Charge Pipe Question
09-03-2009, 09:01 AM
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Charge Pipe Question
hey guys either getting charge pipes, trifecta, or downpipe next. i was wondering will i really see or hear any difference with new charge pipes or is it more a thing to do with a turbo upgrade?
09-03-2009, 09:07 AM
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before a tune.... you won't notice many differences at all.
After a tune, the smoother larger pipes help with heat dissapation, and airflow. The downpipe will give you a a better "butt dyno" increase than the pipes will for sure!
After a tune, the smoother larger pipes help with heat dissapation, and airflow. The downpipe will give you a a better "butt dyno" increase than the pipes will for sure!
09-03-2009, 09:49 AM
#5
I keep hearing that. My car is stock right now and I'm torn on what to do. Alot of people say tune it first. Then do downpipe..etc... I was just wondering whats the point in tuning it first, if your going to have to keep retuning it after you add another bolt on?
09-03-2009, 09:53 AM
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you don't have to keep retuning it.... that is a misconception.
You only need retunes with intakes, and sometimes charge pipes.
Tuning is the single best bang for you buck mod..... PERIOD
You only need retunes with intakes, and sometimes charge pipes.
Tuning is the single best bang for you buck mod..... PERIOD
09-03-2009, 09:58 AM
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Yup, I would get down pipe first and then tune ... biggest upgrade for the car is the down pipe in terms of bolt on performance. I got my DP and CP on at the same time and then tuned. I'm doing the airbox mod this weekend and then I'll retune for that.
09-03-2009, 10:02 AM
#8
Yea thats what I've heard. My dad had a beautiful 86' Grand National and when he went with me to get the my TC Balt he got all excited. I asked him what he did the the Grand National and he performance chip, and a downpipe and that was pretty much it. That bad boy moved...LOL
09-03-2009, 10:03 AM
#9
Same goes for an intake, the problem is with an intake you car may possible throw a CEL or your AFRs would be crazy, <--- tune is needed to both correct these and unleash the extra power the intake provides.
Heres a list:
STUFF that requires a tune.
-SRI CAI intakes
-new turbo
-bored intake manifold
-bored/ported head
-lower compression pistons
-nitrous oxide
-methanol
STUFF not requiring a tune.
-downpipe, catted or catless
-charge piping
-intercooler
-2.5"/3" exhaust
-spark plugs
-airbox modification.
Pretty much anything that does not affect the AFRs or compression ratio DIRECTLY will not require a tune at all. But in order to get any power gains a tune is required. downpipe will only change your exhaust tone for the time being till you get a tune.
Its a much better idea to tune once you get all your parts on. The intake is actually something you can live without the tune for alittle while. CIA SRI states that they get no crazy fluctuations. That sounded like a good deal to me.
09-03-2009, 10:13 AM
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Yeah I dunno where people keep getting that. A downpipe works fine on the stock tune, you just get no increases in power until the car is tune.
Same goes for an intake, the problem is with an intake you car may possible throw a CEL or your AFRs would be crazy, <--- tune is needed to both correct these and unleash the extra power the intake provides.
Heres a list:
STUFF that requires a tune.
-SRI CAI intakes
-new turbo
-bored intake manifold
-bored/ported head
-lower compression pistons
-nitrous oxide
-methanol
STUFF not requiring a tune.
-downpipe, catted or catless
-charge piping
-intercooler
-2.5"/3" exhaust
-spark plugs
-airbox modification.
Pretty much anything that does not affect the AFRs or compression ratio DIRECTLY will not require a tune at all. But in order to get any power gains a tune is required. downpipe will only change your exhaust tone for the time being till you get a tune.
Its a much better idea to tune once you get all your parts on. The intake is actually something you can live without the tune for alittle while. CIA SRI states that they get no crazy fluctuations. That sounded like a good deal to me.
Same goes for an intake, the problem is with an intake you car may possible throw a CEL or your AFRs would be crazy, <--- tune is needed to both correct these and unleash the extra power the intake provides.
Heres a list:
STUFF that requires a tune.
-SRI CAI intakes
-new turbo
-bored intake manifold
-bored/ported head
-lower compression pistons
-nitrous oxide
-methanol
STUFF not requiring a tune.
-downpipe, catted or catless
-charge piping
-intercooler
-2.5"/3" exhaust
-spark plugs
-airbox modification.
Pretty much anything that does not affect the AFRs or compression ratio DIRECTLY will not require a tune at all. But in order to get any power gains a tune is required. downpipe will only change your exhaust tone for the time being till you get a tune.
Its a much better idea to tune once you get all your parts on. The intake is actually something you can live without the tune for alittle while. CIA SRI states that they get no crazy fluctuations. That sounded like a good deal to me.
In my book, any part that I am adding/changing - I'll be retuning for. Hence why I did my bolt ons first. For the airbox mod, you need to retune. My buddy who did the same thing was seeing LTFT's of -7 with the airbox mod. If you mess with the intake in any matter, I'd adjust for it as that's the "bitchiest" part of this car.
If you get an FMIC you don't have to retune, but if you want more power out of it, I would! You can add some timing (more power) with an intercooler than if you didn't do anything at all. Why spend $400 on something, only to have it only do half of it's job (cooling better, but not adding power)
Just my .02
09-03-2009, 10:35 AM
#11
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I agree/disagree with you however. In order to make the most power for your upgrades, you should retune after. If you have a cat then go catless, I'd retune for the downpipe for maximizing airflow, etc.
In my book, any part that I am adding/changing - I'll be retuning for. Hence why I did my bolt ons first. For the airbox mod, you need to retune. My buddy who did the same thing was seeing LTFT's of -7 with the airbox mod. If you mess with the intake in any matter, I'd adjust for it as that's the "bitchiest" part of this car.
If you get an FMIC you don't have to retune, but if you want more power out of it, I would! You can add some timing (more power) with an intercooler than if you didn't do anything at all. Why spend $400 on something, only to have it only do half of it's job (cooling better, but not adding power)
Just my .02
In my book, any part that I am adding/changing - I'll be retuning for. Hence why I did my bolt ons first. For the airbox mod, you need to retune. My buddy who did the same thing was seeing LTFT's of -7 with the airbox mod. If you mess with the intake in any matter, I'd adjust for it as that's the "bitchiest" part of this car.
If you get an FMIC you don't have to retune, but if you want more power out of it, I would! You can add some timing (more power) with an intercooler than if you didn't do anything at all. Why spend $400 on something, only to have it only do half of it's job (cooling better, but not adding power)
Just my .02
09-03-2009, 11:29 AM
#12
right, well the way I see it, if it works jsut fine without the tune FOR THE TIME BEING dont tune after every little part or adjustment. trying to prevent the OP from throwing money away. Eventually when your done adding all the bolt ons that you plan on, tune. Stuff that requires a tune in my list are the things that are finicky and throw CELs or cause the car to run too lean or rich depending on the mods, losing gas mileage, damaging the engine, etc. No matter what your going to need the tune to get the power out of the parts. Just how much do you want to pay for a tune? 200$ or 1000$? thats what I was getting at.
09-03-2009, 11:36 AM
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Yea thats what I've heard. My dad had a beautiful 86' Grand National and when he went with me to get the my TC Balt he got all excited. I asked him what he did the the Grand National and he performance chip, and a downpipe and that was pretty much it. That bad boy moved...LOL
netted me 350+ whp and 380+ wtq and 12.95@ 116 in the 1/4. I'll have my new intercooler on today.
I agree/disagree with you however. In order to make the most power for your upgrades, you should retune after. If you have a cat then go catless, I'd retune for the downpipe for maximizing airflow, etc.
In my book, any part that I am adding/changing - I'll be retuning for. Hence why I did my bolt ons first. For the airbox mod, you need to retune. My buddy who did the same thing was seeing LTFT's of -7 with the airbox mod. If you mess with the intake in any matter, I'd adjust for it as that's the "bitchiest" part of this car.
If you get an FMIC you don't have to retune, but if you want more power out of it, I would! You can add some timing (more power) with an intercooler than if you didn't do anything at all. Why spend $400 on something, only to have it only do half of it's job (cooling better, but not adding power)
Just my .02
In my book, any part that I am adding/changing - I'll be retuning for. Hence why I did my bolt ons first. For the airbox mod, you need to retune. My buddy who did the same thing was seeing LTFT's of -7 with the airbox mod. If you mess with the intake in any matter, I'd adjust for it as that's the "bitchiest" part of this car.
If you get an FMIC you don't have to retune, but if you want more power out of it, I would! You can add some timing (more power) with an intercooler than if you didn't do anything at all. Why spend $400 on something, only to have it only do half of it's job (cooling better, but not adding power)
Just my .02
I have had cars that I have done... that do not require retunes after every mod.
Last edited by 1badBlueberrySC; 09-03-2009 at 11:36 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
09-03-2009, 11:42 AM
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I think we're missing the point here though; in order to maximize your bolt ons a tune should come last. That's what I'm saying. I'm not saying you need to retune after charge pipes, etc. but it's beneficial to do so.
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