge issue. I was just curious.

What all have you done to your back deck? I know you've got a few layers of second skin on the top and bottom. Anything else? And while you were throwing it on there, did you happen to come across any of those areas where the two metal pieces were rubbing together that I might have missed? Makes me cringe every time I hear it. Maybe I'll just turn it into a hatch back and rip it all out. I thought about trying to port that deck and see if any of the air escaping might help, but it's just a pipe dream, since I really wouldn't have the first clue where to start other than cutting holes.

 

well problem is i was originally going to port my subs thru the rear deck so to counteract the vibrations i used alot of it on the rear deck. both liquid and mat. more then a full coverage single layer on BOTH doors. something like 33sqft worth of mat alone and half a gallon of liquid

 

Ah. How come you never went through with it? Or are you still thinking about it?

When I grab a set of components I plan on using the rest of my second skin there. I'll probably end up with buying another 20/40sq. feet to finish that and the pillars up, and hopefully have some left over for whatever creaks arise from that. It's like trying to patch a volleyball net and use it as a life raft.

 

lol not quite that bad. Um main reason for not doing it was space. the box i have is 2.5 or something cubes per chamber so big for sealed but too small for ported. also putting the ports thru the 6X9 holes became pretty much impossible

 

That rattle coming from the back bubmper is the "Styrofoam" like bumper pads the the back bumper sits on. If you take off your licence plate you should be able to see some of it.
If you crawl under the back of the car, and look up between the spare tire well and the bumper you will see what I'm talking about.
Its best to do this while you have some music playing so you can pin point the rattle/s
But I'm sure you already knew that

 

Sweet. Thanks Spun. I'll be sure to remember that when I it's not 30 degrees outside and crawling around on the pavement seems like a good idea. What'd you cram in there to fix the rattle? Just add some second skin?

 

huh... nope ive looked under there for the wheel well rattle and once after to look at the taking off the bumper but didnt really look for the rattle since the car was off. maybe ill check it out but like i said i cant hear it inside so ill probably do that at a later date

 

we did a 146 with an M3 and a single 9510 dual 2 ohm coils in a 2002 civic, I don't know what the final numbers were when the finished box went in since the car was sold. Nasty subs but they aren't really a low hitting sub from my experiences. I would go with the 3500 series myself unless it's for competitions.

I located the source of the problem. It wasn't the amp making the noise at all. Issue with a cap inside my 6 disc changer, i get a bit of high freq. background noise during quiet parts of songs. I actually thought it was the headunit. I'm using a clarin drz9255 head but it's the signal coming from the changer. It's gone if i use the optical cable too so I'll be putting the optical permanently into my truck ( just tested with it). I have a brand new M2a at the shop if you're interested and it's already in Canada so should make it easier, full warranty on it too.

 

how do you tune the boxes for the 9500s? they get as low as any other DD we've done. hell even the 8 gets the lows pretty good

 

Whenever I've tried tuning them low the subs have a lot more control issues than others in DD's lineup using similar power.... I've tried a few different things with them and had success but still not what I was hoping to achieve. Having said that I'm not going to argue with anyone that they are insane for what there competitors have, I might just have had too high of expectations for them. Our installer is running 4 9515's and seems to really like them but I think his peak freq. is still fairly high. I'm very impressed with the 1500 series now that there are dual voice coil options given there pricing.

I've done a few boxes with the 8's and they sounded really good but I've always had to build fairly small ported enclosures to give them better control and power handling(not that it's a bad thing to have a smaller than "normal" enclosure). I dunno I guess I just expected a lot more out of the 9500 series.

If you think there 8's are crazy try out the 6.5 Mid-basses they have.... very easy to use as a sub too. I'm running them for my low's in my 3 way setup in my truck and I love em, not running any sub other than these.

 

those i havent played with unfortunately. what do you normally tune them to? its really all 40hz around here. ive noticed exactly what ur talking about but seems prevelant on all the speakers we tried tuned lower then 40.

check out the 9518 below... bandpass
http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/i...0f4828e0cf.jpg
http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/i...d392a24dce.jpg
http://c2.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/i...d9ec6fa1a1.jpg

 

That bandpass will be badass for sure... I dunno what it is if it's just because the mass of the cone is so low but you really need to load these drivers in the enclosure and I'm sure a bandpass will do that perfectly, We dont get the opportunity to do too many bandpasses around here. We carry memphis and DD exclusively and also have done lots with RE. RE and memphis I can tune to 32 Hzish and they love it but the DD's just don't perform like i'd expect. For raw competition you just can't touch the DD's though.

My 6.5's I have tuned to 42 Hz. They run into the same trouble as the rest of the DD's, I've set my crossover at 45Hz on 12db slope on my deck and a 40Hz cross on the amp at 24db slope but anything below that and they go beyond there excursion with fairly low power, they were really finicky to build an enclosure for but I can't be more happy with them.

 

wow ya i've never tried them that low. for re we normally do 34-38, lol i cant imagine a dd in the 32hz but i've herd of a few dealers pulling it off. oh well

 

I personally will never build a box below 35.... but the boss likes to make himself vomit from that low sound so he tries to build everything at 30.

 

lol sealed ftw

 

Prefer the sound of a passive radiating system myself