Smoking Issue (lsj turbo)
08-04-2011, 01:10 AM
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Smoking Issue (lsj turbo)
First thing's first:
What I'm sure of:
(1) It's a Hahn s20g turbo, and it was brand new never used/installed when I bought it. Obviously it's been used as of late.
(2) Yes there was fresh oil upon first start up
(3) No the return line is not kinked. I checked myself after the problem started.
(4) No there is no restriction on the feed line. And the feed and return lines came from zzperformance (Cobalt & Ion ---> ZZ Performance).
Okay, here's the background. When I first started up the car, we idled it for a good long while, both before we drove it, and after it was driven and somewhat tuned. Nothing...no smoke, no bitching, no moaning...just boost and jizz. It stayed in storage for three more months until I picked it up and took it to a friend's baby shower. Drove it for an hour to get there, and then another hour to get home. Nothing, no smoke, a little boost, a little pssshhh from the bov, and a little more jizz. Three days after this, I drove to my tuner's house (about a 45 minute drive on the freeway). No smoke, but I did notice the engine temps were unsually high at idle (200 and rising until I forced the fans to kick on). Then I get to his house and park in his driveway, which is an incline, and turn the car off. Five minutes later (literally) I turned the car back on to go for a drive/tune, and bam....the car's smoking like I just put Seafoam in her. And that's the way she acted the whole time during the drive/tuning.
Between talking to my tuner and his buddy (both are pretty much gurus when it comes to mitsubishi turbos), we've narrowed it down to most likely being just a need for a restriction on the feed line. But I kind of wanted to hear other opinions (particularly from anyone that has a Hahn 20g) on the subject. I'm completely open to ideas, even worst case scenarios. It's definitely oil getting into the exhaust...I can tell from the smell and color.
What I'm sure of:
(1) It's a Hahn s20g turbo, and it was brand new never used/installed when I bought it. Obviously it's been used as of late.
(2) Yes there was fresh oil upon first start up
(3) No the return line is not kinked. I checked myself after the problem started.
(4) No there is no restriction on the feed line. And the feed and return lines came from zzperformance (Cobalt & Ion ---> ZZ Performance).
Okay, here's the background. When I first started up the car, we idled it for a good long while, both before we drove it, and after it was driven and somewhat tuned. Nothing...no smoke, no bitching, no moaning...just boost and jizz. It stayed in storage for three more months until I picked it up and took it to a friend's baby shower. Drove it for an hour to get there, and then another hour to get home. Nothing, no smoke, a little boost, a little pssshhh from the bov, and a little more jizz. Three days after this, I drove to my tuner's house (about a 45 minute drive on the freeway). No smoke, but I did notice the engine temps were unsually high at idle (200 and rising until I forced the fans to kick on). Then I get to his house and park in his driveway, which is an incline, and turn the car off. Five minutes later (literally) I turned the car back on to go for a drive/tune, and bam....the car's smoking like I just put Seafoam in her. And that's the way she acted the whole time during the drive/tuning.
Between talking to my tuner and his buddy (both are pretty much gurus when it comes to mitsubishi turbos), we've narrowed it down to most likely being just a need for a restriction on the feed line. But I kind of wanted to hear other opinions (particularly from anyone that has a Hahn 20g) on the subject. I'm completely open to ideas, even worst case scenarios. It's definitely oil getting into the exhaust...I can tell from the smell and color.
08-04-2011, 03:04 AM
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Well I don't have a hahn turbo but I do have a garrett turbo(new 0 miles on it)when I installed it and it did the same thing it smoked a lot and oil was in my exhaust tip and I was told I had a blown gasket. I needed a oil restrictor, so i had to get it rebuilt.
08-04-2011, 09:07 AM
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never ran a restrictor on my S20g. Only smoked sometimes when the hahn oil drain would back up. I got a bung welded in the pan and never had the problem anymore.
08-04-2011, 11:40 AM
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if your running your oil feed off of the cylinder head then you shouldnt need a restrictor. if your running your oil feed off of the oil pressure switch then you will need a 0.060" restrictor.
08-05-2011, 05:49 AM
#10
personal oppinion. a combination of problems. which have already been said. one, not all turbos need a restrictor. however. if your crank case has too much pressure and cant feed it all back into the intake, its going to push oil past the turbo seals. that being said. replace your oil cap with a breather filter and/or get a catch can/expansion tank so the crank case pressure has somewhere to go. my theory, there was just enough pressure after the turbo swap to start pushing oil and not just vapors through the stock pcv, while the engine was turned off it became a solid mass which blocked flow and then started pushing more oil through the turbo because you don't have a restrictor.
same theory for loss in oil pressure and a need for a restrictor. without a turbocharger, your engine is like a single path electrical system, it only has one path to go and thats the one its gonna take. and that path, when stock, is very restrictive. so when you add an oil lubricated turbo, like an electrical system in parallel(less restrictive), all that pressure says "hey!!!! we found another path!!!!" and it tries to equalized itself between the turbo and the engine, some times cause a loss in oil pressure in the engine and an over-supplied turbo.
so in other words, check your pcv, you may need something better flowing. fix that and you won't need a restrictor.
ooooooor, worst case scenario, your engine said hey **** your ass my rings are done, and your compression is now down in the dumps.
but what do i know, i'm drunk right now.
same theory for loss in oil pressure and a need for a restrictor. without a turbocharger, your engine is like a single path electrical system, it only has one path to go and thats the one its gonna take. and that path, when stock, is very restrictive. so when you add an oil lubricated turbo, like an electrical system in parallel(less restrictive), all that pressure says "hey!!!! we found another path!!!!" and it tries to equalized itself between the turbo and the engine, some times cause a loss in oil pressure in the engine and an over-supplied turbo.
so in other words, check your pcv, you may need something better flowing. fix that and you won't need a restrictor.
ooooooor, worst case scenario, your engine said hey **** your ass my rings are done, and your compression is now down in the dumps.
but what do i know, i'm drunk right now.
08-05-2011, 08:26 AM
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^^^I am using a catch can, but I think I might just go a different route considering what's happening. I should mention though that it's the air-compressor catch can from the write-up someone posted here a while back. Got any idea where to pick up a breather for the oil cap?
i'm using mobil 1.
i'm using mobil 1.
08-05-2011, 03:30 PM
#13
^^^I am using a catch can, but I think I might just go a different route considering what's happening. I should mention though that it's the air-compressor catch can from the write-up someone posted here a while back. Got any idea where to pick up a breather for the oil cap?
i'm using mobil 1.
i'm using mobil 1.
08-05-2011, 08:36 PM
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I see my 500hp friend...
Do you think I should still put a restrictor on the feed line along with the breather cap? Or should I just do one thing at a time? And will the breather replace the catch can, or should I still get one?
Tom, if I would love to take you up on that offer. I know school starts up soon, so if you want to stop by my job whenever you are on campus. PM me and we can talk more buddy
:
Do you think I should still put a restrictor on the feed line along with the breather cap? Or should I just do one thing at a time? And will the breather replace the catch can, or should I still get one?
Tom, if I would love to take you up on that offer. I know school starts up soon, so if you want to stop by my job whenever you are on campus. PM me and we can talk more buddy
:
Last edited by mexi_loco; 08-05-2011 at 08:36 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
08-05-2011, 09:12 PM
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it just seems weird to get a restrictor considering i tapped the pan for the return and the feed line is tapped right into the block. Not to mention I've never heard of a 20g, regular of hahn's 20g, needing a restrictor. I don't mind getting one, don't get me wrong. I'm just glad I didn't fry the seal between the exhaust part of the turbo and the compressor side.
08-05-2011, 10:17 PM
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Get a breather from ZZP. Search Oil cap breather. Its listed under the 3800. I still think you will need a restrictor. Either way vent that crank case pressure and block the pcv port on the head. Then the only pressure you will have is blow by, which the breather will take care of and run a catch can off the port on the back side of the cover.
08-06-2011, 03:53 AM
#21
Get a breather from ZZP. Search Oil cap breather. Its listed under the 3800. I still think you will need a restrictor. Either way vent that crank case pressure and block the pcv port on the head. Then the only pressure you will have is blow by, which the breather will take care of and run a catch can off the port on the back side of the cover.
08-06-2011, 09:24 AM
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guess I forgot to mention that the catch can I'm running goes from the pcv port on the valve cover to the ram air intake. Does that make a difference???
08-06-2011, 09:33 AM
#23
The stock breather system is crap. And don't use the Oil Cap Breather. Its a band-aid for a larger problem. Doesn't really fix anything... and it can end up blowing oil all over your valve cover.
Take the Valve Cover off, chop off and drill out the stock Breather Port, weld on a -10an or -12an fitting, do the same to your intake pipe, get a larger catch can, get some AN lines, and then install it all. If you want to get serious and baller, use a vacuum pump activated via a Hobbs switch.
Take the Valve Cover off, chop off and drill out the stock Breather Port, weld on a -10an or -12an fitting, do the same to your intake pipe, get a larger catch can, get some AN lines, and then install it all. If you want to get serious and baller, use a vacuum pump activated via a Hobbs switch.
08-06-2011, 09:47 AM
#25
Yes, basically. He didn't do it to be cool, or JDM, yo. Quite a few of us have been preaching to do that for years now. Our PCV system is a joke. Big time. That's another thing GM learned and improved upon with the LNF, among other things. His was a bit more complex though, as he removed the inner baffles, as well. You don't NEED to do that, as that'll also jack your price up, if you're hiring someone to weld your stuff.
I've got a spare Valve Cover in my garage, if you want one to have done while you continue to drive your car.
I've got a spare Valve Cover in my garage, if you want one to have done while you continue to drive your car.