Official Water/Meth Injection Thread
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From: West Carrollton (Dayton), OH
Official Water/Meth Injection Thread
Brands of Meth Injection
Snow Performance $439.00
MAF controlled
Devil's Own $199.00
Boost controlled
AEM $439.99
Boost controlled
Cooling Mist:
Trunk mount kit: $359.95 or Underhood kit: $199.95
Boost and/or MAF controlled
**All of the sites have parts to build your own kit. I embedded the direct cobalt links in all the brands, but just use the home page on each site to hunt for what you want.**
A Brief History:
Water injection was evaluated scientifically in the 1930.s by H. Ricardo who demonstrated that one can basically double the power output of an engine using water/methanol. The first widespread use was during WWII on supercharged and turbocharged aircraft. In 1942, the German Luftwaffe increased the horsepower of the Focke-Wulf 190D-9 fighter aircraft from 1776HP to 2240HP using 50/50% water/methanol injection. The allies soon followed by fitting the P51 Mustang and other high performance aircraft with water/methanol injection. Following the war, the turboprop aircraft industry used water/methanol injection and called it the "automatic power reserve system (APR)" for use in hot or high altitude take off. It surfaced again in the 60's when GM used a system on the OEM turbo Corvair. It was used effectively in Formula 1 before being banned for adding too much power.
The latest competitive use is in World Rally Racing (WRC) where virtually all teams use it in some form and in diesel truck/tractor pulling competition.
FAQ's
Member submited
A:Websites list install as fairly straight forward.
1. What are the benefits of Water/Methanol injection?
1. Low cost - where else can you get up to 60HP for as low as $299?
2. More power than other means of detonation control.
3. Efficiency - leaner air fuel ratio can be utilized for normal operation.
4. Greatly increases air charge densities for huge horsepower increases.
2. Can the Boost Cooler be applied to naturally aspirated and nitrous engines?
1.Naturally aspirated/high compression engines:
In this application, water/methanol injection allows the use of pump fuel in all but the most extreme situations which effects tremendous cost savings as well as horsepower increases due to air density increase and realized timing potential. The system is activated by a boost referenced switch so that injection takes place only during high engine loads when needed.
2. Engines using nitrous: With nitrous, water/methanol injection allows the use of full timing even with large (250HP+) quantities. Injection is controlled by the same means that controls nitrous injection.
3. Naturally aspirated/stock compression: With naturally aspirated engines with less than 10:1 compression, water/methanol is used typically in warm climates to get the intake temps back to 60f. Benefits include: 10-15 HP increases from air density increases and full timing, Increased gas mileage, and carbon free combustion chambers. Activation is by a throttle switch adjusted for onset engine load. With this application, the nozzle is sized so that no more than 10% of total fuel consumption at peak flywheel HP is injected.
3. Do I need an intercooler with Water/Methanol Injection?
Up to approximately 30 psi boost, water/methanol injection (using at least 50% methanol) will provide all the density increase/detonation control needed in most applications. Of course, intercooling and water/methanol injection would provide even greater benefits especially beyond 30 psi boost. Most air-to-air intercoolers are only 50-65% efficient. That means for example, that with 11 psi of boost and the resulting 120°f air charge temperature increase, an intercooler reduces the air charge temperature only 60 degrees. Also, an intercooler will reduce boost 2 - 4 psi. on average.
4. Why not use a windshield washer pump?
Water/Methanol must be injected at above 50psi to properly atomize. Lower than 50psi causes greatly reduced air charge cooling as the result of larger droplets and their reduced total surface area. Also with inadequate atomization, there is a greater propensity to quench combustion resulting in a loss of power.
5. Why Methanol?
Methanol is a high octane fuel that is extremely resistant to detonation with an excellent cost/benefit ratio. ($1.50 - $2.00 per gallon.) Its high latent heat of vaporization also makes it an excellent air charge cooler which means a denser mixture and more horsepower. Because of these facts, it is a better anti-detonant than ethanol or iso-propanol although they will work in a pinch. It has however only about 60% of the energy content of gasoline by volume so about twice as much is used to make similar power if used as a straight fuel. It is extremely toxic and should be handled with rubber gloves in well ventilated areas only. Care should be taken to avoid skin contact.
6. Where can I purchase Methanol?
Snowperformance sells 50/50% methanol/waterMethanol as Boost Juice™. Methanol can generally be purchased where racing fuels are sold. Also, most gas line dryers like "Heat" are simply Methanol. Suppliers of industrial chemicals can also supply Methanol usually at a higher price than fuel suppliers.
If all else fails, most windshield washer fluids are up to 40% Methanol and 58% water. Although most contain some glycol and detergent(less than 1%), most windshield washer fluids are up to 40% methanol. Try to find one that indicates "contains methanol" and is rated to -20şf.
7. What ratio of water/methanol is recommended?
A 50/50 ratio is recommended. This has been demonstrated to be the best for charge/air cooling, excellent detonation control, and safety.
8. How long does the fluid last?
The range you'll get out of a system depends on a couple of variables:
- How much power you're making
- The settings of your system
- How aggressively you drive
For those looking to get more range out of their system, they can tap into their factory windshield washer reservoir and use it to hold water/methanol. This is a good option because most washer reservoirs have a large capacity (normally at least a gallon) plus they're already methanol resistant (washer fluid has methanol in it). Also, the washer reservoir is already under the hood so it doesn't require having to add another bulky item into the engine bay.
Snow Performance $439.00
MAF controlled
Devil's Own $199.00
Boost controlled
AEM $439.99
Boost controlled
Cooling Mist:
Trunk mount kit: $359.95 or Underhood kit: $199.95
Boost and/or MAF controlled
**All of the sites have parts to build your own kit. I embedded the direct cobalt links in all the brands, but just use the home page on each site to hunt for what you want.**
A Brief History:
Water injection was evaluated scientifically in the 1930.s by H. Ricardo who demonstrated that one can basically double the power output of an engine using water/methanol. The first widespread use was during WWII on supercharged and turbocharged aircraft. In 1942, the German Luftwaffe increased the horsepower of the Focke-Wulf 190D-9 fighter aircraft from 1776HP to 2240HP using 50/50% water/methanol injection. The allies soon followed by fitting the P51 Mustang and other high performance aircraft with water/methanol injection. Following the war, the turboprop aircraft industry used water/methanol injection and called it the "automatic power reserve system (APR)" for use in hot or high altitude take off. It surfaced again in the 60's when GM used a system on the OEM turbo Corvair. It was used effectively in Formula 1 before being banned for adding too much power.
The latest competitive use is in World Rally Racing (WRC) where virtually all teams use it in some form and in diesel truck/tractor pulling competition.
FAQ's
Member submited
1. What are the benefits of Water/Methanol injection?
1. Low cost - where else can you get up to 60HP for as low as $299?
2. More power than other means of detonation control.
3. Efficiency - leaner air fuel ratio can be utilized for normal operation.
4. Greatly increases air charge densities for huge horsepower increases.
2. Can the Boost Cooler be applied to naturally aspirated and nitrous engines?
1.Naturally aspirated/high compression engines:
In this application, water/methanol injection allows the use of pump fuel in all but the most extreme situations which effects tremendous cost savings as well as horsepower increases due to air density increase and realized timing potential. The system is activated by a boost referenced switch so that injection takes place only during high engine loads when needed.
2. Engines using nitrous: With nitrous, water/methanol injection allows the use of full timing even with large (250HP+) quantities. Injection is controlled by the same means that controls nitrous injection.
3. Naturally aspirated/stock compression: With naturally aspirated engines with less than 10:1 compression, water/methanol is used typically in warm climates to get the intake temps back to 60f. Benefits include: 10-15 HP increases from air density increases and full timing, Increased gas mileage, and carbon free combustion chambers. Activation is by a throttle switch adjusted for onset engine load. With this application, the nozzle is sized so that no more than 10% of total fuel consumption at peak flywheel HP is injected.
3. Do I need an intercooler with Water/Methanol Injection?
Up to approximately 30 psi boost, water/methanol injection (using at least 50% methanol) will provide all the density increase/detonation control needed in most applications. Of course, intercooling and water/methanol injection would provide even greater benefits especially beyond 30 psi boost. Most air-to-air intercoolers are only 50-65% efficient. That means for example, that with 11 psi of boost and the resulting 120°f air charge temperature increase, an intercooler reduces the air charge temperature only 60 degrees. Also, an intercooler will reduce boost 2 - 4 psi. on average.
4. Why not use a windshield washer pump?
Water/Methanol must be injected at above 50psi to properly atomize. Lower than 50psi causes greatly reduced air charge cooling as the result of larger droplets and their reduced total surface area. Also with inadequate atomization, there is a greater propensity to quench combustion resulting in a loss of power.
5. Why Methanol?
Methanol is a high octane fuel that is extremely resistant to detonation with an excellent cost/benefit ratio. ($1.50 - $2.00 per gallon.) Its high latent heat of vaporization also makes it an excellent air charge cooler which means a denser mixture and more horsepower. Because of these facts, it is a better anti-detonant than ethanol or iso-propanol although they will work in a pinch. It has however only about 60% of the energy content of gasoline by volume so about twice as much is used to make similar power if used as a straight fuel. It is extremely toxic and should be handled with rubber gloves in well ventilated areas only. Care should be taken to avoid skin contact.
6. Where can I purchase Methanol?
Snowperformance sells 50/50% methanol/waterMethanol as Boost Juice™. Methanol can generally be purchased where racing fuels are sold. Also, most gas line dryers like "Heat" are simply Methanol. Suppliers of industrial chemicals can also supply Methanol usually at a higher price than fuel suppliers.
If all else fails, most windshield washer fluids are up to 40% Methanol and 58% water. Although most contain some glycol and detergent(less than 1%), most windshield washer fluids are up to 40% methanol. Try to find one that indicates "contains methanol" and is rated to -20şf.
7. What ratio of water/methanol is recommended?
A 50/50 ratio is recommended. This has been demonstrated to be the best for charge/air cooling, excellent detonation control, and safety.
8. How long does the fluid last?
The range you'll get out of a system depends on a couple of variables:
- How much power you're making
- The settings of your system
- How aggressively you drive
For those looking to get more range out of their system, they can tap into their factory windshield washer reservoir and use it to hold water/methanol. This is a good option because most washer reservoirs have a large capacity (normally at least a gallon) plus they're already methanol resistant (washer fluid has methanol in it). Also, the washer reservoir is already under the hood so it doesn't require having to add another bulky item into the engine bay.
Last edited by WickedSS2005; Oct 9, 2007 at 10:33 PM.
)
Thread Starter
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
Joined: 07-02-05
Posts: 8,725
Likes: 2
From: West Carrollton (Dayton), OH
All of the sites have parts to build your own kit. I embedded the direct cobalt links in all the brands, but just use the home page on each site to hunt for what you want.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
Joined: 07-02-05
Posts: 8,725
Likes: 2
From: West Carrollton (Dayton), OH
I've been researching setups but unless I have meth I can't really do a how-to
Thread Starter
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
Joined: 07-02-05
Posts: 8,725
Likes: 2
From: West Carrollton (Dayton), OH
Thread Starter
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
Joined: 07-02-05
Posts: 8,725
Likes: 2
From: West Carrollton (Dayton), OH
Rent me! per hour
Joined: 03-22-07
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From: Still fixing others mistakes.