ZZP upgraded LNF fuel injectors?
08-27-2013, 08:06 AM
#77
Ha here from fb:
ZZPerformance.com Rosen is observant, picture is generic from google. Nothing to do with our part, just made for an easy post.
Scott is correct. It's not quite as marvelous as it sounds. The larger injectors are causing the HP rail to drop pressure. You still get more fuel but it's because it's increasing the pulse window. This is a bad thing. You want to decrease that window as you can make more power this way. There are instances where these alone would help but ideally you'd combine the larger injectors with the larger FP cam lobe.
This is simply another offering to assist in the never ending pursuit of HP. It's funny because we've heard now that these won't work, we've heard the cams and larger pump lobe doesn't work, we've heard that the 5th injector doesn't work. I guess nothing we sell works. It's just magic pixie dust we sprinkle in the fuel getting us past 600WHP on the LNF platform. LOL
Scott is correct. It's not quite as marvelous as it sounds. The larger injectors are causing the HP rail to drop pressure. You still get more fuel but it's because it's increasing the pulse window. This is a bad thing. You want to decrease that window as you can make more power this way. There are instances where these alone would help but ideally you'd combine the larger injectors with the larger FP cam lobe.
This is simply another offering to assist in the never ending pursuit of HP. It's funny because we've heard now that these won't work, we've heard the cams and larger pump lobe doesn't work, we've heard that the 5th injector doesn't work. I guess nothing we sell works. It's just magic pixie dust we sprinkle in the fuel getting us past 600WHP on the LNF platform. LOL
08-28-2013, 04:30 PM
#78
Former Vendor
The high pressure fuel pump is responsible for the maximum amount of torque your fuel system will support. The reason for this is simple. The pump is driven off the camshaft, so as engine rpm increases, the volume of fuel that the pump can flow increases proportionally. This removes the time factor from the horsepower equation, which leaves you with torque. Anyone running even just the stock turbo and E85 needs to address the high pressure fuel pump flow. Since full boost can be reached at low rpms, the pump is not operating quickly enough to keep up with fueling demands. Our larger fuel pump lobe cams increase the flow of the fuel pump by nearly 20%.
Since the injectors can only flow the same amount regardless of engine speed, they limit your maximum horsepower. With adequate fuel pump flow, the stock injectors can support more than 425whp on E85. I have run the tune a little leaner, maximized injector timing, and increased the pressure settings and pushed past 450whp. However, the injector closing time is pushing beyond where it should be for optimum performance. In some cases, we have seen gains of 20whp or more with no change in airflow even when the first test was not showing any misfires. In other words, even though everything seems fine, dropping the injector duty cycle from 40% to 35% can produce noticeable gains.
Since the injectors can only flow the same amount regardless of engine speed, they limit your maximum horsepower. With adequate fuel pump flow, the stock injectors can support more than 425whp on E85. I have run the tune a little leaner, maximized injector timing, and increased the pressure settings and pushed past 450whp. However, the injector closing time is pushing beyond where it should be for optimum performance. In some cases, we have seen gains of 20whp or more with no change in airflow even when the first test was not showing any misfires. In other words, even though everything seems fine, dropping the injector duty cycle from 40% to 35% can produce noticeable gains.
08-28-2013, 05:07 PM
#79
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The high pressure fuel pump is responsible for the maximum amount of torque your fuel system will support. The reason for this is simple. The pump is driven off the camshaft, so as engine rpm increases, the volume of fuel that the pump can flow increases proportionally. This removes the time factor from the horsepower equation, which leaves you with torque. Anyone running even just the stock turbo and E85 needs to address the high pressure fuel pump flow. Since full boost can be reached at low rpms, the pump is not operating quickly enough to keep up with fueling demands. Our larger fuel pump lobe cams increase the flow of the fuel pump by nearly 20%.
Since the injectors can only flow the same amount regardless of engine speed, they limit your maximum horsepower. With adequate fuel pump flow, the stock injectors can support more than 425whp on E85. I have run the tune a little leaner, maximized injector timing, and increased the pressure settings and pushed past 450whp. However, the injector closing time is pushing beyond where it should be for optimum performance. In some cases, we have seen gains of 20whp or more with no change in airflow even when the first test was not showing any misfires. In other words, even though everything seems fine, dropping the injector duty cycle from 40% to 35% can produce noticeable gains.
Since the injectors can only flow the same amount regardless of engine speed, they limit your maximum horsepower. With adequate fuel pump flow, the stock injectors can support more than 425whp on E85. I have run the tune a little leaner, maximized injector timing, and increased the pressure settings and pushed past 450whp. However, the injector closing time is pushing beyond where it should be for optimum performance. In some cases, we have seen gains of 20whp or more with no change in airflow even when the first test was not showing any misfires. In other words, even though everything seems fine, dropping the injector duty cycle from 40% to 35% can produce noticeable gains.
08-29-2013, 10:09 AM
#80
Former Vendor
Yes, our larger pump lobe makes a big difference.
08-29-2013, 12:58 PM
#82
Senior Member
Now you all know that ZZP will be doing more testing soon. Patience!!!
Yours truly is running around on these right now as we speak and im lovin them!. Matt wouldn't just chime in and explain something that wasn't relevent
I currently have stage 3s in the car :P it may be qujte the wait. :P
The stage 1 pluses are most times more than enough for most setups. They are AMAZING. I ran them for numerous years myself.
Shitty man 
I've been on mine for a few years now. 2-3 seasons.
This, very much so
Yours truly is running around on these right now as we speak and im lovin them!. Matt wouldn't just chime in and explain something that wasn't relevent
The stage 1 pluses are most times more than enough for most setups. They are AMAZING. I ran them for numerous years myself.
I've been on mine for a few years now. 2-3 seasons.This, very much so
Last edited by Scythe_Snake; 08-29-2013 at 01:28 PM.
08-29-2013, 07:22 PM
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08-30-2013, 03:16 PM
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09-03-2013, 10:43 AM
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09-03-2013, 12:40 PM
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14% "larger" it says. does that really mean 14% performance increase in this case? given the pump restriction. maybe it was already answered but i'd be interested in HP change from a full bolt on/E LNF to JUST this (as in no upgraded cam). also, while im on a tangent, would this shorten your pump life span since its stressing it more?
09-03-2013, 12:49 PM
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How are these injectors any more "delicate" than the stock LNF injectors that we need to have a new fuel rail purchased with core return and all that jazz?
I replaced my stock LNF injector seals and its a cake walk so how are replacing these injectors any different or worse? just curious
I replaced my stock LNF injector seals and its a cake walk so how are replacing these injectors any different or worse? just curious
09-03-2013, 02:11 PM
#96
How are these injectors any more "delicate" than the stock LNF injectors that we need to have a new fuel rail purchased with core return and all that jazz?
I replaced my stock LNF injector seals and its a cake walk so how are replacing these injectors any different or worse? just curious
I replaced my stock LNF injector seals and its a cake walk so how are replacing these injectors any different or worse? just curious
09-03-2013, 02:43 PM
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Possible that zzp doesn't want to be responsible for someone Installing them and then damaging them and complaining/demanding new ones for free when it was the installers fault, basically taking the guess work out of it. Not everyone is going to be perfect and not possibly damage them on install.
