I got my aem off eBay for 170, much more pull than my homemade Sri, checked my ltft's and was at 0.0

 

The K&N filter has a metal clip that holds the filter together, its runs laterally down one side of the filter. When you place the filter onto the intake tube, that metal clip should be facing directly upright, and slightly to the right. If you think of a analog clock, the hour hand's placement at 12:30.

The K&N on the filter will now be upside down.

Huge Thanks to CudaJoe for this find.

 

I am not so sure it is the best overall it is the best SRI IMHO. I have tested every intake out there and I actually prefer the AEM CAI and the Hahn CAI once tuned for.

 

Is it like that with most intakes? I ask cuz I'll praly end up puttin my injen one on today

 

That, I'm not sure of. I know the K&N caused my CEL to go off with with the filter positioned incorrectly. It was the most bizarre thing I've ever seen, personally, where filter position effects fuel trims. People with ways to test have all said that the AEM and the K&N skew the fuel trims the "least". My guess would be, hold off on the injen intake until you can tune for it.

 

Think you could throw in a quick photo or two of this? I think I got the idea, but a picture always makes things the clearest.

 

would it mess up anything? I dont plan on gettin tuned for atleast another couple of months, but I got it now.. and I don't wnat it jus sittin in me room ya dig

 

I think you need to restate the question to as what are the advantages and disadvanteges


better? Is a relative word..

SRI

Easier to swap to factory

Easier to clean/change filter


CAI

Water can get sucked into filter if driving through a 1ft+ puddle slowly

Air while idling is generally cooler creating better idling and once you get going it sucks the cleanest coldest air from the bottom of engine bay. creating that minor 1 to 2 HP difference.. I think once the car gets going you can't even tell the difference, besides the Cold air really makes the stock blow off sound loud .. SRI does it too but it isn't as distinguished ..

Another thing is price..


If your brothers v8 is new enough to be tuned any intake is probably doing more damage than good without tuning it ..


I always say if you live with a lot of snow/dirt/ rain storms that create huge puddles a lot and you use this car as a daily driver .. get the sri


If its mostly just a toy/dd and you can take something else out on rainy days get the cold air k&n IF they are still making it.


Your brother said Cold air is better because it makes more power and I think the op needs to understand what better means ..



To me more power is usually always my answer for "better"

Some might think the build quality etc are the factors making it better , sounds like your bro is all about go and no show... good for him..


The K&N is listed as the best for this car do to the MAF sensor location and fuel trims..... Simply other manufacturers besides a COUPLE are within the tolerances we would like to see. K&N or AEM

 

The CAI does not have 2-3 HP over the SRI in this implementation.

With the current K&N SRI solution, for instance, the temps are hardly over ambient... and that's even before the intercooler has an opportunity to cool the air.

If two pipes of the same diameter are used as an intake, the shorter pipe will always win as far as efficiency. Longer pipes lead to losses, and the longer they are, the more losses they will have. I've even mathematically proven this in a prior thread somewhere on here.

Anyway, CAIs overcome this in N/A applications, due to them not having any other way to get cooler air than what they suck up to begin with. In turbo applications, although intake/IAT1 temps are still important, the intercooler is still going to help offset that to a point. Add to this that the K&N SRI keeps the temp down to begin with, and you've got a clear winner.

 

haha, thanks I just noticed this. I was the first to notice this phenomenon and I think one other member on here that was also one of the first to get a K&N intake saw the same crazy thing when I presented this case on here.

I left the Aeroforce guage I have on Ltfts and Stfts and just watched how they moved with the filter positioned in the (6:00) position which I thought was originally correct. They skewed sooo bad on throttle and idle, it moved my ltfts to the extremes that I could not feel comfortable with. Then I took the intake apart and put the stocker setup back on with the K&N drop in. watched fuel trims and took note of the differences. saw that the stocker keeps the numbers between +7.0 and -7.0, never held a higher number for longer than a tenth of a second after letting off the throttle or just getting on it.

^ so with that I knew where I felt safe with for the fuel trims. I put the K&N back on and then realized the fliter was not symetrical... and for some reason I thought of putting it upside down. My fuel trims looked really close to the behavior that the stock airbox with a K&N drop in. WoW!!! I reported that on here in the K&N SRI thread that was 30 pages or so ago now. lol. Another member tried my idea and noticed the same thing which verified that it isnt a fluke. I then started rotating the filter to the left (11:00 to 9:00) and notice fuel trims go postive for ltft. Then I rotated to the right (1:00-2:00) and notice the fuel trims went in a negative direction for ltft. I also noticed if you go to far right the filter leans on the heatshield so thats as far as i could go, lol. When I tested these different positions, I drove the car 30+ miles of stop and go traffic, and highway mixed. This seemed like ideal testing enviroment.

My next test was take it to the track and beat on it for a few runs. The car didnt throw a CEL and the fuel trims stayed in my "safety" range I decided based on the stock air box. I have not thrown a CEL to date for this intake and I got it back in April??? I've driven in cold enviroments and hot enviroments. I've driven LOONGG distance.. 10 hrs of driving. No codes. I 've raced the car on the quarter mile. I agree though the intake should be tuned for best performance. But it works without a tune as far as I know based on my experiences and apparently others are experiencing the wierd changing airflow phenomena as well, lol.

 

I think it mainly falls on the offset filter K&N provides and how close the filter sits near the MAF sensor. Im betting if you throw a normal filter thats not offset on the intake, you might see the skew fuel trims that all other intakes experience at an extreme.

 

There is a whole thread about what an intake can do to your engine if you are not tuned for it. The fuel trims will be so off that you could potentially really hurt the motor in the long run. hole in a piston of stuff. I'd still advise against it, until the tune.


CudaJoe- np for the props! Thanks for the find. I'm CEL free goin on 4 weeks since I rotated the filter to 12:30.

 

Good to know, I have the AEM CAI.

The short ram intakes have advantages like have been said, easier to clean the filter, etc. But, the true cold air intakes are the best for power. Forget dyno comparisions, because the hood is open and they have fans running to keep things cool. On a hot day when the hood is closed and you're sitting at a stop light or in the staging lanes you will get heat soak under the hood. That's hot air is what your intake is sucking in with a short ram. I know people will say the intercooler will cool the intake back down, but that's only going to work well if you are moving at highway speed or partway down the track. Check your delta temps in and out, the hotter the air in, the hotter it will be going out. Trust me, initially when you take off, the intake air will be hot and the IAT will pull timing. You'll lose power, simple as that. Your choice, convenience (short ram) or power (CAI).

 

That would be true if the SRI actually did bring in hotter air in our case. This summer I did a test about this exact theory (for Ronn I believe it was). I had between 1-3 degrees warmer air than what was outside. I doubt any intake could get any better than that.

Intercooler aside, the SRI is still legit for our purposes. That's all I'm saying.

For people with the K&N SRI... here's a do-it-yourself experiment for you to prove my point: Going highway speed, just push the clutch and watch the fuel trims. You'll get a very negative trim (if you have an RPD, you'll probably see it go rich), that will decrease to zero as you slow down. Air is coming in through the hood crack and directly going into the intake. It doesn't get any cooler than that. (no pun intended.... well okay, maybe it was... lol) I've even got a really dirty spot right there on my filter to back it up.

 

I have no idea what you're trying to show with that. All you're doing is demonstrating DFCO, which should always take your fuel trims to 0 while you decelerate, unless you've screwed something up with your tune.

 

It sure does when you are stopped and idling. How much depends on whether you have a heatshield and how well the heatshield blocks off the air from the engine compartment. Insulating and improving the heatshield would help a lot on a SRI.

 

It doesn't if you've got the engine idling by being on the clutch. It's not connected to the tranny at that point, so the engine would shut off if it cut gas at that point. You're correct about DFCO in general though, but that's not what I'm talking about.

My point is simply that it throws off the trims due to the air flowing into the bay/intake at speed. This is why it throws off the trims at speed and proportionally decreases as speed decreases until you're idling the engine with a trim of 0 at 0mph.

Because high power at idle is what it's all about. Seriously? The second you start moving, it's cool again. I'd wager at a quicker rate too, since it's getting blown on directly from the outside vs locked inside a compartment next to the engine, and being fed through a foglight hole. lol

My stock "cold air" intake wasn't any different on the idle temp build-up though, if that's what you're worried about.

If you really are worried about heat buildup with the SRI at stop/idle, I've got a "7-11 mod" I'm working on that may interest you. It should be dirt cheap and pretty effective. You can even customize it to pull air through that bottom compartment, if that's what you want.

 

i have dejon intake with k&n headshield up for grabs.

 

Def will be looking into the K&N now after getting the extra cash... want to see how much this car payment is going to hurt my "Stupid things I buy" fund

 

If you're getting negative fuel trims while clutching in, it just means that you're getting less air than you've tuned it for, and you need to fix the MAF correction table. So why are you trying to advertise this as a good thing?

Edit:nm. Can't fix it if that's the situation you're describing. I still don't understand why you're saying this is proving something good. It's not. It's really annoying, and happens with cai, other cars and intake setups. All it means is that there is turbulence at or near the MAF. So what?

 

Even if it cooled down in "only" one second after moving from a stop, that's halfway through the 60' at the dragstrip which is the most critical. So, you don't think it's a problem having hot air getting sucked in and pulling timing as you launch off the starting line? Whatever, have fun with your short ram, I'll keep my cold air intake.

 

A better expirement to check Intake temps would be to monitor IAT1 vs ambient temp. at a stand still IAT1 will start climbing to higher temps. When moving they drop to just 2-3 degrees above ambient temp... Then monitor the IAT2 vs ambient temp to see how the intercooler is functioning. If it is functioning properly, you should see the same numbers as IAT1.

 

I'm saying that as far as I have been able to tell between a CAI and SRI, the heat build-up when stopped is functionally THE SAME for our vehicles. I've monitored both configurations. I'm not saying that everybody has to have a SRI or something... I'm simply giving counterpoints based on real evidence. Plus, I don't know about your setup, but traction is an issue for us from a dig regardless. Do you launch at full throttle from a dig in this car?



I understand what you're saying, but the way the air hits the MAF is a big part of that. You basically explained what I'm trying to explain. There's a very small amount of air coming through due to the engine during this time (what is tuned for), so the air/turbulence hitting the MAF wierdly is directly due to this outside flow. I'm simply stating that you can see that airflow is coming in unrelated to the engine's requirements and is hitting that MAF, causing the skew. That's all.

Here's a more in-depth explanation on my point from a while back:



Anyway, just sayin'. /my tangent

 

I dont have an intake on my car. I run the car open at the inlet like on big turbo supras LOL
J/K

Ummm, I guess I should say something relevant......I LIKE MY HAHN CAI....but I dont know nuthin bout cars so....

 

You don't like it nearly as much when we run...