I'm new, searched a little, and now I'm making my first post with a bunch of questions. Woohoo.

So I'm unclear on a few of the different cooling system components/functions. Here it goes.

First, does the Cobalt SS come with a stock heat exchanger? I've tried searching, but I didn't get very useful search results and I couldn't really tell from pictures.

Secondly, I've tried to make sense of all the combos of reservoirs/endplates/HEs etc and my understanding so far is this:

- The Option B "kit" is simply for adding extra capacity to the air-to-water intercooler system and sports self-bleeding hosing.

- The dual-pass endplate is for having two flow channels instead of a single flow channel thru the intercooler cores.

- Then you can add on things like an aftermarket heat exchanger for better coolant cooling. (five times fast, anyone?)

Would this be accurate?


I'm heavily looking into an SS, but since I don't have one yet, I'm trying to fully understand their cooling setup, since it seems to be a big sticking point on how reliably they can make power.


Thanks in advance.

 

Yes there is a stock heat exchanger.

Your other assumptions appear well researched on your end, and yes they are accurate.

 

^^ yessir that looks correct, and yes there is a stock HE, but its not too big and is wedged between the AC HE and the radiator

 

Awesome!

Also, with regards to filling the system: does the SS come stock with a coolant tank/ball/reservoir or just a small filler neck of some sort?

 

its a small filler neck in front of the sc, the whole system is not efficient for anything not even stock. but as more and more people grow ***** they are playing with the setup and changing out the problems... so dont be afraid to buy an ss sc they are great and lots of fun and great gas milage

 

I've read a lot about the cooling upgrades and the fueling upgrades and the resulting power... compared to what I had, (1998 Jetta GLX - 6 inefficient but beautiful sounding cylinders) it's serious power. The best part is, you're not tearing down the engine to get that power, either!

I've been toying with some ideas of my own, but I actually need a car, or atleast an intake manifold, to experiment with.

It will all come in time, I hope.

Thanks for the speedy answers!

 

dual pass only passes the coolant through the manifold twice. stock system goes through it 4 times. Some people are working on a single pass.

the heat exchanger adds more capacity to the cooling system and more surface are to cool down the liquid.

 

I like the idea of the single pass manifold. A lot of welding, but if you're dead-set on sticking with the blower, it's cheaper than a blower upgrade, maybe.

 

it doesn't change the manifold, nor dictate if a blower upgrade is necessary or not. It only sends the coolant through the manifold a single time instead of twice. So it doesn't heat up as much, making it more efficiant.

 

personally i think the single pass is a flawed idea. The coolant pressure drop would be horrible to the point i question if the fluid would move fast enough through the cores to be effective. Its all about fluid dynamics. If you take a stream of water and split it into 4 streams of water, each stream will only have 25% of the flow of the single stream. We also know that fluid velocity is controlled by pressure, so what you get is 75% less fluid moving 75% slower through the cores. Its better to keep the pressure high so that the water is moving though the IC at a higher velocity. Because no matter what, lets say the stock IC pump pushes 5 Gallons a minute, thats the max it can push through the IC. adding more cores wont push more fluid through the cores, the same amount of fluid will still be going through the cores, its just more spread out. So it obsorbes heat more evenly, but also cant abosorb as much heat.

really the only way to see worthwhile gains from a single pass setup is if you go to a larger size IC pump that can push substantially more fluid. To obtain peak efficiency with a air-water intercooler system, you want to have high flow while keeping the water inside the heatexchanger for as short as period of time as possible. With a single pass if you dont upgrade the flow rate, your just canceling out the effects of single pass with slow fluid velocity.

 

Your post is a little bit off/contradictory.

Flow rate, pressure, the moon's alignment, etc, have nothing to do with heat absorption. A fixed volume of water will hold (take) a specific amount of energy to reach a specific temperature. It doesn't matter if you do a single pass, dual pass, or stock setup: it's a closed system, with a fixed volume of coolant. It will hold a fixed amount of energy at any given temperature. No intercooler design is going to make the coolant any more efficient at capturing heat.

Now, my physics are a bit rusty. Actually, I never took physics in high school, but.. With the "single pass" manifold, you're "opening up" the loop at the laminova cores, but you're going right back to a 3/8" hose, or whatever. It's going to be the same hose diameter on both sides of the laminovas; it's going to be the same restriction. Once the system stabilizes, pressure will be constant throughout.

You're also not losing flow. The flow is fixed. The pump determines the flow.

I think you have a better chance to cool with a single pass. It's going to be less of a pressure drop, as there is less length of the lines, essentially. You're going to give the coolant less time to spend in the cores, heating up, closing the temperature differential gap, making it harder to exchange heat.


Again, I don't claim to be a physics major, so anybody with a degree or links can rail me if I'm wrong.

 

Amazing you would say that single pass is a flawed idea without any data to back it up. The data says its a great idea, I make them, and so far there are only 2 out there, mine and Ralliartists. So if you read Ralli's data (now thats an interesting concept, hard numbers) and still think single pass is a flawed idea then : so sad too bad you just dont know s**t.

Laminova in fact if you read their literature, appear to prefer a single pass of this nature; the original LSJ packaging and cost did not permit it and the packaging to make it happen is not easy. Your statement that ' you wish to keep water inside the " laminova" for as short a period of time' is also flawed its all a question of heat transfer, both in the laminova and from the heat exchanger radiator.

x 2

 

As far as the heat exchanger goes, are there fans for it with the stock one? Seems like it'd be a good way, along with an after-run system, for extra cooling power when you're not go reallllly fast. Was looking at the electric fan radiators you usually see on off-road vehicles. You could stick one of those in your setup, along with the stock or an aftermarket H/E, right between the IC H/E and A/C H/E or if you were bold, under the car in the rear area... anywhere really.

 

no, no fan, the heat exchanger is in front. that why people go for the bigger one because it puts more surface area to cool. These cars heat up like a bitch inbetween runs in the stage lanes unfortunately.

 

That's what I figured.

I'm thinking an extra radiator with electric fan would definitely be a useful mod. Extra capacity, extra cooling that doesn't require you to be driving to work.

 

like puttin a 4 inch exhuast on a stock honda civic

 

really, if you think about it...single pass to quad pass theres no difference in flow. It will flow through 4x the channels, but at 1/4 the rate. however, because there are 4 separate channels, the coolant would be only heatsoaking towards the very END of each channel, instead of heat soaking more and more with every channel the coolant passes through. a single pass would probably be most effective with a higher flowing pump IMO, but you will still definitely see gains. this is proven by stock to dual pass.

 

Flow rate is NOT reduced if you reduce the pressure in a liquid system.

Flow is a function of the pump, and every pump has what is called a Pump Curve. This is a graph of flow rate vs head pressure. Simply, its how much the pump flows versus a given amount of pressure. A pump flows MORE if there is less head pressure.

Here's an example:



As for the single pass - this thing reduces the amount of time the coolant spends inside the manifold by a factor of 4 (stock is a quad pass). This is equivalent to increasing flow rate by 4x on a stock manifold.

On top of this, the laminovas on the single-pass are in a parallel configuration, meaning that the total resistance to flow equal to ONE laminova core, even though there are four. On the stock quad-pass, the laminovas are in series meaning that the total resistance to flow is equal to FOUR laminova cores.

In summary, the single-pass:

• By design, increases the effective flow rate by 4.
• By design, reduces the flow resistance by 4, further increasing flow rate.

The above improvements are HUGE. Now... how much does it cost

 

good analysis pm me for details on mine...thanks

 

^^ the above is not really true. It will not flow 4x as much for this simple reason. From point A to point B (the two sides of the manifold), on a stock setup, there is one channel for the coolant to flow. in the single pass, there are 4 channels for the coolant to flow. this is 4x the volume for the same number of CCs of coolant to flow, which means a 1/4 rate of flow PER laminova, with a 4x volume of total laminovas.

However, the reduced resistance of the coolant only needing to pass through a single laminova core is still an improvement, and is really the actual only flow improvement. However, a single pass end plate would not be more effective because it flows more coolant, but because of the way the coolant flows, there is more fresh(straight from the HE) coolant in the system at any given time.

 

the end result is people see its helping with iat2 temps, and thats what matters.

it may benifit from a higher flow rate pump, however keep in mind that if its flowing faster through the system and not spending as much time in the manifold, it also isnt spending as much time in the heat exchanger(s). depending on the efficiency of the heat exchangers, you may end up returning already warm fluid back to the manifold, negating the purpose of the single pass. for research on finding the right flow rate in this system the best thing to do would be test different pumps/heat exchangers with inlet and outlet coolant temps from the manifold

 

Okay, so how about some FACTUAL proof from me....

single pass manifold info....

actual Data: My intake manifold, mildly ported and custom single pass setup. I also have CXRacing Front Mount in line with the stock h/e and a ice box/opt. B and meth. My IAT's at the drag strip tonight were 104 sitting in the staging lanes and didn't go over 113 at the top of 3rd.

I later logged a pull on the interstate, started at 88 and didn't go over 109.

I am also running a 2.9 pulley.

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I don't have any logs or DATA proof for you, sorry. But I just wanted to say, that I've been our racing all night, and after every single run, and even after a 40min. drive home and racing like 5 times on the interstate, my INTAKE MANIFOLD was like ICE to the touch. Literally. ******* COLD as ice. 50 degree weather all night. My ice box tank was freezing cold liquid as well. My intake was freezing cold, and even the supercharger inlet portion was freezing ice cold. Only the rotor section of the supercharger housing was mildly warm.

Another update! Just drove around for about an hour, stop and go traffic, got on the highway to come how crusing at 60mph. No WOT pulls and no using meth. Pulled up in the driveway, intercooler fluid in the ice box was ice cold, intake and throttle body was ice cold. Supercharger was warm at best and the intake manifold was mildly warm. Only thing HOT to the touch was the actual engine itself. Pretty bad ass.


and how bout some FACTUAL proof from qwikredline.....

today on the track ambients at 24 degrees Celsius car pulled very well. Track had big grip, saw 126 at the end of the straight (good) Tonight drove 6 hours to another track in the mountains, ambients dropped to 4 degrees Celsius, car pulled like a monster. chillers , meth, single pass,all these will be awesome ralliartist, i am sure. Cool that sucker down and go fast!

yes........12 consecutive runs over 1.5 hours last week end at the strip no shut down just idle, last run fastest

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Single pass worth it? Does Fluid Dynamics not agree with myself and qwikredline?? Is our FACTUAL PROOF fake???

I'll tell you what, myself and qwikredline both run 2.9 pullies, find anyone else with similar IAT2's on any pulley.

 

Dual Pass, Option B, Ported and polished intake manifold 2.9 Pulley, stock heat exchanger, 120F IAT2 at WOT

 

^^ still not as good as ralliartist. Its def a mod worth havin done if you can.

 

i still wanna see pics of this setup