there are so many areas to build power with this car i dont see why people would be spending money on a lightweight flywheel. I think that the most important things with this car is maintaining the durability of parts. I would say keeping the flywheel and putting a clutch that can handle 500 wheel torque... i dont think these cars will ever make anything more than that... not that it isnt capable but ... front wheel drive and 500 torque with horsepower to boot, i dont really see how the wheels can hook up.

 

slicks.....

 

I once saw an eye-opening demo showing that underdrive pulleys really gain you nothing. They dyno'd the car with the stock pulley and all accessories, then removed the drive belt altogether and dynod again. (not something you would normally want to do lol). Net gain? 0hp 0tq. With no accessories.

 

PMs.


They are great for this.

The LNF Flywheel is SUPPOSED to be smaller than the LSJ one, and the LNF clutch is supposed to be larger than the LSJ one.

 

I didn't see them mentioned anywhere in this thread so I'll just express MY experience with high performance clutches. As my sig shows I have a LS1 powered Pontiac Fiero GT. The largest engine that was available from GM for the Fiero was the 2.8 V6 which I think was rated about 165? HP. It used a 9 1/8 " clutch stock. With the conversion came more HP and torque. I am guessing 375 HP and probably an equal amount of torque. Obviously the stock clutch wasn't going to do what I wanted it to do. The space inside the bell housing on the Fiero 5sp is very limited and because it is part of the transmission I was still limited tothe very small 9 1/8 clutch. Included in the V8 Archie conversion kit was a Centerforce Dual Friction competition clutch and a steel flywheel. I gotta tell ya, I never had a problem with that little clutch hooking up. In fact, until I had custom axles made, the stock axles wouldn't stay in one piece. And that was with 235 drag radials only. Unfortunately the transmission front seal gave up the ghost and oiled down the disc which required pulling the cradle then the clutch (I'm getting really good at removing the engine cradle). Centerforce had me return the disc to them where they completely rebuilt it with the latest friction material and springs and returned it to me. NO CHARGE and because it took longer than expected they paid shipping too. Because they only sell this clutch as a package they rebuild the broken parts rather than give you new, which in my opinion is better because you know you're getting the latest stuff. The car is ready for spring. and so am I. So give Centerforce some consideration. They don't show a clutch for the LNF as yet on their website so call them. They're easy people to talk to and won't steer you wrong. I"m sure they have something by now. That's MY opinion!!

 

I just went with the Spec Stage 2. My stock clutch is finally giving out at 75K miles. I'm not putting down and serious power and I'm not wanting to so I believe the Spec Stage 2 will work just fine for my needs. Plus it saved me over $400 on what the other guys were spending on the Stage 3+

 

Damn that is AWESOME

And by the way, you're not right.

You have an LS1 powered Fiero...you know you are going to hell for that right?

 

I just spoke with Larry at Centerforce. He's the application guy. Their catalog doesn't list anything specifically fot the LNF but they have two clutches listed for the SS/SC. I can't answer the question if the SC and TC clutches would interchange but if the do their DFX Series clutch is rated for 450-475 Ft/lb. The one rated below that is rated 350 Ft/lb. Just something to consider. It's always nice to have alternatives. The lower rated model "DF 010249" is available from Jegs for $725Variety is the spice of life. The competition model "DFX 01010249" consists of clutch, disc, flywheel and TO bearing and is availlable at Crate Engine Depotis for $880. CED is a great discount!!! Think about it.

 

SS/SC and SS/TC clutch kits are not interchangable. Stock SS/SC are SAC, SS/TC are NON SAC stock....

Keep in mind we will price match and beat most places on SPEC, just have to PM us with the link.

 

Thanks for the correction. Out of curiousity what does the SAC stand for. If I'm going to get educated I want the whole lesson.

I think I just found it "self adjusting clutch"???

 

SAC = Self-Adjusting Clutch (pic below)



Non-SAC comes with an unsprung hub like so

 

See that! Momma was right. You learn something new every day. Thanks for setting me straight.

 

Perfect! Thanks Joe/08BlackSS/TC for the help.

 

Anytime Aaron!

 

My personal thoughts would be to sit back and realistically consider what you're going to do with the car before making your decision. If you end up replacing the stock clutch in the next year or two and install an aggressive 4 or 6-puck ceramic disc (which is more than likely what you'd need to hold that torque level) you're going to have a difficult time retaining stock-like drivability and service life. If you end up doing internals (i.e. pistons/liners) and slapping on a giant turbo that can support those power levels you may need that type of clutch, but if there's a good chance you'll stick with basic bolt-on type stuff and maybe a small bump in turbo size I'd probably lean towards an organic-based disc. They may "only" hold a hundred foot pounds or so less than what you want, but they also shouldn't kill drivability. Sure, you can live and daily drive a race type, ceramic puck clutch but trust me, it isn't fun on long commutes.



I've heard numerous similar stories over the years about their service being top notch. As to their clutches, I wouldn't have any trouble running one of their mild ones in a street setup. I have known other people over the years that have had issues but nine times out of ten it was due to an improper break-in of the friction material. Their organic-based discs seem a little more picky and require a little longer break-in than some other clutches, but if done properly usually hold up great if you're putting down power within their capacity range.

 

:sigh: you guys are confusing the hell out of me. and it's NOT NICE!
So i would want one that can handle about 400tq... even tho i won't be getting over 350hp in this car until i have another one. i'm just doing bolt'ons and a tune for now...
what's a good clutch/flywheel to go with for this...

what do ya mean it's not fun over long commutes? I'm not understanding how having a beefy clutch makes it harder to drive with, does it make the petal hard to push or something?

 

SPEC Stage 3+...

The petal does not press any harder than stock IMO.

 

oh. and can you change it to where the engage and disengage on the petal is a tad longer than what it is stock... i know you only gotta push it like a quarter of the way down to engage. if not that's cool too. i mean if you can change it without shortening the life of the clutch.

i think it'd be a little easier for other ppl to drive it like that. it doesn't bother me but if my mom had to drive my car. *god so help me, that she doesnt* i don't want her to **** something up for jumpin it out

 

You cant change the engament point... sorry...

 

Very informative thread. A++. IMO a lightened flywheel is worth it. More HP to the wheels. And to the guy that owns the ls1 fiero...sweet.

 

^^ i make the best threads....

 

ok so this ... http://www.turbotechracing.com/produ...3&idcategory=0

what's the light weight option mean?? and do will i have to buy a clutch and aluminum flywheel seprate? or does this one have that in the lighted option

 

All good information.. realistically I probably wont go beyond 400tq so an organic disk that can handle that would probably be all I would really need.

 

If you plan to stick on the stock turbo and not run slicks (which there aren't great options because of the front brake size anyways) and run out and buy a four-puck ceramic disc clutch set that can hold well north of 400 ft-lbs of torque you probably could daily drive it. I've done it before and currently have similar clutches in a couple of my cars to include my SRT-4. If you use the stock pressure plate then the clutch pedal pressure should not significantly change, but that's not the problem. Those discs are super aggressive and can work like an on-off switch. If you're doing a lot of stop and go driving, and heavens forbid you have any traffic jams on your commute, the disc is going to heat up and become even grabbier. Many of them don't have a coating over the hub springs and they rattle pretty loud when the car is in neutral. You get a lot of driveline shock when engaging the clutch from a stop. And because the clutches don't like to slip something has to give and that will more than likely be your front tires which will have a much reduced service life.

That's a few of the big reasons they aren't the best in a daily driver. Add to that a possibly shorter service life depending on the specific disc and you'll be spending a lot more money per mile for a race clutch that can hold insane power levels. And if you're not making those power levels and have a requirement for that type of clutch the downsides will outweigh the positives. Can you daily drive and commute with the ceramic puck discs? Sure, but if a good organic-based conventional disc will hold what you are capable of putting down you should carefully consider what you're getting in to.

Another extreme example of people going overboard on clutches would be trying to run a twin-disc racing setup on a street driven car and on cars that aren't making enough power to need one. Besides the much higher overall expense you also have to deal with a custom flywheel that has much less mass and make the car harder to drive at slow speeds and from a stock. Then if you're using it aggressively all the time it places a lot harder shock on the transaxle and I've seen them break things like input shafts (usually when running slicks but you stick get a lot of shock fatiguing components in regular street use).


My advice would be to pick whatever flywheel type you want. If you can get a custom aftermarket unit that is significantly lighter than stock it may be a pain to drive and you probably won't see a significant difference in power, but you more than likely will be able to drive around the different engine revving characteristics. On the pressure plate stick with one that has a clamping force similar to stock or you'll beat up the thrust bearing and bottom end of the engine (which can cause "crank walk" when that thrust bearing wears out and allows the crank and rotating assembly to move left and right in the block).

The main part you will have to think about though will be the clutch disc. Some types of discs are better than others but if you need massive holding power you can't have everything (e.g. smooth engagement, long service life, etc.), and if you realistically aren't going to be doubling your crank torque figures don't go too wild on the clutch. It's good to leave a little headroom but an excessive amount of extra capacity you'll never use will come with a cost. It's up to you to know what that will be and if you want to live with it.

 

Definitely will keep that in mind. Also, I did a lot of looking around and I believe your site is the cheapest one for the flywheels.

Also, can I get something straight, is it flywheel or flyheel??

The clutch I bought is for the stock flywheel. So if I want to go to a lightweight flywheel later on, would it be possible to do with that clutch? Is there a OEM style lightweight flywheel?