Heres a good issue concerning cobalt tuning..
Heres a good issue concerning cobalt tuning..
#09-06-04-026: Identifying Non-GM (Aftermarket) Engine and Transmission Calibrations
Subject: Identifying Non-GM (Aftermarket) Engine and Transmission Calibrations
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
General Motors is identifying an increasing number of engine, transmission and catalytic converter part failures that are the result of non-GM (aftermarket) engine and transmission control calibrations being used.
When alteration to the GM-released engine or transmission control calibrations occurs, it subjects powertrain and driveline components (engine , transmission, transfer case, driveshaft and rear axle) to stresses that were not tested by General Motors. It is because of these unknown stresses, and the potential to alter reliability, durability and emissions performance, that GM has adopted a policy to cancel any remaining warranty coverage to the powertrain and driveline components whenever the presence of a non-GM (aftermarket) calibration is confirmed - even if the non-GM control module calibration is subsequently removed.
Warranty coverage is based on the equipment and calibrations that were released on the vehicle at time of sale, or subsequently updated by GM. That’s because GM testing and validation matches the calibration to a host of criteria that is essential to assure reliability, durability and emissions performance over the life of the warranty coverage and beyond. Stresses resulting from calibrations different than those tested and released by GM can damage or weaken components, leading to poor performance and or shortened life.
Additionally, non-GM (aftermarket) issued engine control modifications often do not meet the same emissions performance standards as GM issued calibrations. Depending on state statutes, individuals who install engine control module calibrations that put the vehicle outside the parameters of emissions certification standards may be subject to fines and/or penalties.
This bulletin outlines a procedure to identify the presence of non-GM (aftermarket) calibrations. GM recommends performing this check whenever a hard part failure is seen on internal engine or transmission components, or before an engine assembly or transmission assembly is being replaced under warranty. It is also recommended that the engine calibration verification procedure be performed whenever diagnostics indicate that catalytic converter replacement is indicated.
In May 2009, the PQC will begin piloting a process to confirm the ECM/PCM calibration is GM issued. Beginning on May 18, 2009, the PQC will require a picture of the engine calibration verification screen, as outlined in this bulletin, before authorizing any V8 gas powered engine replacement.
If a non-GM calibration is found and verification has taken place through GM, the remaining powertrain and driveline warranty will be cancelled and notated in GMVIS and the dealership will be notified.
•Plug in the Tech 2®.
•Go to diagnostics and build the vehicle.
•Select "Powertrain".
•Select "Engine".
•*Select "Engine Control Module" or "PCM".
•*Select "Module ID Information" or "I/M Information System" if module ID information selection is not available.
•*If "I/M information System" was selected, it may be necessary to select "Vehicle Information" in order to display the calibration information.
•Take a CLEAR digital picture of the Tech 2® screen showing the engine calibration verification information as shown above.
•E-mail the snapshot picture to ****. In the subject line of the email include the phrase "V8 Cal" as well as the complete VIN and Dealer BAC. In the body of the e-mail, inlcude the VIN, mileage, R.O. number and BAC.
•Allow two hours for the PQC to verify the calibrations and set up the case details.
•You may call the PQC two hours after submitting the e-mail for authorization to replace the assembly. This will provide them time to receive, review and set up a case on the request. Please be prepared to provide all the usual documentation that is normally required when requesting an assembly authorization from the PQC.
If the CVN information is displayed as "N/A", it will be necessary to contact the TCSC (1-800-222-2222 English or 1-800-222-2222 French) to obtain the CVN information.
__________________
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#08-06-04-033: Identifying Aftermarket Engine Calibrations 2.0L, 2.2L, 2.4L, 2.8L, 2.9L, 3.0L, 3.1L, 3.2L, 3.4L, 3.5L, 3.6L, 3.8L, 3.9L, 4.2L, 4.3L, 4.4L, 4.6L, 4.8L, 5.0L, 5.3L, 5.7L, 6.0L 6.2L 7.0L, 7.4L, 8.1L Gas - (May 30, 2008)
Subject: Identifying Aftermarket Engine Calibrations 2.0L, 2.2L, 2.4L, 2.8L, 2.9L, 3.0L, 3.1L, 3.2L, 3.4L, 3.5L, 3.6L, 3.8L, 3.9L, 4.2L, 4.3L, 4.4L, 4.6L, 4.8L, 5.0L, 5.3L, 5.7L, 6.0L, 6.2L, 7.0L, 7.4L, 8.1L Gas Powered Engines Only
Models: 2006-2009 GM Passenger Cars and Light Duty Trucks
2006-2009 HUMMER H2, H3
Excluding Pontiac Vibe, G8, Chevrolet Aveo, All Saturn and Saab Models
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ***************************
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ***************************
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ***************************
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ***************************
Important: This bulletin applies to Gas Powered Engines ONLY. For Diesel Powered Engines, refer to Service Bulletin #08-06-04-006A.
If a suspicious hard part failure is observed in the engine, transmission, transfer case or driveline, perform the calibration verification described to determine if a non-GM issued engine calibration is installed. Non-GM issued engine calibrations subject driveline components to stresses different than the calibrations which these components were validated to. Repairs to transmission, transfer case and/or other driveline components where a non-GM engine calibration has been verified are not covered under the terms of the New Vehicle Warranty.
Instructions for Confirming Calibration Verification Number (CVN):
Go to TIS2WEB
Select "Calibration Information (SPS Info)"
Enter VIN
Select "Get Cal ID"
Select "ECM Engine Control Module"
Select "Next"
Select "Complete History"
Print
Take the printout to the vehicle along with the Tech 2®
Plug in the Tech 2®
Go to diagnostics and build the vehicle
Select "Powertrain"
Select "Engine"
*Select "Engine Control Module" or "PCM"
*Select "Module ID Information" or "I/M Information System" if module ID information selection is not available.
*If "I/M information System" was selected in step 15, it may be necessary to select "Vehicle Information" in order to display the calibration information.
Compare the calibration ID and Calibration Verification Numbers (CVN) to the Calibration Verification Numbers (CVN) on the printout.
* Steps may vary by controller.
Although the part numbers will be the same for each, it's the CVN that will determine if the calibration is GM issued. If ALL of the CVN's are EXACTLY the same, the calibration is GM issued.
If the part numbers match and ANY CVN's DO NOT match the printout, it is likely that a non-GM certified calibration has been installed.
If the CVN information is displayed as "N/A", it will be necessary to contact the TCSC to obtain the CVN information.
If a non-GM calibration is found to be in the ECM (CVN's on the Tech 2 do not match TIS printout) - In order to document the case -- a CLEAR digital picture should be taken of the Tech 2® screen showing the VIN and the CVN's that do not match the TIS2WEB printout. The picture, VIN and reason the vehicle is currently in for service should be emailed to and for verification. Please copy your GM District Service Manager (DVM) on the e-mail. GM will verify if the CVN's are not GM issued and respond via e-mail within 72 hours.
GM bulletins are intended for use by professional technicians, NOT a "do-it-yourselfer". They are written to inform these technicians of conditions that may occur on some vehicles, or to provide information that could assist in the proper service of a vehicle. Properly trained technicians have the equipment, tools, safety instructions, and know-how to do a job properly and safely. If a condition is described, DO NOT assume that the bulletin applies to your vehicle, or that your vehicle will have that condition. See your GM dealer for information on whether your vehicle may benefit from the information
Apparently its crackdown time. Stage 1 kit better be released soon!
Subject: Identifying Non-GM (Aftermarket) Engine and Transmission Calibrations
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
General Motors is identifying an increasing number of engine, transmission and catalytic converter part failures that are the result of non-GM (aftermarket) engine and transmission control calibrations being used.
When alteration to the GM-released engine or transmission control calibrations occurs, it subjects powertrain and driveline components (engine , transmission, transfer case, driveshaft and rear axle) to stresses that were not tested by General Motors. It is because of these unknown stresses, and the potential to alter reliability, durability and emissions performance, that GM has adopted a policy to cancel any remaining warranty coverage to the powertrain and driveline components whenever the presence of a non-GM (aftermarket) calibration is confirmed - even if the non-GM control module calibration is subsequently removed.
Warranty coverage is based on the equipment and calibrations that were released on the vehicle at time of sale, or subsequently updated by GM. That’s because GM testing and validation matches the calibration to a host of criteria that is essential to assure reliability, durability and emissions performance over the life of the warranty coverage and beyond. Stresses resulting from calibrations different than those tested and released by GM can damage or weaken components, leading to poor performance and or shortened life.
Additionally, non-GM (aftermarket) issued engine control modifications often do not meet the same emissions performance standards as GM issued calibrations. Depending on state statutes, individuals who install engine control module calibrations that put the vehicle outside the parameters of emissions certification standards may be subject to fines and/or penalties.
This bulletin outlines a procedure to identify the presence of non-GM (aftermarket) calibrations. GM recommends performing this check whenever a hard part failure is seen on internal engine or transmission components, or before an engine assembly or transmission assembly is being replaced under warranty. It is also recommended that the engine calibration verification procedure be performed whenever diagnostics indicate that catalytic converter replacement is indicated.
In May 2009, the PQC will begin piloting a process to confirm the ECM/PCM calibration is GM issued. Beginning on May 18, 2009, the PQC will require a picture of the engine calibration verification screen, as outlined in this bulletin, before authorizing any V8 gas powered engine replacement.
If a non-GM calibration is found and verification has taken place through GM, the remaining powertrain and driveline warranty will be cancelled and notated in GMVIS and the dealership will be notified.
•Plug in the Tech 2®.
•Go to diagnostics and build the vehicle.
•Select "Powertrain".
•Select "Engine".
•*Select "Engine Control Module" or "PCM".
•*Select "Module ID Information" or "I/M Information System" if module ID information selection is not available.
•*If "I/M information System" was selected, it may be necessary to select "Vehicle Information" in order to display the calibration information.
•Take a CLEAR digital picture of the Tech 2® screen showing the engine calibration verification information as shown above.
•E-mail the snapshot picture to ****. In the subject line of the email include the phrase "V8 Cal" as well as the complete VIN and Dealer BAC. In the body of the e-mail, inlcude the VIN, mileage, R.O. number and BAC.
•Allow two hours for the PQC to verify the calibrations and set up the case details.
•You may call the PQC two hours after submitting the e-mail for authorization to replace the assembly. This will provide them time to receive, review and set up a case on the request. Please be prepared to provide all the usual documentation that is normally required when requesting an assembly authorization from the PQC.
If the CVN information is displayed as "N/A", it will be necessary to contact the TCSC (1-800-222-2222 English or 1-800-222-2222 French) to obtain the CVN information.
__________________
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
#08-06-04-033: Identifying Aftermarket Engine Calibrations 2.0L, 2.2L, 2.4L, 2.8L, 2.9L, 3.0L, 3.1L, 3.2L, 3.4L, 3.5L, 3.6L, 3.8L, 3.9L, 4.2L, 4.3L, 4.4L, 4.6L, 4.8L, 5.0L, 5.3L, 5.7L, 6.0L 6.2L 7.0L, 7.4L, 8.1L Gas - (May 30, 2008)
Subject: Identifying Aftermarket Engine Calibrations 2.0L, 2.2L, 2.4L, 2.8L, 2.9L, 3.0L, 3.1L, 3.2L, 3.4L, 3.5L, 3.6L, 3.8L, 3.9L, 4.2L, 4.3L, 4.4L, 4.6L, 4.8L, 5.0L, 5.3L, 5.7L, 6.0L, 6.2L, 7.0L, 7.4L, 8.1L Gas Powered Engines Only
Models: 2006-2009 GM Passenger Cars and Light Duty Trucks
2006-2009 HUMMER H2, H3
Excluding Pontiac Vibe, G8, Chevrolet Aveo, All Saturn and Saab Models
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ***************************
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ***************************
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ***************************
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ***************************
Important: This bulletin applies to Gas Powered Engines ONLY. For Diesel Powered Engines, refer to Service Bulletin #08-06-04-006A.
If a suspicious hard part failure is observed in the engine, transmission, transfer case or driveline, perform the calibration verification described to determine if a non-GM issued engine calibration is installed. Non-GM issued engine calibrations subject driveline components to stresses different than the calibrations which these components were validated to. Repairs to transmission, transfer case and/or other driveline components where a non-GM engine calibration has been verified are not covered under the terms of the New Vehicle Warranty.
Instructions for Confirming Calibration Verification Number (CVN):
Go to TIS2WEB
Select "Calibration Information (SPS Info)"
Enter VIN
Select "Get Cal ID"
Select "ECM Engine Control Module"
Select "Next"
Select "Complete History"
Take the printout to the vehicle along with the Tech 2®
Plug in the Tech 2®
Go to diagnostics and build the vehicle
Select "Powertrain"
Select "Engine"
*Select "Engine Control Module" or "PCM"
*Select "Module ID Information" or "I/M Information System" if module ID information selection is not available.
*If "I/M information System" was selected in step 15, it may be necessary to select "Vehicle Information" in order to display the calibration information.
Compare the calibration ID and Calibration Verification Numbers (CVN) to the Calibration Verification Numbers (CVN) on the printout.
* Steps may vary by controller.
Although the part numbers will be the same for each, it's the CVN that will determine if the calibration is GM issued. If ALL of the CVN's are EXACTLY the same, the calibration is GM issued.
If the part numbers match and ANY CVN's DO NOT match the printout, it is likely that a non-GM certified calibration has been installed.
If the CVN information is displayed as "N/A", it will be necessary to contact the TCSC to obtain the CVN information.
If a non-GM calibration is found to be in the ECM (CVN's on the Tech 2 do not match TIS printout) - In order to document the case -- a CLEAR digital picture should be taken of the Tech 2® screen showing the VIN and the CVN's that do not match the TIS2WEB printout. The picture, VIN and reason the vehicle is currently in for service should be emailed to and for verification. Please copy your GM District Service Manager (DVM) on the e-mail. GM will verify if the CVN's are not GM issued and respond via e-mail within 72 hours.
GM bulletins are intended for use by professional technicians, NOT a "do-it-yourselfer". They are written to inform these technicians of conditions that may occur on some vehicles, or to provide information that could assist in the proper service of a vehicle. Properly trained technicians have the equipment, tools, safety instructions, and know-how to do a job properly and safely. If a condition is described, DO NOT assume that the bulletin applies to your vehicle, or that your vehicle will have that condition. See your GM dealer for information on whether your vehicle may benefit from the information
Apparently its crackdown time. Stage 1 kit better be released soon!
Well if Im reading that rite it all comes down to if the cvn number comes back as stock which the new Trifecta tune will do. If they dig further and look at the actual values that the tune is composed of then they may find something.
Either way the stage kit isnt goin to save you the headache. As soon as someone has a critical part failure while on the stage tune the first thing the dealer is gonna stay is you abused the car and the warranty is toast. Hell, they do that now with stock cars.
Either way the stage kit isnt goin to save you the headache. As soon as someone has a critical part failure while on the stage tune the first thing the dealer is gonna stay is you abused the car and the warranty is toast. Hell, they do that now with stock cars.
Well if Im reading that rite it all comes down to if the cvn number comes back as stock which the new Trifecta tune will do. If they dig further and look at the actual values that the tune is composed of then they may find something.
Either way the stage kit isnt goin to save you the headache. As soon as someone has a critical part failure while on the stage tune the first thing the dealer is gonna stay is you abused the car and the warranty is toast. Hell, they do that now with stock cars.
Either way the stage kit isnt goin to save you the headache. As soon as someone has a critical part failure while on the stage tune the first thing the dealer is gonna stay is you abused the car and the warranty is toast. Hell, they do that now with stock cars.
Not only are you reassured that your parts will be covered, you are reassured that they did their homework since they have money on the line...
Joined: 12-30-07
Posts: 14,079
Likes: 197
From: NEPA
But the logic behind it is that we can trust that things won't break because GM won't put something out that will break a power train component...who knows what the reliability of the after market tunes are...
Not only are you reassured that your parts will be covered, you are reassured that they did their homework since they have money on the line...
Not only are you reassured that your parts will be covered, you are reassured that they did their homework since they have money on the line...
But the logic behind it is that we can trust that things won't break because GM won't put something out that will break a power train component...who knows what the reliability of the after market tunes are...
Not only are you reassured that your parts will be covered, you are reassured that they did their homework since they have money on the line...
Not only are you reassured that your parts will be covered, you are reassured that they did their homework since they have money on the line...
Their book keeping is fine...it is not showing a desire to be 1 step ahead of consumer preferences and being at the mercy of consumer preferences changing overnight while the product lineup takes years to change...
I find it incredibly hard to believe there isn't something stored on each module (which all communicate) that could trip GM off to the fact it has been swapped. The mileage might not be stored in the ECM but what about driving hours, etc.? Swapping an ECM seems far too simple imo if a dealer were to follow GM recommended service procedures when a vehicle comes in for warranty work
.
Not trying to argue the fact, if that's the case then that's the case but this imo would be a huge oversight on GM's part if they can't tell by simply swapping the module.
.Not trying to argue the fact, if that's the case then that's the case but this imo would be a huge oversight on GM's part if they can't tell by simply swapping the module.
If the dealer turns your traction control off or puts it into comp mode then they're racing your car or driving it in a way they shouldn't be. IE: abusing a car theyre supposed to be fixing. Good lawyer can nail them hard for abusing your car.
I find it incredibly hard to believe there isn't something stored on each module (which all communicate) that could trip GM off to the fact it has been swapped. The mileage might not be stored in the ECM but what about driving hours, etc.? Swapping an ECM seems far too simple imo if a dealer were to follow GM recommended service procedures when a vehicle comes in for warranty work
.
Not trying to argue the fact, if that's the case then that's the case but this imo would be a huge oversight on GM's part if they can't tell by simply swapping the module.
.Not trying to argue the fact, if that's the case then that's the case but this imo would be a huge oversight on GM's part if they can't tell by simply swapping the module.
And how many engines have blown? 1...2...perhaps a few more? I don't see the engine giving anyone problems as it is VERY well engineered and VERY strong. What do you plan on using the warranty for? The only thing I could potentially lose out on is my warranty for my engine and ECM if they find my tune...Like I've said before...With this stage kit..Do you really think they are going to cover you if you fry your synchros, burn your clutch, snap an axle or any of the other odd ends of the drivetrain that can break when racing? They will claim Abuse/Wear out parts faster than you can turn your head...
Iwas told that miles won't match up by someone so I was going off of what I heard. I'm glad it doesn't because I have a seccond ecu and if something breaks ill be using it so that's good news for me too. Well if something major happens and I swap my ecu and they find out and void my warranty then **** it. You gotta pay to play
I find it incredibly hard to believe there isn't something stored on each module (which all communicate) that could trip GM off to the fact it has been swapped. The mileage might not be stored in the ECM but what about driving hours, etc.? Swapping an ECM seems far too simple imo if a dealer were to follow GM recommended service procedures when a vehicle comes in for warranty work
.
Not trying to argue the fact, if that's the case then that's the case but this imo would be a huge oversight on GM's part if they can't tell by simply swapping the module.
.Not trying to argue the fact, if that's the case then that's the case but this imo would be a huge oversight on GM's part if they can't tell by simply swapping the module.
And how many engines have blown? 1...2...perhaps a few more? I don't see the engine giving anyone problems as it is VERY well engineered and VERY strong. What do you plan on using the warranty for? The only thing I could potentially lose out on is my warranty for my engine and ECM if they find my tune...Like I've said before...With this stage kit..Do you really think they are going to cover you if you fry your synchros, burn your clutch, snap an axle or any of the other odd ends of the drivetrain that can break when racing? They will claim Abuse/Wear out parts faster than you can turn your head...
This post is old as dirt, GM put out the same bulletin over a year ago when I had my GT, yes...the tech 2 can tell your CVN numbers don't match.
UNLESS...you've got the newest Trifecta tune, then the car boosts to stock PSI levels when in normal mode anyway so nothing seems off ON TOP of being undetectable by a tech 2 scanner
UNLESS...you've got the newest Trifecta tune, then the car boosts to stock PSI levels when in normal mode anyway so nothing seems off ON TOP of being undetectable by a tech 2 scanner
I posted this TSB over a year ago , not much has happened since then.
https://www.cobaltss.net/forums/general-cobalt-68/gm-now-looking-aftermarket-tunes-114905/
https://www.cobaltss.net/forums/general-cobalt-68/gm-now-looking-aftermarket-tunes-114905/
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