I have a LK9 engine in a turbo Saab 9-3 (like a LSJ) and it's got oil in the overflow bottle ie Creamy brown paste!

No water visible on dip stick and it not driving any different or running hot, the top hose to water bottle has enlarged.

any ideas?

 

I would make sure it's not just old ass Dexcool doing its thing

 

You can get a test kit to check for hydrocarbons in the coolant. That is a sign of a blown head gasket.

 

I drained the cooling system today and it was green, so its not Dexcool.

There is a caramel sludge that accumalates in the overflow bottle and the lines to the bottle though.

Nexy stop, after 16th is the workwhop for a TK test.

 

Wonder if someone mixed dexcool with the regular stuff?

 

That sounds like someone mixed the Dexcool and green coolant.

 

Could it just be condensation from sitting/ not letting a car fully warm up?

 

This problem is common in the 3800 community and it happens from running Dexcool too long and also from mixing green coolant with Dexcool.

 

Condensation, as in water, in the water-based coolant? Is that a serious question?

 

I second this. OP get ready for some not fun cleaning.

Remember who posted that, and just ignore him

 

i don't want to sound like a complete dick but shouldn't you be reading about information rather then writing it?

 

Hi all,

Just to clear that's it is not dexcool

I drained the coolant system via the tap on the bottom of the radiator first and green coolant came out. Then I flushed it twice with demineralised water and engine flush, cleaned the overflow bottle and all 3 hoses to the bottle and drained it each time, filled it again and drained it again.

In total I have over 30 litres drained. I then filled it with new coolant and demineralised water and took it for a 20min drive.

Check the bottle and full of caramel sludge.

Some where the oil under pressure is getting into the water, I guess head gasket.

Any other opinions?

 

When you flushed, did you get the engine to operating temp? If the tstat is closed you can't flush everything out.

Are you noticing a drop in your oil level? Does the sludge smell like oil?

Head Gasket is the most likely culprit. I don't know if there is any spot in your IM gasket that could allow mixing (the LNF doesn't, but my Integra IM gasket leaked coolant once).

 

Yes got it hot and then opened tapc*ck at botom of radiator and then just topped it up and went through this 3 times, each time it would loose around 4 litres (around half the capacity)

Actually the last time I just plumped in a garden hose into the feed to the thermostat housing and had a feed line of the top of radiator draining, I manged to fill a large bucket this way (15 litres)

The car has a small oil leak so hard to tell but you dive the car for weeks before the dip stick drops, so it looks like a little bit of oil in water makes a big impact.

I don't know if there are any water jackets and oil pressure on the inlet manifold that would allow them to mix?

 

What engine flush did you use? And how long did you allow the stuff to circulate at operating temp?

 

tectaloy radiator flush

Waited till operating temperature reached and allowed 20mins after (fans on and heater cycled)

 

Did the bottle only call for 20mins at operating temp? Most call for extended (4h +) to allow the t-stat to cycle multiple times

 

20mins at normal engine temperature but getting to flush was not the problem as when you opened the tapc*ck the green fluid would come out and the 15litre tray would fill and there was the muck on top as it does not mix. Like I said earlier I got through 30L which is 4 times the coolant system so I doubt it was'nt flushed out...

However, if the oil is still mixing with the water, as it is, you are chasing your tail. I wanted to prove that whether cleaning out the fluid would the caramel sludge come back? which it did. I am not familiar enough with this engine to know where the oil (under pressure) can cross over to water other than head gasket.

 

You wont get the entire system clean, the t-stat will prevent the coolant from flowing through the block. So if the PO drained the dexcool and didnt flush it correctly then filled it with the normal green stuff it will sludge and go the sludge you have to flush the system correctly. You've flushed stuff out of the rad, but if its not water soluble then more than likely there is still stuff in there. Pull some rad hoses and see if there is build up on the walls.

 

I'm still with this theory, as this same thing was a common problem with Dexcool with 3800s.

If it was the head gasket you would also be getting coolant in your oil.

 

I feel its important to note that 90% of auto parts stores stopped selling the "normal green stuff" you guys are thinking about years ago. Almost every 'green" antifreeze on the shelf is "all makes all models" compatible with dexcool. Has been that way for years because of so many manufacturers switching over to organic acid based coolants for "extended life". I do always recommend sticking exclusively with dexcool but mixing it with an all makes all models "green" coolant should have no effect on the cooling system. This sounds like a bad head gasket IMO, alot of the issues with dexcool have been worked out with GM using sealed cooling systems.

 

I disagree. I haven't never been to an autopart store that doesn't sell the old school green stuff.

OP said he doesn't see any coolant in the oil, and hasn't mentioned overheating or losing coolant so I don't see any signs of it being a blown head gasket.

 

A quick and dirty test for your head gasket. On a cold engine, start the car and rev it to 2.5-3k and hold it there for about 45-60seconds, then let it return to idle and shut it off. Open the coolant reservior, if there is pressure in the system you had a bad head gasket, if there isnt you head gasket is not the issue.

 

A couple of points:

1. Dexcool was not used by Saab in Australia in 2004, which this vehicle is
2. Head gasket can detoriate between water and oil passages and not effect combustion.
3. The car drives no different in any circumsatnces and does not over heat.
4. I did 4 hot flushes. so the thermostat was open.
5. I agree when I used the water hose it would of flushed the radiator but it was full of junk that was at the top of radiator which feeds back into overflow bottle.

 

Just in case someone reads this:

The problem was the water/oil heat exchanger had corroded. As the oil is up to 80psi it easily overcomes the water pressure, so the oil will inject into your coolant system.

To clean this up we used bio-degradable water based degreaser. (non flammable)

Remove the thermostat and gut it, as you need to re-use it to seal the housing
Remove the over flow bottle and replace it with a funnel, plug into the hose feeding the thermostat housing.

Put the radiator hose and fuel pump hose from the overflow bottle into the funnel (we used clear lines so you could see the oil particles, the old ones were plugged anyway)

We flushed the coolant system and drained the coolant system via the two lines until there was no oil left. Prepare to do this quite a few times and use plenty of water based degreaser. We also open the petc*ck

Replace the heat exchanger, we blocked it off with high temp silicon caps (isolate the oil from the coolant), rubber ones will blow!

When the two clear lines are clear you can refit a new thermostat and gasket, replace all your hoses as they will be damaged from the oil. and new coolant.

Enjoy