Secondary Air Injection on late production 2006 L61's
11-26-2006, 08:35 AM
#29
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Originally Posted by cawpin
I believe the GMPP intake DOES have a SAI port.
https://www.cobaltss.net/forums/2-2l-l61-performance-tech-45/need-help-w-gm-intake-install-39193/
11-28-2006, 01:03 PM
#30
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SAI issues
ok guys if u run an 06 balt that has SAI the only head pipe that u can run w/o setting ses light is the honed GMPP pipe. i spoke to a gmpp guy for 1/2 hour and he said that the honed manifold would work and not set a DTC for SAI aside from that you would have to flash the ecm to think it was a 05 model,then the ecm would not look for the O2 sensor to lean out at startup,also SAI only bruns @ start up to frie off unburned gasses in the cat
11-28-2006, 01:25 PM
#31
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Well, that's not correct either. The GMPP manifold doesn't provide for the system, so you would have to delete it just like with any other manifold. Everything else is right, but it doesn't matter which manifold you use.
11-28-2006, 01:32 PM
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Sai
I also ran the part number against my VIN @ the dealer where i work usually if there was an issue with a GMPP part number not working in a vin specific search so maybe im getting told false info
11-28-2006, 01:37 PM
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Sai
also the GMPP manifold is in essance a stock manifold "honed" out so the bypass ports in the manifold should still be there. i will be purchasing one soon and will post my results on the install etc
11-29-2006, 12:08 AM
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Originally Posted by mrgoodwrench78
also the GMPP manifold is in essance a stock manifold "honed" out so the bypass ports in the manifold should still be there. i will be purchasing one soon and will post my results on the install etc
the honed gmpp manifold is a cast iron manifold , and does not have the provisions for the AIR injection set up
look at the pictures in the first post and go find pics of the gmpp manifold , WAY different and wont work
11-29-2006, 12:33 AM
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Originally Posted by cawpin
I believe the GMPP intake DOES have a SAI port.
Does it? I read on some other thread that it doesn't and the GMPP Intakes come with a note, "For 05-7 2.4's and 05 2.2's"
11-29-2006, 09:24 AM
#37
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Originally Posted by 97cavie24ls
yeah that would be VERY WRONG , and he had no idea what your talking about
the honed gmpp manifold is a cast iron manifold , and does not have the provisions for the AIR injection set up
look at the pictures in the first post and go find pics of the gmpp manifold , WAY different and wont work
the honed gmpp manifold is a cast iron manifold , and does not have the provisions for the AIR injection set up
look at the pictures in the first post and go find pics of the gmpp manifold , WAY different and wont work
im not saying thats right that was the way gm explained it to me,the only way to find out is try it and wait for the SES light
11-29-2006, 11:30 AM
#38
I'm old school
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Okay, two things
First, NEITHER the GMPP intake or exhaust provide for the SAI system. Case closed.
Second, I applaud your desire to delete the system by installing both, but to "wait and see if a CEL comes on" is never a good way to go about modifing. I can almost assure you it will turn on a CEL. I've simply not seen anybody try yet. As you mentioned, you should probably get a reflash from an earlier software version before SAI was installed in order for it to work correctly.
Now, if you do all three of those things (intake, exhuast, reflash), and you get a working car with no CEL, then that is GREAT news that people will want to know. So let us know too!
First, NEITHER the GMPP intake or exhaust provide for the SAI system. Case closed.
Second, I applaud your desire to delete the system by installing both, but to "wait and see if a CEL comes on" is never a good way to go about modifing. I can almost assure you it will turn on a CEL. I've simply not seen anybody try yet. As you mentioned, you should probably get a reflash from an earlier software version before SAI was installed in order for it to work correctly.
Now, if you do all three of those things (intake, exhuast, reflash), and you get a working car with no CEL, then that is GREAT news that people will want to know. So let us know too!
11-29-2006, 11:52 AM
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You'll definetly throw a SES light for any tampering with the AIR system. Probably a p2430, but there are others depending on what lines you disconnect. The entire system is monitored by a series of pressure sensors that compare actual pressure before and after the AIR pump to expected pressure. I believe there is also an I/M monitor for secondary AIR as well, which, you will never pass.
11-29-2006, 01:20 PM
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i don't know about all these sensors......its just running fresh air through, technicly not really emissions related unless the o2 sensor is calibrated to read higher levels of oxygen and not pull a lean code. If you dissabled the system it would read rich and cut fuel but ONLY if its being monitered. If it isn't then no worries. Has anyone contacted GM about this system? Maybe they can help us clear up the fog.....
ps. Nice VD link Witt lmao
ps. Nice VD link Witt lmao
11-29-2006, 01:20 PM
#41
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Originally Posted by Witt
The entire system is monitored by a series of pressure sensors that compare actual pressure before and after the AIR pump to expected pressure. .
11-29-2006, 01:30 PM
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The secondary air injection (AIR) system aids in the reduction of hydrocarbon emissions during a cold start. ***explanation of what it does yadda yadda***
A pressure sensor is used to monitor the air flow from the AIR pump. The control module supplies the internal pressure sensor with a 5-volt reference, and electrical ground, and a signal circuit.
The AIR diagnostic uses 3 phases to test the AIR system:
1. DTCs P0411 and P2430 run during Phase 1.
2. DTCs P2430 and P2440 run during Phase 2.
3. DTCs P2444 runs during Phase 3.
In all 3 phases, testing is accomplished by comparing the measured pressure against the expected pressure. The control module detects faults in the AIR pump, AIR control solenoid valve/pressure sensor assembly, and the exhaust check valve. The pressure sensor can also detect leaks and restrictions in the secondary AIR system plumbing.
2006 Helm/GM Service Manual for Cobalt/Pursuit, Volume 2 page 6-1701.
A pressure sensor is used to monitor the air flow from the AIR pump. The control module supplies the internal pressure sensor with a 5-volt reference, and electrical ground, and a signal circuit.
The AIR diagnostic uses 3 phases to test the AIR system:
1. DTCs P0411 and P2430 run during Phase 1.
2. DTCs P2430 and P2440 run during Phase 2.
3. DTCs P2444 runs during Phase 3.
In all 3 phases, testing is accomplished by comparing the measured pressure against the expected pressure. The control module detects faults in the AIR pump, AIR control solenoid valve/pressure sensor assembly, and the exhaust check valve. The pressure sensor can also detect leaks and restrictions in the secondary AIR system plumbing.
2006 Helm/GM Service Manual for Cobalt/Pursuit, Volume 2 page 6-1701.
11-29-2006, 01:32 PM
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short version: remove the AIR plumbing to the exhaust, you will throw an SES and I/M monitor will fail.
Edit: As for only monitoring O2 sensors, on a cold start, O2 sensors are disregarded as they don't show accurately at low temps.
Edit: As for only monitoring O2 sensors, on a cold start, O2 sensors are disregarded as they don't show accurately at low temps.
Last edited by Witt; 11-29-2006 at 01:50 PM.
11-29-2006, 08:01 PM
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cold start has its own system in the ECM. The computer is preprogramed on what to do on a cold start situation. So technicly SAI should be disregarded too, as emissions are worse at cold start and fresh air would cool the cat making warm up take longer
11-29-2006, 08:40 PM
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Another direct quote from service manuals:
The Secondary Air Injection (AIR) System aids in the reduction of hydrocarbon exhaust emissions during a cold start-up. This occurs when the start-up engine coolant temperature (ECT) is between 5-50C (41-122F) and the intake air temperature (IAT) is between 5-60C (41-140F). The AIR pump operates 5-60 seconds after start-up.
The AIR pump sends pressurized fresh air into the pipes/hoses through the open control/shut-off valve, and into the exhaust manifold. The extra air accelerates the catalyst operation, helping it to reach operating temperature faster.
The Secondary Air Injection (AIR) System aids in the reduction of hydrocarbon exhaust emissions during a cold start-up. This occurs when the start-up engine coolant temperature (ECT) is between 5-50C (41-122F) and the intake air temperature (IAT) is between 5-60C (41-140F). The AIR pump operates 5-60 seconds after start-up.
The AIR pump sends pressurized fresh air into the pipes/hoses through the open control/shut-off valve, and into the exhaust manifold. The extra air accelerates the catalyst operation, helping it to reach operating temperature faster.
11-29-2006, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Halfcent
Where are you getting that from? And adding fresh air doesn't cool the cat. It adds oxygen to the unburnt gas in the exhaust and hence burns.
11-30-2006, 12:42 AM
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i know the original electric air pumps used in the mid 90's LT1's , came on at start up , and also at predetermined times while driving
and those early 1's are very similar to the new 1's they way they will work
pacesetter does plan on a header made for the car with the air injection system , just gotta get the stock parts
and those early 1's are very similar to the new 1's they way they will work
pacesetter does plan on a header made for the car with the air injection system , just gotta get the stock parts