Any ideas on what it would be like for a SS/TC to be running on Meth??

 

Its great........I have had mine on for 6 months

 

Really?? That's whats up. What kit did you buy?? how did you install it?? and how do you have it set??

 

I have the AEM universal kit...........I had to install it under the passenger side headlight. thats the only place to mount it. You could use your windshield wiper tank but then you would not have any fluid to use on the window.
I had it set pretty low, starting on 2000 rpms and 15 psi boost

 

Unless you have a problem with detonation or running lean (needed the meth/alky for extra fuel) you won't see a performance benefit unless you retune the car to take advantage of the injection. If you install a kit and do a custom calibration for the car you might be able to lean it out or run additional ignition timing but the direct injection itself already allows for some of that.

I'd rather work on keeping charge temps down via a good performing intercooler (if needed over the stock unit), but if you do a race gas/high-octane style tune that needs extra detonation resistance of race gas the methanol injection could be a less expensive option, but you want to maintain that system and use quality components because a failure could be very damaging. That's the biggest down side I see to using water/alky injection. If you tune to take advantages of the characteristics it can provide you run the risk that if a pump fails, a line breaks, a nozzle clogs, etc. that you could damage the engine if under high load conditions when that occurs.

 

Yeah um, I got mine tuned and notice a hell of a lot more throttle to her, you should be good

 

How much difference can you tell from how it use to be?

 

^^^ probably a good amount. I always thought that running meth could clean your engine and is a good thing for your engine, did I hear wrong???

 

I have a ss/sc but I got an extra 18whp out of the meth injection. (60/40 mix)

It does in kinda a steam cleaning way.

 

I would think you could gain 10-20whp by running meth and upping the timing. Should work well on the TC.

 

Yes, about 20 on the TC, thats how much I got

 

i have a AIS trunk kit but everyone here told me to stay away from it. its been sitting in my garage for months now. i hav full bolt ons im still on the fence about it.

 

S/C or N/A? If you have full bolt-ons then you should be pushing some good power. The meth isn't going to hurt anything but maybe corrode your throttle body. Thats an easy fix with an alcohol prep pad. I thinks its well worth it man, if you don't like it then you can always take it back off.

REMEMBER PEOPLE, YOU HAVE TO HAVE A PROPER TUNE, OR YOUR WATER/METH INJ. IS WORTHLESS

 

False.
It still has a cooling effect no matter what.

 

cooling effect, Yes....
Power gain, No Maybe 2 or 3 horse.

Without a tune you're not going to see any or feal any gains.......this I know.....trial&error

 

True but I do believe without a tune meth will make you run very rich which isn't very healthy for the car at all.

 

True but I think just the cooling alone is worth it. But you have to understand that it gets 105+ here almost everyday in the summer.

 

thank you all good to know i am saving this page

 

Think about the guys that want to run stg 2 with a 2.8 pulley. Running meth would give them a little insurance for when there injectors max out up top.

 

Yea see I think I'm bout to order the AEM kit

 

Talk to OTTP. He could make you a deal on Devils Own. Best mod I have ever done by far.

 

Just remember man, as soon as you get it on, get to a tuner, The TC needs to be tuned for the ****.....good luck

 

i think he is good this is his signature line.... Mods: Synapse Turbo intercooler piping and catless downpipe. 3' exhaust with megan racing muffler, PPC Tuner, K&N drop in filter, tinted taillights, black housing headlights, 8000k HIDs, Eibach springs. Hahn intercooler and intake on the way

 

I've always heard you need to tune for meth since you are adding fuel.

The no-tune for running water for cooling benefit makes sense though.

 

On a normal port injected engine, if you are using water injection the mixture is also taking up space in the combustion chamber that air and fuel can no longer fill. So there's a couple question you have to ask. Is the slightly cooler charge temps in the intake tract post-water injection nozzle creating a denser charge going into the combustion chamber and will that charge have more oxygen to burn and offset the reduce amount of air that's being displaced by the water vapor. Now of you injecting methanol or another alcohol on a port injected engine, if the water/alky mixture take place of some air/fuel, the methanol should provide a replacement.

Now there's another couple things to consider regarding the direct injection. Since fuel is still being injected directly into the combustion chamber one has to wonder what affect the water vapor has on the highly compressed intake charge at the top of the compression stroke. If you've seen the stock Mahle pistons, they're designed to promote a special flame front due to that direct injection. The computer has a wideband O2 sensor feedback but it also has the ability to inject the same amount of fuel into the combustion chamber whether there is the normal air only cahrge or one with water/alky.

Taking into consideration some of these points, if it were me I'd be doing some careful data logging to monitor how the car is behaving before and after an injection setup is installed. For example a cooler charge temp may be nice, but are you getting any knock without injection? Also how rich is the car running prior an what affect does it have on how the computer responds to injection? I'd also be doing some controlled dyno testing on a loading dyno and some track times with and without to verify any perceived affect.

It's important to remember where the potential benefits from a water/alky injection system comes from. The two key purposes where it allows you to make more power is by reducing knock threshold and controlling detonation/knock in order to maximize ignition timing. If you have a limited fueling system and are running out of headroom (which shouldn't be the case for anyone on the stock turbo and its max airflow it is capable of producing), then injecting alcohol can provide additional fuel to richen the mixture.

If you're familiar with the LSJ it has some very different characteristics than the LNF. On a highly modified car that is overspinning the M62 there's a ton more heat, those cars are using a conventional port fuel injection, and the stock fuel injectors have a limit on what they can flow. Same thing goes with other cars. There are generally benefits to be had from using a water injection system but every car behaves differently and the powertrain as a whole/as a system needs to be designed to take advantage of what the water/alky provides.

The HID bulbs may blind other drivers and reduce useful light output but probably don't help much in the power department.
One point to make, he does have the BSR PPC tuner that has their proprietary custom calibration but just because you have a custom tune doesn't mean it's optimal to take advantage of water injection. To see an increase in power when running water injection you usually do so by increasing ignition timing if you're currently knock threshold limited and also lean out the engine slightly since the slightly cooler charge temps can resist detonation better. If you're injecting an alcohol like methanol you can also alter the fueling/ignition (spark) parameters to take advantage of that extra fuel, slightly higher overall octane equivalence, etc.

The BSR tune might see some small advantages (or might not), but at the end of the day a custom tune/calibration is probably going to be required to maximize the potential provided by a water injection setup. And therein lies another consideration when running water/alky injection. To see maximum gains in power you generally have to run a lot more ignition timing and/or lean out the car quite a bit. If you're shooting for max power and have the car tuned that way and something happens to you injection setup like a nozzle clogs or pump dies you could suddenly get severe knock which if it happens under a ton of boost at high loads the stock pistons may not like it.


The direct injection definitely throws a monkey wrench in the works or gains you can see from water injection. It probably isn't going to hurt at stock turbo power levels if properly tuned but it will be interesting to see how cars with large aftermarket turbos and subsequently much higher cylinder pressures behave. Unfortunately I haven't seen any SAE or other papers noting the affect of injecting additional substances via the intake port on how it affects flame front and direct fuel injection, so it may take some trial and error testing by pioneering people to see how it holds up.