Did a big build over easter, pistons, rods, ported head etc.

She ran afterwards, but not well. I recently found a good sized crack in my INT cam phaser for the VVT, currently waiting on that part to arrive.

As I said in my other thread:

Car is dead in driveway, died a week ago on the way to work while taking a turn over some railroad tracks. Was just above idle and then after the light jostle of crossing the tracks i noticed the engine had cut out. No cough sputter or wheeze, almost seemed like an electrical switch had been flipped. I coasted to a halt, put her in park and went to start it up. Starter would only click, not turn over. Pulled battery, starter and did a major ground terminal cleanup. Starter tested good, battery cranked 709 CCAs so it wasn't those. Reinstalled everything and she cranked, but laboured some and slower than usual. I used the downtime to clean up and inspect the whole setup to try and figure where I'm seized. Instead I noticed my INT cam phaser was cracked good, and likely pissing oil out its side and messing with vvt!

Does this seem like laboured cranking? No load, plugs pulled and no belt on the damper.

MVI 0626 - YouTube

Oil filter innards:



Cracked cam phaser:



Is a ZZP crate engine in my future?

 

Unless you have an internal transmission issue then yes it is cranking much harder than it should be. With plugs and belt off out/removed you should be able to turn engine over easily with a 3/8 or 1/2 hand ratchet on the crank pully bolt.

 

I had some what of the same issue when I replaced my engine in my 03 crap-a-lier. Found it was a bad ground on the chasie. After that vehicle started everytime. I would use a volt meter and check all the ohms. And make sure that everything is at top dead center on the cams. Even being off one tooth and cause starting issues and idel rough.

 

Definitely should crank easier than that. Unless you bent a rod, I can't think of why it would crank so hard, but also can't think of how you would've done that with new ones

 

Being off one tooth in these motors can result in bent valves and no start or idle

 

She was in Park, not sure but I don't think I've tried in neutral. Hand cranking required some effort even when she was head/oil pan off, but it was doable and not insane stiff. I'll try tomorrow but I'm pretty sure she'll be nice and stiff.


Yeah, after it wouldn't crank I did a major ground cleanup, every single one I could find has been removed, ground clean to bare metal and wiped with electrical solvent including Battery posts. Fuse box has been vacuumed, airblown and spayed with contact cleaner. I've cleaned every single sensor I know of as well.

 

With the head off the motor should spin pretty freely because all you are turning is the crank, oil pump, and water pump. If there's spots where it seems to catch, something is wrong

 

Metal flakes = rod bearing?

 

Oil pan coming off likely tomorrow.

ZZP rods and new rod bearings, if I cant hand crank it my intention is to loosen off the rod bolts and try again. I'll also be able to see a bit of the bore when piston is tdc, hard to see looking through the plug hole/intake.

It would be sweet not to have to pull my head...at least I used arp studs so gasket only $$$

 

if you said it was hard before leads me to think rod bearing or piston to cylinder wall clearances to tight.

 

I think you are definitely gonna have to pull the head. It's a bitch but not much you can do about it

 

click

 

This is what I suspect....But, they looked good going in (and slipped down the bore with ease) and seemed to have decent gap. Heat cycled is another ball game though.

 

Dropped oil pan, couldn't spin crank with my large crank spanner, had to use starter to budge it. Cylinder #1 is missing oil squirter nozzle. I have no idea how or where it went, hopefully on the ground as it wasn't in my oil pan. Did a couple quick revolutions, the parts I can see of all bores look very good, so that is good news. Ordered squirter, rod bearings and head gasket. I work afternoons this week so I have a few hours a day to fiddle with this and strip her back down by Friday when the parts arrive.

 

Also you didn't block off or not seal the oil pump pick up in the pan with RTV causing oil starvation? What about head gasket? are they directional? been awhile since ive had one off.

 

Missing oil squirter could have overheated/siezed that piston. Pull the head.

 

And the verdict is...

#2 rod bearing:


up close:


The oil piston squirter baffled me, I took every effort to ensure they were not damaged during piston installation. They were not, every squirter got hit by every piston skirt with only #1 breaking off.


Inspected the other 3, aside from a slight bend they are fine and will stay in 1 piece. Shaved all 4 slugs at the appropriate squirter location so that is that. ******* Wiseco, guess I should have went JE from ZZP and got a known quantity.

And the killer blow:


Satin finish. Torquing #2 rod beyond 10ftlbs seizes crank nicely. Other 3 rods are torqued to 60 and crank freewheels just dandy until #2.

Options? Crank throw rod journal is pooched( fairly sure...could be rod too but it looked the same as other 3 after removal), I don't imagine they can remachine it with crank in engine? So not worth it imho, splitting block is crazy $$$ and I'll bet I can get a ZZP girdled block for about the same.

 

If you have the block out of the car it isn't bad to pull the crank, but as you said it's a lot of work and almost isnt worth it compared to getting a built block. Or even another stock used shortblock is cheaper/easier at that point.

 

Rod innards:



I hope those ZZP girdled blocks come with a crank, says on website:
-Includes upper and lower block portions, bolts.

Lol ZZP: GM ACDelco - Piston Oil Squirters (Gen2) #GM-12596230 Gen 2 piston oil squirters are tubular instead of cast like the gen 1 design. This allows adjustment needed when running aftermarket pistons.

Now you tell me.

 

don't think the girdled blocks come with a crank. highly doubt it

 

you do not get a new crank when you purchase their girdled block. i bought one for my LSJ about 3 weeks ago. you get the block and the girdle pretty much with some other hardware. thats about it.

 

damn.

Well that dont help and for $1600+ after shipping does me no good. I'm going to ask if they have a spare crank, their crate engine is nice but a bit rich at over $2700 shipped.

Anyone know what stealerships charge for cranks? Not a single LE5 in the crashyards around here, and I wouldn't want it anyways as they charge $900 for an engine with no guarantees.

 

CED has LE5 cranks for $320. My list so far

12791966 Ecotec LE5 Crankshaft 1257818 $318.49 1 $318.49
12591092 Ecotec Crank Shaft Bearing Kit 12591092 $27.54 1 $27.54
12591866 Ecotec Rear Main Seal 12591866 $22.58 1 $22.58
11571239 Ecotec Main Girdle Bolt 11571239 $3.25 20 $65.00
11588733 Ecotec Main Girdle Bolt 11588733 $6.14 10 $61.40
11589123 Ecotec Balancer Bolt 11589123 $4.76 1 $4.76
12591093 Ecotec Rod Bearing Kit 12591093 $28.29 1 $28.29
12596230 Ecotec Piston Oiler Nozzle LNF 12596230 $16.02 3 $48.06
12584041 Ecotec Timing Cover Seal 12584041 $7.80 1 $7.80
11588844 Ecotec Cam Gear Bolt 11588844 $2.81 2 $5.62
90236536 Ecotec Flexplate Bolt 90236536 $6.14 6 $36.84

I'm pretty sure the 3 flex/TC bolts are reusable.

Still waiting on shop to confirm what I think I know, I'll order as soon as I hear it from them and have the car towed back to me. Going to pull block myself, everything is already striped save the water pump unit and peripherals on the backside and I'm down to 7 bellhousing bolts and the transaxle brace. I'll take my time, figure another 3 weeks so I can do this properly with plastigauge and feeler strips so I can catch problems before I go to reinstall.

I was reading a post from maven that alldata has shortblock removal at like 17.5 hours billable. No thanks, I have no stomach for that and will do this myself.

 

so wait i'm supposed to adjust my oil squirters on my gen 2 block?

 

If you are running aftermarket pistons I'd tap those squirters down a bit to be safe, wish I'd known that the first time around as I ended up finding that #1 nozzle lodged up my oil sump siphon.