Originally Posted by Matt M

I have people ask me about that from time to time, but we have not had that issue on our cars. I honestly wouldn't know the best approach. I have seen my share of ICs with coolant and/or oil in the bottom of them, though. It causes a lot of MAF issues, but the solution is obvious in those cases.

Originally Posted by Zander916

Wow... LSJ plugs in an LNF? I don't trust dealers that much. Where I live I've never personally seen another LNF Cobalt. When I ordered mine the dealer had no clue about the car whatsoever. They thought it was still the LSJ Cobalt. I had to explain to them that it's different.
I knew what I was buying though so I ordered the car anyway. lol

Originally Posted by Frogstofall

So you didn't have to adjust the MAF calibrations in Scythe Snake's car? That would surprise me...

Originally Posted by Matt M

It's a blow-through MAF with an intercooler between the turbo and the MAF sensor. Switching out to the next larger turbo really doesn't affect the MAF readings. In a non-intercooled setup with a different number of blades on the new turbo, you might see MAF readings that vary by 10-15% at the same boost level.

Originally Posted by EXsoccer1921

can you retune my gf?? she's just not performing at all.

Originally Posted by 09CobaltSS1

How hard is it to convert the LNF to a blow through system? Me likey how they work, I just never knew the LNF could be setup to do this..

Originally Posted by Matt M

It's pretty easy with our lower charge tube and a new MAF chart. We have had a couple complaints of moisture causing inconsistent MAF readings, but it seems few and far between. I just can't say it has never happened.

Originally Posted by Matt M

We ran as high as 30psi on the old setup. This time it was pushed to 35 and the wot trims were within 2% with the AFR curve right on target. There was no reason to make any changes, especially because he has been instructed to never try this at home.

Originally Posted by 09CobaltSS1

Really? hmmmm.... Now by new maf chart, do you mean the stock lnf maf is just rescaled somehow to work as a blow through, or are you using a different maf entirely (such as an le5) and scaling it accordingly?

Originally Posted by FasterIsBetter

He dynoed 562 on 30psi?!?

Originally Posted by Matt M

The book says that in this case, you should inquire about a head job. If one can not be performed, then you might have to cut your losses and trade in for a newer model.

Originally Posted by Matt M

We hear it quite often in the mod car community- “I need a retune.” Getting “retuned” has somehow taken priority over diagnosing actual issues that lie elsewhere. When we suggest that the tune is not necessarily causing any of the issues that the car is having, we are usually told that everything else is fine, so it must be the ECM. I always found it strange that the blame usually ends up there, but it is certainly the most common mentality. When we suggest that there could have been a mistake made in the build or something could have been overlooked, inevitably there were several ASE certified master mechanics with 50 years experience each that helped build NASCAR engines in their spare time that were involved in the project. In response to this phenomenon, I would like to take a few minutes to share some issues that I have dealt with first hand.

First was a turbo car that was running way too rich and needed a retune. Now when I say way too rich, I mean leaving a trail of black smoke and fouling spark plugs. Of course it seemed odd that our ECM file would be that far off, but we received the ECM back for a retune. Everything in the file looked right to me, so we started asking questions and the customer found out that he had 100psi fuel pressure and could not figure out why. After asking a few more questions, I determined that the return fuel line needed to be checked for kinks or blockage. In the end, the line was blocked in some way and the issue had nothing to do with the ECM.

Second was a turbo 3800 that was a full build with a new motor that ran terribly and “needed a dyno tune.” When the car showed up at our shop, we found that the MAF calibrator was not installed despite being included in the kit and clearly labeled. This device adjusts the fueling by more than 40%! We installed it and found that the car still ran very poorly. The ignition module had been fried due to the wrong coil bolts being used. They bottomed out and the coils were loose on the module. We replaced the module (and coil bolts) and it still had a misfire on one cylinder. After troubleshooting for a bit, we pulled off the crank pulley and found a bent reluctor wheel. After repairing that, we found that the fuel pump canister had issues with the scavenge system and the car would run lean under load under ¼ tank of fuel. After fixing that, the car ran very well, but the turbo was quite laggy. We made a guess that the valve seat for the wastegate was not installed and it was correct. After installing that, the actual tune in the PCM was nearly spot on and only required minor tweaks for optimum performance.

Third was an LNF that we dyno’d at our meet this past Saturday. When it had low boost numbers and put down low power with quite a few mods and our 1.0 file on the ECM, I was asked to retune it. I looked at the scan for a few seconds and said, “It doesn’t need a tune. There is either a boost leak or the home-made intake tube is not flowing well at all.” At this point, Ryan grabbed the pressure tester and found that our competitor’s intercooler had a cracked weld and therefore leaked boost. Next, the customer chose to purchase our IC, which was installed on the spot. After returning to the dyno, the boost was higher, but there were quite a few misfires. Again I was approached about possible tuning needs because the plugs had already been replaced. I asked who had replaced the plugs and was told that a dealership did that. I then asked Ryan to pull the spark plugs and try to find something wrong with them. A few minutes later he walked back in with one LNF plug and three LSJ plugs. Somehow it appears that the super master ultra technician at the dealership with infinite experience figured it would be alright to run spark plugs that don’t even reach the combustion chamber when they are installed. Ryan installed LNF plugs and the misfires went away, the car picked up a bunch of power and the customer is happy. Now let’s consider what would have happened if this customer went to a typical car club dyno day. He would have left there making way less power than he should while being told that the problem is that ZZPs canned tuned isn’t very good. He might then proceed to try to remote tune this setup with one of many tuners on the forum. Of course it would never run right until someone stopped blaming the tune and looked for the actual problem at hand.

Now having brought up these three instances, I feel that it is important to say that all of these were issues that I have dealt with in the past week alone! There are literally hundreds of these situations that we have dealt with over the years. In most cases, people want to insist that the PCM is the cause of all of their problems. Since I believe that the actual problems lie elsewhere in most cases, I prefer to take the approach of diagnosing a mechanical issue or problem with the installation of parts before I will agree to change the way that I believe that the ECM should be set up in an effort to solve unrelated issues.

Anyhow, those are some of my thoughts for today. If you read the whole thing, just try to keep it in mind next time you hear that someone’s car needs to be retuned. It might not need to have the tune modified at all. [/rambling]

Originally Posted by dbr

yup the lnf was my car, and it did have all those problems that where solved by zzp on the spot. i do thank you matt, ryan, and tim for solving those for me. i do agree that people do need to check thier cars over before anything is touched, but thats why i didn't touch my car because i didn't know what was modded or not. i do disagree that i would have blamed zzp and their pcm flash for having small dyno numbers at any other car club meet. i would simply go get it tooken car of, no problem. thats why i choose zzp. you guys do great work! and i'm not mad at this post, **** happens! but if anybody purchases a modded car, as a tuner would you want them to either continue adding mods to a pointless build with no goal in mind except for "everyones doing it " mind set or just take it to a prodfessional and have them guide you.....thats what im doing!

Originally Posted by dbr

thank you sir! and i don't doubt you guys one bit, your products are awesome. and my bad for bringing up such a hack job up to your place of business, but i gotta make it right...with zzp's help ofcourse