I seen that, thanks!! So for 189.99 I get a catless DP that will throw a code, and for 229.99 I get a catless DP that wont throw a code because of the angled o2 bung?

 

Correct.

And on the votes. Inherrently the company who has sold dowpipes the longest or the most will always have the most votes. This doesn't make them better.

Let's say a new company came around and no one had heard of them but god their parts. Guess what? They'd get zero votes.

You see this in the other section of the forum with Hahn and ZZP on LSJs. Look at something from a year ago and now. The products haven't changed but the voting is completely different as people get to use ZZPs stuff.

In the 3800 market, all the vendors sold downpipes. After some time it became apparent that ZZP had the best parts and the best pricing. I don't expect this market to be any different. If there is a better way to do something we do it. If there is a better material, we use it. This is why we have water jet cut flanges, 100% 304 stainless pipes, flawless tig welds and interlock flexes. No one else can say that, and no one else shows pictures of their welds close up.

 

sub'd to see the reaction from others about that post ^^

interesting statement.

 

i just installed an XTC from CA and have had no problems with it

 

i love hahn parts but i got the cia dp due to me feeling the need to support local companies

 

Hahn catless dp ftw

 

I'd say if you want a catted DP go with CIA or Hahn. (I like their cats better) If you want a off road DP then go with ZZP (it's only a metal tube with one bend lol), might as well buy the cheapest.

 

IIRC ZZP uses magnaflow Cat's right?
I thought magnaflow cat's were liked by most people . I didn't have any trouble with the ones i've had.

 

Yeah magnaflows are nice. But I'm pretty sure the cats CIA and Hahn are higher performance. I believe a 5% power loss over non-catted DPs. Pretty much like not having a cat at all.

 

We've tested on the flow bench and the dyno our Mag cats over the 'race style' and ours make more power every time. People in the 3800 market are well aware of this and it cost one of our competitors all their credibility. We're pretty much the only company selling DPs there now.

We've spent a lot of money testing many cats. We do this type of R&D for all our products. We try and make them perform better than any other company's because we use them ourselves. We advertise our expertise by being the fastest. We can't do this with parts that aren't quite as good as other vendors. They have to be the best or our cars will not be the best. If our cars aren't the best, we lose our entire promotion strategy and have nothing left.

We did the first few like that. We just use an angled bung now. Looks similar to others.

 

Hmmm? Well, we definitely haven't been selling downpipes the longest in this market, but we sure do offer the best.

We don't use water jet cut, rather we use laser cut flanges, 100% 304 stainless, flawless tig welds and interlock flex couplers. So your comment above is un-founded.

As for hi-flow converters, we have been using the metal metrix converters for over 6 years now. Magnaflow just released their metel matrix converters roughly one year ago. No difference other than they use a spun-down body instead of formed. Anything other than metal matrix is old school ceramic and does NOT flow as well.

We have been posting pictures since day one. Not just the finished products but prototype, to pre-production to perfection. This is the largest picture I could find, I can look harder if you like.

You can clearly see this is American made 304 stainless as depicted by the mill, "Rath Gibson". You can even read the heat number laser etched on the tubing.

Your turn to post a picture: close-up please.

 

is it getting hot in here?

 

Only if you get too close to those BEAUTIFUL Mig welds on the outside and INSIDE of the flanges on CIA's product. Their picture doesn't show the INSIDE welds. Those welds are a good indication of the overall quality of their product. They designed the product on the basis of quality and then priced it accordingly, They didn't set the price and then design the product around that. I, for one am very satisfied with CIA's products and will gladly pay the extra couple of $ for anything they make, based on what I already have.

 

perfectly said!

 

Dan, first let me say that I commend you for your use of 100% stainless. It's a rare quality that a vendor actually has a 100% 304 stainless part. The statement of having your flanges laser cut tells me that you're serious about ensuring you're making a good piece. The welds also look very nice.

I have a few questions and comments.

-What is the cpi count of your converter? Who makes it?

-What is the thickness of your 4 bolt front flange?

-Are you using a 4" long flex?

-How much is your downpipe with and without cat?

Metal matrix catalytic converters use a metal core instead of ceramic. They can withstand shock, vibration and physical impact better then a ceramic core. Running rich can will melt and break-up some ceramic cores, as seen in the LSJ section of the forum. Metal cats are less prone to failure from running a bad tune. The problem with them is that they are more restrictive than the series of ceramic core we use and can clog over time. Ceramic can as well but cpi count is key here. Go to the Grand Prix message boards. Ask them how Random Tech downpipes work. RT was the premier vendor there and uses the metal cats to this day. But people have learned. We've dyno'd turbo cars and gained 100WHP from removing a restrictive cat.



welding:

 

whoa

Weld Looks good ZZP!! geez

 

Thank you. We are frequently told "these are the best welds I've seen in my life" by people in the trade. We pride ourselves on it.


On the laser cut flanges used by CIA and many companies. Laser cut flanges are expensive and very nice. The finish is clean and they go above and beyond what any cheaper company will do. ZZP used to use laser cut flanges and we still have parts here from doing so. In the course of discussion on our products I asked if laser cutting was the best. I was tired of problems and other people picking at me for making claims as such. The reply was "Zoom, laser cut flanges are above and beyond the application needs" I replied, that's not what I asked. I said is it the best. "Well, no...we could do water jet flanges." So we did. The following pictures show the differences and frankly I'm still angry to this day that at one point my guys believed our parts were "good enough" when they could have been better.

Laser cutting adds heat to the material and cause cause warping in larger pieces. This is seen below wiht the header flange on the table. Below that you can see the finish on the edges. Lasers leave a tiny bit of slag at the start and stop and the finish is not as smooth as the water jet flange shown in the picture. Our water jet flanges have a finish so smooth it appears sanded.





Picture of our water jet LNF flange. This is not touched up, smudges are from dirty fingers.

 

From what I'm reading laser/water jet is a wash (I think that's a pun) unless you're making parts for the Shuttle.
http://www.teskolaser.com/waterjet_cutting.html#process

 

zzp do you guys offer a catted cut out down pipe like cia????? i think this is the best of both world....plus i cant offord the v-band set up from hahn

 

ZZP if you only backed your products like this I would have a ZZP windshield banner in no time

 

ZZP should do a group buy and even if they did like 20 dollars off or even free shipping it would still be a great deal.

 

I'm still on the stock downpipe for now...

I gotta say it's pretty cool to see that CAI and ZZP take pride in their work. Keep it up!

 

wish I could get a hold of ZZP... I want your DP!!!

 

email me any time- stattama@aol.com. It's tough to get through to us by phone based on the number of people calling in.

 

you can email customerservice@zzperformance.com or get to Matt or I directly. We handle about 100 orders a day so it can't be that hard to get ahold of us

I forgot to mention, not only is ZZP nearly 1/2 the price of some of these companies, we also off a $50 recycle credit if you return your old cat. Clearly the pictures posted show that a few companies are offering very high quality products for the LNF, but ZZP is is nearly 1/2 the price of our competitors. Should be a no brainer.