very good post

 

what do you mean i can't compare a built cobalt to to what zooomer said? he didn't put any conditions on there, he said and i quote:

whitfield's car is fast enough to hit the line, him get out, crack open a can of beer and drink half of it before zzp's fastest cobalt caught up with him

 

How many parts does Whitfield commercially sell that they use on their car? How many does ZZP?

Two completely different worlds.

I mean, just look at his spec sheet http://gmtunersource.com/index.php/g...jasonwhitfield

 

why didn't you put that info in the first post with the pictures. I was debating between the ZZP S3 and the new OTTP one. This info would better represent your companies product if it were delivered more clearly (like explaining your first post with pics, or at least saying there was a tech article on your site) and without the attitude. Explain your products superior quality and benefits, display it with the pictures, and people will make the right decision given that the benefits justify the cost.

 

Why thanks. And one more thing: it could be that Venom09's TC is faster than my RL on track. I am not sure, but I am preparing the tanto for hari kari now...just in case

 

it's not two different worlds, and it's irrelevant if a company doesn't sell the parts they use on their car to go fast.

what you are arguing is like me coming out here and saying i have the world's fastest cobalt, then when you post a video of gardella, i say "well that's not a real car so it don't count"

 

ZZP isn't arguing that they have the fastest Cobalts in the world, they're saying that they commercially sell the fastest Cobalt parts. Judging by their results, I'd say that that's pretty close to the truth.

500 whp LNFs, 11 second 486 whp LSJ's, 11 second 360 whp LE5's.

But you're too hung up on what some guy is one-off'ing in his race garage to care about those kinds of numbers that are available to the public at large?

 

not trying to bash but please tell me how posting a picture, which to a non super technical person all looked like the same piece. And then not saying ANY thing about it helped at all? What did you think was going to happen? doing that alone would cause "bashing and hate". hell I think most were pissed you didnt say anything about it :P

 

You couldn't tell any difference between the upper and left pictures and the bottom right one? I'd say that the differences are pretty telling.

 

Just go to the website and read it. Its easier forget the thread, coz too many folks are butt hurt that whitfield and ballard apparently dont sell their cars....altho' wasnt Whitfield on here trying to sell an LSJ Aveo? Hmmm....


And frankly, I think its good that zoomer posted the pictures and didnt say anything, (although a link would have been good that came later thanks to 07 metallic) ....coz when zoomer speaks somehow it seems *scratches head* so rude , doncha know?

 

honestly at quick glance it all looked the same. Until looking closely between them.

 

Stop being a douch. You are trying to stir the pot.

Sometimes its better to let people think independently and not spoon feed them. Anyone who understand the basics of a dual pass HE would see why one of those HEs is better then the other.

I had the same problem with the CX Racing Dual Pass HE I ran in the past.

Non-Technical people should not reply in this thread in the first place. That is just one of the problems with this site. ****** should stay in the ***** threads and let the people who care about technical things handle the performance stuff.

 

John, thats what I'm saying, i like that the tech article is there on the site. Just think it would've been better if Zoomer had mentioned it in his first post. Not that I was all that butt-hurt about him not saying anything. Don't really care that much. I was more confused as to what the two products were and whose was whose, etc., etc. Just looking you could see they were different, but thats useless without knowing whats what.

 

Our 9 sec Cobalt is the same place as whitfield's...in your imagination.

He doesn't have a 'street ready cobalt.

It doesn't run the same engine as anyone here, it doesn't have the same transmission, it doesn't have normal interior components, manual steering and a custom steering wheel, distributor ignition, and the engine in it isn't transverse. You could take a cobalt block and thow it in the trunk of a Grand National and claim the fastest Cobalt as well. But the truth is that people who are honest, both with others and themselves know exactly what the difference is. Everyone here knows that whitfield isn't driving a cobalt around, not what anyone here considers 'a cobalt'. Those that say otherwise are lying to themselves and trying to pass this off on the rest of us for the SOLE reason of bringing down ZZP and our acomplishments. ZZP sells what we run and we develop products that have to work in daily driven vehicles. That means no crazy one off specialty items that will never be sold and aren't practical for the street tuner. Runing fast times with that limitation is far more difficult that making a car run a 1/4 mile in a short time with zero restrictions.

When the first guy on the forums posted about running 12's, did you go in and brag about whitfield? No, because you'd look like a jackass.

 

Please explain to me in obviously dumded down terms HOW I was trying to stir the pot?

So I cant talk in a thread because you said? lol good thing you cant control this site :s All I did was give zoomer a reason as to why the resonse was the way it was. It was a non biased opinion I shared. If you dont like it you dont have to respond or read it...wait werent those your own words?

ahhh thank you pictures may "say" 1000 words but they are useless if no one knows what those words actually are.

 

don't make excuses man, you come on here and blatantly state that zzp is the only company that makes fast products, that you have the fastest cars and everyone else is slow/a joke.

stop trying to mitigate your bold claims with conditional restrictions


oh and btw since u don't really keep up with me, i was running low 11's back in 2006. not sure if the slips are still posted anywhere, i'm sure the threads are here somewhere or on redline or .com. for all the smack talk i may try to take a tvs as fast as your twincharge once i get the motor built again, only thing i think i need right now is some rods, **** guess i need to cut back on the vacation a bit and order a set of them now. i may not know everything about tuning, matter of fact i can't tune for crap, we paid a guy to come and tune the gt-k 450 setup for me... but i do know it doesn't take a specific brand of part or a specific company to make a fast car

 

 

it's actually just a few inches bigger

 

It is acceptable (IMO) to post the pictures just to see what questions those interested would have and then come in and state the facts. Speculation is fine. The question that really needed to be answered is whose HE is being compared to another.

Now that I know the answer I am pissed that I didn't spend the xtra $$ on the ZZP S3. These illustrations coupled with a factual response helps the prospective buyer choose wisely. Before this thread I was lead to believe by some of the "technical" people frequenting the forums as well as others that a particular HE did it's intended job well.

Furthermore, the Whitfield car should not be brought into this conversation since it is not supercharged, don't use a water to air HE, and is not even close to a production car. Some people just want to continue to bash Zoomer or ZZP. Have I purchased products from them....sure. Were they perfect....no. But ZZP did make it right when I had an issue.

I appreciate the information as I really wanted the best for my Cobalt. I am simply looking to further cool my intake charge with the best products available (have option B with dual pass). It appears to me that for the price (below $300) that ZZP has that product.

Anyone interested in purchasing an HE??

 

glad a spent a little extra to get the zzp s3 h/e minus the stupid logo on the front

 

Whitfield doesn't actively post on this forum and he doesn't offer a variety of readily available mods for the members of this site.

Gardella doesn't and couldn't drive his Cobalt back and forth to work, out to eat, to the store, etc... Ryan can and does and that is the difference. Furthermore, everything on Ryan's Cobalt is available for purchase through ZZP. Almost nothing on these other cars is available or sensible to install on a street car.

 

Clarifying a claim is not making excuses. Obviously we could talk about top fuel dragsters and when I said "we daily drive a Cobalt which isn't comparable to a dragster" you could say I am making excuses. I am not, I'm simply clarifying the claim which is that the fastest cobalts run ZZP parts.

Does that mean ZZP is the only company making parts? No. What it means is what it means. The members here with the fastest times and highest HP are doing so by using ZZP parts. Until that changes, I don't think it's impressive to say your going to do something.

The pattern I"m trying to show is that when you are casually modifying your car, you can trust ZZP parts to give you the best results. This HE thread is an example. You have two choices. Our HE is designed better, built in the US, cools better and weighs 9 pounds less. That's a serious advantage to try and overcome if two cars are identical but each is running different HE's.

---------
Can you point to one post I've made with the quotes you listed?
1. "zzp is the only company that makes fast products"
2. "that you have the fastest cars"
3. "everyone else is slow/a joke"

Saying 'the fastest cars run ZZP' is totally different than what you're acusing. Never have I said everyone else is a joke and ZZP doesn't own the fastest cars, we're just responsible for making the parts used on them.

 

ZZP S3 H/E is going on my car this spring, in no small part to the tech article and comparo pics on the web site.

 

instead of posting like a child why dont you prove with actual numbers. on the same car run the h/e's on back to back runs and show intake temps and a vid for proof

 

Okay. I got it. Listen up! I run single pass with Option B and a Griffin Racing Aftermarket HE in the stock location, with Griffin's unique core design that is proprietary. I beleive it is 100% the best solution. This h/ecan be purchased direct from Griffin in NC for about 700 shipped.
I direct all my customers to them, as I dont want to mark it up.
Here is what Zoomer says about the stock HE:

[SIZE="4"][The factory HE is actually the best pound for pound and in the number of cooling fins. The problem is that it doesn’t hold enough fluid; it isn’t large enough to keep temps at ambient and is sandwiched in between the AC condenser and the OEM radiator. So it makes sense and gives good gains to add another heat exchanger. Should you run only the aftermarket HE? No, the factory unit is cooled by fans when standing still and performs well for what it is.
/SIZE]

So Zoomer also provides dimensions and volumes for the stock h/e. The racing Griffin is twice the thickness (1.5 inches) compared to stock. Provides all the advantages Zoomer points out.

My data shows it kicks ass.

Single pass also is an excellent improvement using the stock laminova. When you add it all up, for about $1000 plus shipping you can have the best.

For 300 dollars are you getting the best charge cooling solution? According to Zoomer's words, not so much...