Tuning for 2,2l engine natural aspirated, more rpm
10-05-2015, 06:11 AM
#1
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Tuning for 2,2l engine natural aspirated, more rpm
Hello,
I`m new in this forum and need some help with my 2,2L engine.
Here in Germany there are not many parts avialable for this engine. The really specialists for this engine are in the US. Oh man, 1400HP and 11000rpm is making me speechless. Wow!!
I`m a little bit older and in the early 90`s I had a 2,0L OHC engine in my GM/Opel.
Naturally aspirated with over 200HP at 9500rpm with 50mm "double Weber carburettor". I love this sound!
That is how I want to increase power of my 2,2L ecotec engine (of course with injection). Everything for more rpm.
What parts do I need for this?
Of course rods and pistons, no balancers, lighter flywheel, camsprings (which ones?) and what camshafts.
I do the milling of the cyl. head. Made several heads when I was younger.
I already have a complete 2,5" exhaust with sports cat and manifold
Thank you very much for some help
Ralf
I`m new in this forum and need some help with my 2,2L engine.
Here in Germany there are not many parts avialable for this engine. The really specialists for this engine are in the US. Oh man, 1400HP and 11000rpm is making me speechless. Wow!!
I`m a little bit older and in the early 90`s I had a 2,0L OHC engine in my GM/Opel.
Naturally aspirated with over 200HP at 9500rpm with 50mm "double Weber carburettor". I love this sound!
That is how I want to increase power of my 2,2L ecotec engine (of course with injection). Everything for more rpm.
What parts do I need for this?
Of course rods and pistons, no balancers, lighter flywheel, camsprings (which ones?) and what camshafts.
I do the milling of the cyl. head. Made several heads when I was younger.
I already have a complete 2,5" exhaust with sports cat and manifold
Thank you very much for some help
Ralf
10-05-2015, 09:51 AM
#2
For the cam springs aka valve springs I highly recommend Supertech 75# valve springs.
http://zzperformance.com/ecotec/cams...ring-kits.html
^These are superior in terms of quality compared to the other options out there.
http://zzperformance.com/ecotec/cams...ring-kits.html
^These are superior in terms of quality compared to the other options out there.
Last edited by Staged07SS; 10-05-2015 at 10:59 AM.
10-05-2015, 10:21 AM
#4
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You're def going to want to delete the balance shafts if you're wanting to spin above 7000rpm. If you have a timing chain driven water pump switch to electric, and delete the AC system.
You might look into a LSJ head has they are sand cast and already flow better than the L61 before any port/polish work
You might look into a LSJ head has they are sand cast and already flow better than the L61 before any port/polish work
10-05-2015, 12:17 PM
#5
I'm attempting 200+ wheel hp now also. I have ZZP's stage 2 cams, a spare cylinder head that I've ported and had milled .030", and the typical bolt ons(2.4 intake manifold/TB, header/DP/exhaust). I'm also self-tuned for ethanol. The only thing I'm waiting on is money for a head gasket and timing kit.
Depends on the year of the OP's car. If 07-08 the lsj head would not retain the cam sensor.
You're def going to want to delete the balance shafts if you're wanting to spin above 7000rpm. If you have a timing chain driven water pump switch to electric, and delete the AC system.
You might look into a LSJ head has they are sand cast and already flow better than the L61 before any port/polish work
You might look into a LSJ head has they are sand cast and already flow better than the L61 before any port/polish work
10-06-2015, 11:42 AM
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Thanks for your help.
So far it should be a LSJ head, ZZP or Supertech springs.
I read that the 2,4L inlet manifold should be a good choice with a 65mm throttle. In Germany the manifold is not easy to buy. Has anybody an idea where I can buy it?
Is it better to use a hydro camshaft or change to mech. valvetrain?
Regards
Ralf
So far it should be a LSJ head, ZZP or Supertech springs.
I read that the 2,4L inlet manifold should be a good choice with a 65mm throttle. In Germany the manifold is not easy to buy. Has anybody an idea where I can buy it?
Is it better to use a hydro camshaft or change to mech. valvetrain?
Regards
Ralf
10-06-2015, 11:51 AM
#12
Do some more research on the lsj head flowing more than the l61 head. Everyone seems to say that, but From what I understand it isn't true.
It was my understanding that the lsj and l61 heads flow withing 1% of each other, but the lsj head had structural improvements. It has a stronger casting, and more reinforcement around, i believe, cyl 1 and 4, which were weak points in the super high hp l61 drag cars.
I believe this information was provided by Maven years back, who was extremely reputable and knowledgeable with the platform. I don't have solid fact backing this up, so I am telling you to do your own research.
Everyone always says the lsj head flows better, but I haven't seen anyone post up flow bench fact. I am forced to believe it is just assumption without seeing proof.
It was my understanding that the lsj and l61 heads flow withing 1% of each other, but the lsj head had structural improvements. It has a stronger casting, and more reinforcement around, i believe, cyl 1 and 4, which were weak points in the super high hp l61 drag cars.
I believe this information was provided by Maven years back, who was extremely reputable and knowledgeable with the platform. I don't have solid fact backing this up, so I am telling you to do your own research.
Everyone always says the lsj head flows better, but I haven't seen anyone post up flow bench fact. I am forced to believe it is just assumption without seeing proof.
10-06-2015, 11:52 AM
#13
I just found it on another forum. Maven posted this, but again, it lacks physical proof. Based on his reputation, I lean towards him vs the hearsay around the forum
****
"The LSJ is sand cast and the L61 is lost foam cast. The LSJ head is stronger, it has reinforcements for the water jackets and #1/#4 combustion chambers cast in(these areas are notoriously weak in high effort L61s, and are modified in L61 race heads)
The heads use different valve train but they are swappable, you can put the better LSJ stuff(valves/springs) in an L61 head.
The production heads flow within about 1% of each other(so its not worth the swap as a flow only mod)
The Street and Race GMPP CNC L61 heads flow EXACTLY the same as each other, the use the same porting. duh.(the only difference is the Race head is prepped for O-ring/copper head gaskets and has the water jacket/combustion chamber mods I mentioned)
The Race LSJ head is totally f'n awesome, but itsnt worth it on 99.99% of non-pro race vehicle. A: its crazy expensive. B: its only available to pro racers and those with connections in GM Racing C: it actually flows LESS on the intake side at lift under .400"(where most street engines spend 99% of their life) D: it requires the use of the o-ring/copper head gasket setup and therefore a modified block. It does however have real good intake flow over .400" and just totally f'n awesome exhaust flow at everything over about .150" lift
The jist of the story. If youve got an LSJ head....use it, they rock and come with better valvetrain from the word go, it is not worth paying more for a complete LSJ head than you could buy a ported L61 head though. got it?"
****
****
"The LSJ is sand cast and the L61 is lost foam cast. The LSJ head is stronger, it has reinforcements for the water jackets and #1/#4 combustion chambers cast in(these areas are notoriously weak in high effort L61s, and are modified in L61 race heads)
The heads use different valve train but they are swappable, you can put the better LSJ stuff(valves/springs) in an L61 head.
The production heads flow within about 1% of each other(so its not worth the swap as a flow only mod)
The Street and Race GMPP CNC L61 heads flow EXACTLY the same as each other, the use the same porting. duh.(the only difference is the Race head is prepped for O-ring/copper head gaskets and has the water jacket/combustion chamber mods I mentioned)
The Race LSJ head is totally f'n awesome, but itsnt worth it on 99.99% of non-pro race vehicle. A: its crazy expensive. B: its only available to pro racers and those with connections in GM Racing C: it actually flows LESS on the intake side at lift under .400"(where most street engines spend 99% of their life) D: it requires the use of the o-ring/copper head gasket setup and therefore a modified block. It does however have real good intake flow over .400" and just totally f'n awesome exhaust flow at everything over about .150" lift
The jist of the story. If youve got an LSJ head....use it, they rock and come with better valvetrain from the word go, it is not worth paying more for a complete LSJ head than you could buy a ported L61 head though. got it?"
****
Last edited by 07blackg5; 10-06-2015 at 11:57 AM.
10-06-2015, 01:58 PM
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WOW. What a description!!!!Thank you 07blackg5.
Nice! So I can use my other l61 engine and modify it.
Maybe it is important to use the LSJ for superchargers or big turbos. I want to reach the +power by +revs. And maybe the pressure for a torque of about 220Nm(it is na) is not too much for the 1st and 4th chamber of the i61 head.
It is the manifold of the LE5 engine I`m looking for with 65mm throttle. Don*t know where to buy.
And the camshafts. I think over 8000rpm it is difficult with hydros, or what do you think.
Thank you all.
Regards
Ralf
Nice! So I can use my other l61 engine and modify it.
Maybe it is important to use the LSJ for superchargers or big turbos. I want to reach the +power by +revs. And maybe the pressure for a torque of about 220Nm(it is na) is not too much for the 1st and 4th chamber of the i61 head.
It is the manifold of the LE5 engine I`m looking for with 65mm throttle. Don*t know where to buy.
And the camshafts. I think over 8000rpm it is difficult with hydros, or what do you think.
Thank you all.
Regards
Ralf
10-06-2015, 02:52 PM
#22
everyone seems to think the 08+ manifolds flow the same as the 05-07, but I dont buy it lol. They might, but the 05-07 has been proven over and over on the l61, where I don't think the 08+ has been.
The 05-07 le5 manifold was by far the best thing I did to my car when it was NA. And I ran it on the l61 throttle body.
The 05-07 le5 manifold was by far the best thing I did to my car when it was NA. And I ran it on the l61 throttle body.
10-07-2015, 02:07 AM
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Thanks.
I was happy about your link and asked the seller if he would send it to Germany. Then I read the info that the older manifolds are better. I was too fast. Better first read everyting.
I even can buy a new one if you have an adress for me. No problem.
In the 90`s I had a GM 2,0L OHC motor. It was a race engine from a famous company in Germany that made the tuning for opel. A car crashed in the first rounds and I took this engine. 95000rpm very smoothly. I like it.
For crusing I have an identic car only with 17" rims, nothing more modified. So at the weekends it can be a little louder and faster. Only 60miles away from me is the most exciting and difficult race track of the world. The "Nordschleife". One round is over 12 miles with 63 corners. I think on "Forza motorsports" you can choose this. I love it ....with real cars or bikes.
Now I have to work a little bit
Thank you very much. Have a nice day.
Ralf
I was happy about your link and asked the seller if he would send it to Germany. Then I read the info that the older manifolds are better. I was too fast. Better first read everyting.
I even can buy a new one if you have an adress for me. No problem.
In the 90`s I had a GM 2,0L OHC motor. It was a race engine from a famous company in Germany that made the tuning for opel. A car crashed in the first rounds and I took this engine. 95000rpm very smoothly. I like it.
For crusing I have an identic car only with 17" rims, nothing more modified. So at the weekends it can be a little louder and faster. Only 60miles away from me is the most exciting and difficult race track of the world. The "Nordschleife". One round is over 12 miles with 63 corners. I think on "Forza motorsports" you can choose this. I love it ....with real cars or bikes.
Now I have to work a little bit
Thank you very much. Have a nice day.
Ralf