GM Exec Calls Chevy Cobalt "Horrible"
05-21-2010, 02:33 AM
#151
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I think that all the interiors on GMs have sucked in the past few years, except the luxury models of course. I don't know, but it's almost like it was some kind of strategy on their part that failed. I am hoping that all new models will go like the Cruze and get rid of the plastic crap.
05-21-2010, 02:53 AM
#153
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Never been in the SUVs/crossovers aside from my buddy's Tahoe, which I liked (though it was a Fleet Fire Investigation truck). The Buicks and Caddies are much more expensive generally, so that explains that. The problem like many have said is that the big three held US sales for so long that they forgot there was real competition out there. Even until recently, Nissan, Honda and Toyota weren't household names. That is why we had Inifiniti, Acura, and Lexus, respectively.
Ford caught on just in time and has made nearly a 180* turn to fix their lineup. They use less plastic. They upped the power in the V6 and brought back the 5.0, while still being eco-friendly. They went into a global market by bringing the Fiesta to North America.
GM is investing in Electric vehicles, which are far from the future source, at least in my opinion. I lean on the Hydrogen team, but that's another day. They are advertising by being in Transformers. They just seem so lost as a company.
At the end of the day, plastic interiors are both high and low on their totem pole. They need to refine their cars in order to survive. At the same time though, they don't seem to have the capability to make the turn-around necessary to survival without a complete team and focus rebuild, which costs time money they do not have.
05-21-2010, 03:19 AM
#155
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I'm starting to wonder if you're having your own argument...
of course selling an 'import' nets financial gain inside the USA, but that's not what's being talked about here;
the the end of the day, it's neither the manufacturing plant (or it's employees), or the shipper, or the dealer, or the salesman that nets the largest share of profit from car sales - it's the parent company.
What's being talked about, is that simply put, buying import cars sends north American money overseas.
granted parts in domestic cars do come from overseas, but proportionally the car maker (GM, Nissan ect) nets the largest profit from each car sold.
although it's not normally my place, I'm wondering what you're on, because that last quoted section has me dumbfounded...
Europeans complaining about USA cars??
~ you do realize that GM-USA cars don't even make a dent on European sales right?
(there are some Corvette and Cadillac's sold in Europe, but not enough for any European to complain about it)
~ you do realize that although Opel is a GM affiliate company (of which GM is the parent), but Opel is, and has been almost completely autonomous from it's north American parent company. LINK
Canadian's complaining about USA cars??
Are you serious?
Our economy's have been so intertwined for the last hundred or so years that you actually need to know how to discern where the differences are.
Australian's complaining about USA cars??
Now you cannot be serious...
To the best of my knowledge, there is not a single north american car being sold in Australia.
Although Holden is a GM affiliate company (of which GM is the parent), but Holden has been largely independant of their north american affiliate, only of late adopting many of GM-USA's engines, and GM's 'global' vehicle platforms.
of course selling an 'import' nets financial gain inside the USA, but that's not what's being talked about here;
the the end of the day, it's neither the manufacturing plant (or it's employees), or the shipper, or the dealer, or the salesman that nets the largest share of profit from car sales - it's the parent company.
What's being talked about, is that simply put, buying import cars sends north American money overseas.
granted parts in domestic cars do come from overseas, but proportionally the car maker (GM, Nissan ect) nets the largest profit from each car sold.
although it's not normally my place, I'm wondering what you're on, because that last quoted section has me dumbfounded...
Europeans complaining about USA cars??
~ you do realize that GM-USA cars don't even make a dent on European sales right?
(there are some Corvette and Cadillac's sold in Europe, but not enough for any European to complain about it)
~ you do realize that although Opel is a GM affiliate company (of which GM is the parent), but Opel is, and has been almost completely autonomous from it's north American parent company. LINK
Canadian's complaining about USA cars??
Are you serious?
Our economy's have been so intertwined for the last hundred or so years that you actually need to know how to discern where the differences are.
Australian's complaining about USA cars??
Now you cannot be serious...
To the best of my knowledge, there is not a single north american car being sold in Australia.
Although Holden is a GM affiliate company (of which GM is the parent), but Holden has been largely independant of their north american affiliate, only of late adopting many of GM-USA's engines, and GM's 'global' vehicle platforms.
I do love your use of wikipedia tho lmao. I was pointing out how other countries don't care where their cars come from or who the manufacturer is. For some reason people like ******* who I was arguing with seem to think buying a foreign car in the US is "unamerican" but it really only ever turns out to be the people who can't afford them. I'm sure he would be complaining if someone handed him the keys to a brand new BMW...
05-21-2010, 04:50 AM
#156
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You really just wrote there was something good about the Aveo? Name one thing PLEASE. It looks like its going to undress itself as it goes down the road. Not trying to be one of the jerks in this thread, but it is seriously a pathetic excuse for a car, even an econobox.
Never been in the SUVs/crossovers aside from my buddy's Tahoe, which I liked (though it was a Fleet Fire Investigation truck). The Buicks and Caddies are much more expensive generally, so that explains that. The problem like many have said is that the big three held US sales for so long that they forgot there was real competition out there. Even until recently, Nissan, Honda and Toyota weren't household names. That is why we had Inifiniti, Acura, and Lexus, respectively.
Ford caught on just in time and has made nearly a 180* turn to fix their lineup. They use less plastic. They upped the power in the V6 and brought back the 5.0, while still being eco-friendly. They went into a global market by bringing the Fiesta to North America.
GM is investing in Electric vehicles, which are far from the future source, at least in my opinion. I lean on the Hydrogen team, but that's another day. They are advertising by being in Transformers. They just seem so lost as a company.
At the end of the day, plastic interiors are both high and low on their totem pole. They need to refine their cars in order to survive. At the same time though, they don't seem to have the capability to make the turn-around necessary to survival without a complete team and focus rebuild, which costs time money they do not have.
Never been in the SUVs/crossovers aside from my buddy's Tahoe, which I liked (though it was a Fleet Fire Investigation truck). The Buicks and Caddies are much more expensive generally, so that explains that. The problem like many have said is that the big three held US sales for so long that they forgot there was real competition out there. Even until recently, Nissan, Honda and Toyota weren't household names. That is why we had Inifiniti, Acura, and Lexus, respectively.
Ford caught on just in time and has made nearly a 180* turn to fix their lineup. They use less plastic. They upped the power in the V6 and brought back the 5.0, while still being eco-friendly. They went into a global market by bringing the Fiesta to North America.
GM is investing in Electric vehicles, which are far from the future source, at least in my opinion. I lean on the Hydrogen team, but that's another day. They are advertising by being in Transformers. They just seem so lost as a company.
At the end of the day, plastic interiors are both high and low on their totem pole. They need to refine their cars in order to survive. At the same time though, they don't seem to have the capability to make the turn-around necessary to survival without a complete team and focus rebuild, which costs time money they do not have.
2011 Aveo, read what I wrote: http://www.drivearabia.com/news/wp-c...oncept-450.jpg
Also, see here: http://detnews.com/article/20100518/...fit-in-3-years
They're also advertising the May The Best Car Win campaign which has resonated with consumers as each of the four core brands increased marketshare year over year for the 1st quarter. The Ex Your Lexus and New Class of World Class advertisements are solid as are the Consumers Digest Best Buy awards that many GM vehicles have earned. They have alot of room to improve no doubt at all but to paint a bleak "Sky is falling" picture is not accurate by any stretch of the imagination.
Have you followed this company at all the past year? GM wiped out over 80% of their board of directors, fired 2 CEO's (thanks to Barak), bought out so many layers of midlevel management, promoted Tom Stephens to head of powertrain as well as Mark Reuss to head of GMNA. They also just hired the Hyundai marketing guru who came up with the recent think about it... advertisements.
Seriously?
and most importantly, see here: http://detnews.com/article/20100513/...-time-to-Cruze
I'll even quote the most significant part of the article see below:
"The group is keenly aware that every auto manufacturer will continue to improve their small cars. While the Honda Civic is the benchmark GM wants to pass, it knows Honda will bring out a new Civic as early as next year as a 2012 model.
While looking over his notes, Stephens said the Cruze's ride and handling bettered the current Civic.
But Reuss (President of GM North America), standing nearby, noted, "We've got to beat the next generation." "
05-21-2010, 06:28 AM
#157
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^^^ While I agree with what you posted, and the contents of the articles quoted I think a lot of the problem is still advertising. The import brands have been directly advertising against the domestic brands for a long time, and with the domestic brands paying too much attention to each other they have managed to fool the American people into believing that their cars are better no matter what.
We have seen some of this foolishness in this very thread, when emotional arguements are used to defend the import brands when confronted with the simple logic of the cobalt having the highest mpg and hp in it's class. Not to mention all the other class leaders in the GM stable.
It still comes down to advertising. Americans overall care little for fact based information and more for what they are convinced of via television and other media outlets. So long as GM and Ford keep aiming their commercials at the imports and not each other, plus they follow that up with good solid cars we will see the tables start to turn back.
We have seen some of this foolishness in this very thread, when emotional arguements are used to defend the import brands when confronted with the simple logic of the cobalt having the highest mpg and hp in it's class. Not to mention all the other class leaders in the GM stable.
It still comes down to advertising. Americans overall care little for fact based information and more for what they are convinced of via television and other media outlets. So long as GM and Ford keep aiming their commercials at the imports and not each other, plus they follow that up with good solid cars we will see the tables start to turn back.
05-21-2010, 06:48 AM
#158
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Go look at a Equinox, Terrain, Lacrosse, CTS, 08+ Malibu, Acadia, Enclave, Regal...or in 2 months: Cruze or end of year: Volt or next year Aveo (2011 AVEO for people who didn't get the next year part, see this picture: http://www.drivearabia.com/news/wp-c...oncept-450.jpg)
Every newly designed vehicle since the 07 Aura has been globally competitive if not at the top of its class. GM 'gets it'. There is already a MCE planned for the Cruze so when the 9th generation Civic is released, the Cruze is updated appropriately to out-class it and not just remain competitive but ****benchmark beyond where the competition will be with their future models****
....I feel very similar about my 09 SS TC...our chassis and suspension setup and powertrain in a cruze body = heaven
Every newly designed vehicle since the 07 Aura has been globally competitive if not at the top of its class. GM 'gets it'. There is already a MCE planned for the Cruze so when the 9th generation Civic is released, the Cruze is updated appropriately to out-class it and not just remain competitive but ****benchmark beyond where the competition will be with their future models****
....I feel very similar about my 09 SS TC...our chassis and suspension setup and powertrain in a cruze body = heaven
Did you mean to say era here? Lol, I think you are using the wrong word man... aura brings whole new meaning.
I can't speak for the new Equinox, but my mom has an 07 and it is a POS. The interior is right on par with my 09 TC, Nothing but rattly plastic. The dash is cheap looking Tupperware. I have borrowed it a few times and I really hate that thing, it handles like *****, rides like ass, it is underpowered (I can't even pass semis up hills), the interior is loud and cheap, seats suck... It is the fwd LT, but still..
05-21-2010, 08:26 AM
#159
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"Every newly designed vehicle since the 07 Aura has been globally competitive"
Did you mean to say era here? Lol, I think you are using the wrong word man... aura brings whole new meaning.
I can't speak for the new Equinox, but my mom has an 07 and it is a POS. The interior is right on par with my 09 TC, Nothing but rattly plastic. The dash is cheap looking Tupperware. I have borrowed it a few times and I really hate that thing, it handles like *****, rides like ass, it is underpowered (I can't even pass semis up hills), the interior is loud and cheap, seats suck... It is the fwd LT, but still..
Did you mean to say era here? Lol, I think you are using the wrong word man... aura brings whole new meaning.
I can't speak for the new Equinox, but my mom has an 07 and it is a POS. The interior is right on par with my 09 TC, Nothing but rattly plastic. The dash is cheap looking Tupperware. I have borrowed it a few times and I really hate that thing, it handles like *****, rides like ass, it is underpowered (I can't even pass semis up hills), the interior is loud and cheap, seats suck... It is the fwd LT, but still..
Nope, you cannot speak for the new Equinox, which is what I was referring to anyways.
Ranked #3 compact crossover suv out of 24 available on market, not bad. GMC Terrain ranked #2 by USA Today (objective, no?)
http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com...rolet_Equinox/
05-21-2010, 01:20 PM
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http://www.drivearabia.com/news/wp-c...oncept-450.jpg AWD LNF please. 
05-21-2010, 01:25 PM
#161
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You know this all im saying, Go to carmax put in the search the lowest allowed amount of cash, And just see how many cobalt there are, I just got back from a dealer who offered 6grand for my ******* car that I have very well maintained and has only 28k on the speedo, **** the cobalt its worthless has no resale value.
05-21-2010, 03:08 PM
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Sorry, but laughing at you is about all I can manage at this point. I never said that buying imports does not help the US economy at all, just that buying domestic helps the economy more. For me buying USA brands is all about being a good American. 
Thanks for the compliment on the sig. That's for certain individuals who believe when they saw the SS badge on the cobalt they were buying a real sports car. Oh, and the car in that pic is my wife's 2003 Buick Century. It has 170,000 miles on the clock. It has NEVER seen the inside of a shop, aside from regular maintenance, and gets right at 31 mpg on the open road. It also rides very well. That's the build quality you just do not find in imports, brought to you by GM.
Oh, and while we are talking about sigs please tell me that white thing with the big rice wing on it is not yours....
Thanks for the compliment on the sig. That's for certain individuals who believe when they saw the SS badge on the cobalt they were buying a real sports car. Oh, and the car in that pic is my wife's 2003 Buick Century. It has 170,000 miles on the clock. It has NEVER seen the inside of a shop, aside from regular maintenance, and gets right at 31 mpg on the open road. It also rides very well. That's the build quality you just do not find in imports, brought to you by GM.
Oh, and while we are talking about sigs please tell me that white thing with the big rice wing on it is not yours....
you have your wife (who i bet is directly related to you by blood. i.e. sister and or first cousin) in that hoopty of a car and your proud of it?
we all realize how quality american cars are compared to foreign cars. my car comes stock with brembos, recaros, bilstein shocks, enkei wheels... the list goes on and on, but for some reason those parts i have mentioned just dont ring a bell in the quality department, not to mention the muriad of other quality parts on my "low quality" import. my rice wing is included with said import and actually has a use, especially for an AWD car. i see your logic though.
lets not get into my car (you cant afford it anyways), thats not what this thread is about. if you have anything else left to say, please address it in a PM.
05-21-2010, 10:03 PM
#165
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Took you awhile to think all that up. lol.
One request... Leave my wife out of it please. I really like this back and forth with you, but that was over the line, and you well know it. Totally bad form.
Afford is not the issue. I make far more now than I did in the Army. I just would not drive it for the sake of good taste, not because it's an import.
Seriously, If you don't even drive a Cobalt anymore, I wonder why you are still here. I figure post count too high to move on...
Thank you by the way. This has been funny as hell. I appreciate your service to our country.
Anyway, enough wasted time.
I was hoping they would do something worthwhile with this car. The Aveo always seemed pointless to me, because it's always been such a disappointment in mpg for such a small car.
One request... Leave my wife out of it please. I really like this back and forth with you, but that was over the line, and you well know it. Totally bad form.
Afford is not the issue. I make far more now than I did in the Army. I just would not drive it for the sake of good taste, not because it's an import.
Seriously, If you don't even drive a Cobalt anymore, I wonder why you are still here. I figure post count too high to move on...
Thank you by the way. This has been funny as hell. I appreciate your service to our country.
Anyway, enough wasted time.
http://www.drivearabia.com/news/wp-c...oncept-450.jpg AWD LNF please.
Last edited by Will mpg; 05-21-2010 at 10:08 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
05-23-2010, 11:17 AM
#167
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I don't see the huge deal with the car unless your paying for a new SS/TC brand new.
Owners of SS models can hate on the base model car, but How much more did you pay for yours?
Rattles are easy to fix with $200 of sound deadening. 4x4 stance was fixed for $150. Performance cost money, but MOST individuals who are purchasing a base model cobalt could care less if it can do burnouts or beat a ricer by bus lengths.
People need to quit being so judgemental all because the car isn't jet engine fast... I know this board is all full of tuners, but seriously. People don't buy geo metro's and complain that it's not fast or fancy.
If you wanted something fast or fancy, don't buy the entry level car that gm produces.
Owners of SS models can hate on the base model car, but How much more did you pay for yours?
Rattles are easy to fix with $200 of sound deadening. 4x4 stance was fixed for $150. Performance cost money, but MOST individuals who are purchasing a base model cobalt could care less if it can do burnouts or beat a ricer by bus lengths.
People need to quit being so judgemental all because the car isn't jet engine fast... I know this board is all full of tuners, but seriously. People don't buy geo metro's and complain that it's not fast or fancy.
If you wanted something fast or fancy, don't buy the entry level car that gm produces.
05-23-2010, 11:59 AM
#168
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GM needs more of guys like this in their shops
Some one who can sit in something and call it like it is..I hate it when my "SS" rattles, it gives me the creeps sometimes and embarasses me when I have a friend or a date in my car. GM needs guys like this who can throw it back in their faces and say this is ****, step up your game.
Some one who can sit in something and call it like it is..I hate it when my "SS" rattles, it gives me the creeps sometimes and embarasses me when I have a friend or a date in my car. GM needs guys like this who can throw it back in their faces and say this is ****, step up your game.
05-23-2010, 12:03 PM
#169
I don't see the huge deal with the car unless your paying for a new SS/TC brand new.
Owners of SS models can hate on the base model car, but How much more did you pay for yours?
Rattles are easy to fix with $200 of sound deadening. 4x4 stance was fixed for $150. Performance cost money, but MOST individuals who are purchasing a base model cobalt could care less if it can do burnouts or beat a ricer by bus lengths.
People need to quit being so judgemental all because the car isn't jet engine fast... I know this board is all full of tuners, but seriously. People don't buy geo metro's and complain that it's not fast or fancy.
If you wanted something fast or fancy, don't buy the entry level car that gm produces.
Owners of SS models can hate on the base model car, but How much more did you pay for yours?
Rattles are easy to fix with $200 of sound deadening. 4x4 stance was fixed for $150. Performance cost money, but MOST individuals who are purchasing a base model cobalt could care less if it can do burnouts or beat a ricer by bus lengths.
People need to quit being so judgemental all because the car isn't jet engine fast... I know this board is all full of tuners, but seriously. People don't buy geo metro's and complain that it's not fast or fancy.
If you wanted something fast or fancy, don't buy the entry level car that gm produces.
05-23-2010, 12:11 PM
#170
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05-23-2010, 01:23 PM
#171
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I don't see the huge deal with the car unless your paying for a new SS/TC brand new.
Owners of SS models can hate on the base model car, but How much more did you pay for yours?
Rattles are easy to fix with $200 of sound deadening. 4x4 stance was fixed for $150. Performance cost money, but MOST individuals who are purchasing a base model cobalt could care less if it can do burnouts or beat a ricer by bus lengths.
People need to quit being so judgemental all because the car isn't jet engine fast... I know this board is all full of tuners, but seriously. People don't buy geo metro's and complain that it's not fast or fancy.
If you wanted something fast or fancy, don't buy the entry level car that gm produces.
Owners of SS models can hate on the base model car, but How much more did you pay for yours?
Rattles are easy to fix with $200 of sound deadening. 4x4 stance was fixed for $150. Performance cost money, but MOST individuals who are purchasing a base model cobalt could care less if it can do burnouts or beat a ricer by bus lengths.
People need to quit being so judgemental all because the car isn't jet engine fast... I know this board is all full of tuners, but seriously. People don't buy geo metro's and complain that it's not fast or fancy.
If you wanted something fast or fancy, don't buy the entry level car that gm produces.
05-23-2010, 01:23 PM
#172
So you would prefer more money went into the interior so it looks pretty and less into the suspension and engine? I hope you are talking about the base model and not an SS.
05-23-2010, 01:24 PM
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05-23-2010, 04:06 PM
#174
We are horsepower junkies....most of the world is not. GM should aim to please the masses, and release a few sporty cars for us on the side. But overall quality, even in the base models, should be their #1 concern
05-23-2010, 04:17 PM
#175
oh give me a @#$# break. The suspension on everything but the SS is so gawd damn awful and standard do you think it even matters? The base models are so plain, no money was even invested into the suspension so your point goes no where. If every other car manf. can produce a better car, then explain why GM cant? the new ford focus 2011 global platform, fiesta, fusion, mazda 3, mazda 6 ALL have better interiors and suspension than a cobalt base. so dont bring this bullshit in when we all know its possible. They find new materials and new processes to bring a better interior. That doesnt have to cost a lot. When you make a cheap ass fleet car the cobalt is what you get.