Trany Noise
12-03-2009, 06:11 AM
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Trany Noise
Everytime I switch gears (specially betwen 1st and second) I hear a *cluck* sound. Is this normal? I 1st thought this was a loose axle but it only happens when I switch gears. anyone confronted this? is this normal? Thanks gang
12-03-2009, 06:34 AM
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It's pretty normal. These things just have really vocal drivetrains. The only way I've found effective at minimizing the noise is to slip the clutch slightly into 2nd while trying to rev match...strange sounding I know...but that's really the only way I can describe it ha ha...and it takes too much effort...so I just clunk into 2nd like everyone else. But as for it being normal...yes...you're good.
12-03-2009, 11:56 AM
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It's pretty normal. These things just have really vocal drivetrains. The only way I've found effective at minimizing the noise is to slip the clutch slightly into 2nd while trying to rev match...strange sounding I know...but that's really the only way I can describe it ha ha...and it takes too much effort...so I just clunk into 2nd like everyone else. But as for it being normal...yes...you're good.
12-03-2009, 01:46 PM
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yah i've also found that shifting at higher rpm's from 1st to 2nd stops the clunking and makes for a much smoother shift (obviously not red-lining it from every take off) but it seems to me like the tranny like's higher rpm's to shift....it doesnt like going slow lol...but that's just my opinion i could be wrong or technically wrong
12-03-2009, 01:55 PM
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That's because the gearing between 1/2 has a larger gap in the RPMs than the rest. 1/2 likes a shift around 3500/4000, every other gear seems to accept 3000ish with only a slight clunk. After a while you don't even notice it anymore, now if you hear the "slap" sound THAT'S different, it means the clutch engaged way too fast and slapped off the flywheel.
11-01-2012, 04:42 PM
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Hi everyone, This is a posting I made to HHR SS forum so some the comments are not necessarily meant for this forum.
Please read the following carefully:.
1. The clunk noise you hear after you switch gears and engage at the new speed is 100% normal. Your dealer is right. It is not crappy chevy/saab/swedish design or quality. Nothing is broken.
2. High performance transmission/clutch all act the same way i.e. Ferraris, Porsche's etc.
3. After some time, I now drive my manual HHR/Cobalt SS mostly without hearing any clunk, whether I'm slowly accelerating or driving competitively.
I have posted a similar response to this 2 years ago on HHRSS forum site. The reason why you hear the clunk is because the speed of the engine is drastically different then the speed of the car's transaxle for the new gear you are engaging.
Depending on your style of driving, you will hear the clunk while switching from 1st-2nd or from 2nd to 3rd but not always for 3rd to 4th or 4th to 5th. Why? Because at higher speeds the engine is at lower RPM relative to the transaxle speed, therefore the speeds are somewhat similar. You release the clutch and there is no clunk.
How to avoid the clunk:
This may require you to learn a new method of driving manual.
a. You take off on 1st gear
b. when its time to switch gears, release the clutch and change gears as usual.
c. now the trick is releasing the clutch to continue at 2nd gear
-while releasing the clutch do not wait for it to engage, instead start slowly pushing the gas pedal. This allows the speed of input shaft to match the speed of the engine at 2nd gear. Make sure the engine starts spinning again before or while you start re-engaging the cluth.
- the trick is figuring out where exactly does the clutch grip and when the speed has to be more or less matching with the input shaft. You will learn with experience.
d. the result: you will not hear a clunk.
e. The first time you try to do this you may rev your engine too high or not high enough. With time you will learn how much gas is needed. The clunk sound will tell you whether or not you are synchronized.
f. Repeat the same process for 2nd to 3rd.
g. For 4th and 5th gears you will notice that the manual synchronization you are having to perform is not so necessary at higher gears since the engine is at lower RPM at higher speeds.
h. When downshifting, the same rules apply otherwise you will hear the clunk at any gear you are shifting to, including 4th. When downshifting from 5th to 4th remember your engine will spin faster therefore you must rev the engine up before you engage 4th. Don't be surprised to hear the clunk at speeds of 80 mph or higher.
i. How long does it take to get used to this new method of shifting? It took me about 3 months and today I sometimes do cause the clunk. It drives me crazy just like most of you, but at least I know what I did wrong.
j. Is there anyway to minimize the clunk without having to manually synchronize? Possibly if you switch from 1st to 2nd very quickly, leaving less time for the engine to wind down. Of course for shifting down you still have to rev up.
k. Why is my HHR SS like this? Why can't it be like my Honda stick shift? :-)
This is because your HHR SS is a high performance racing inspired vehicle. For explanation please read the provided Wiki link. I have included below an important paragraph from the article which pertains to this topic:
Manual transmission - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Even though automobile and light truck transmissions are now almost universally synchronized, transmissions for heavy trucks <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truck> and machinery, motorcycles, and for dedicated racing <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_racing> are usually not. Non-synchronized transmission <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-synchronous_transmission> designs are used for several reasons. The friction material, such as brass <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass> , in synchronizers is more prone to wear and breakage than gears, which are forged steel, and the simplicity of the mechanism improves reliability and reduces cost. In addition, the process of shifting a synchromesh transmission is slower than that of shifting a non-synchromesh transmission. For racing of production-based transmissions, sometimes half the teeth (or dogs <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_(engineering)> ) on the synchros are removed to speed the shifting process, at the expense of greater wear."
Regards,
Chris
Please read the following carefully:.
1. The clunk noise you hear after you switch gears and engage at the new speed is 100% normal. Your dealer is right. It is not crappy chevy/saab/swedish design or quality. Nothing is broken.
2. High performance transmission/clutch all act the same way i.e. Ferraris, Porsche's etc.
3. After some time, I now drive my manual HHR/Cobalt SS mostly without hearing any clunk, whether I'm slowly accelerating or driving competitively.
I have posted a similar response to this 2 years ago on HHRSS forum site. The reason why you hear the clunk is because the speed of the engine is drastically different then the speed of the car's transaxle for the new gear you are engaging.
Depending on your style of driving, you will hear the clunk while switching from 1st-2nd or from 2nd to 3rd but not always for 3rd to 4th or 4th to 5th. Why? Because at higher speeds the engine is at lower RPM relative to the transaxle speed, therefore the speeds are somewhat similar. You release the clutch and there is no clunk.
How to avoid the clunk:
This may require you to learn a new method of driving manual.
a. You take off on 1st gear
b. when its time to switch gears, release the clutch and change gears as usual.
c. now the trick is releasing the clutch to continue at 2nd gear
-while releasing the clutch do not wait for it to engage, instead start slowly pushing the gas pedal. This allows the speed of input shaft to match the speed of the engine at 2nd gear. Make sure the engine starts spinning again before or while you start re-engaging the cluth.
- the trick is figuring out where exactly does the clutch grip and when the speed has to be more or less matching with the input shaft. You will learn with experience.
d. the result: you will not hear a clunk.
e. The first time you try to do this you may rev your engine too high or not high enough. With time you will learn how much gas is needed. The clunk sound will tell you whether or not you are synchronized.
f. Repeat the same process for 2nd to 3rd.
g. For 4th and 5th gears you will notice that the manual synchronization you are having to perform is not so necessary at higher gears since the engine is at lower RPM at higher speeds.
h. When downshifting, the same rules apply otherwise you will hear the clunk at any gear you are shifting to, including 4th. When downshifting from 5th to 4th remember your engine will spin faster therefore you must rev the engine up before you engage 4th. Don't be surprised to hear the clunk at speeds of 80 mph or higher.
i. How long does it take to get used to this new method of shifting? It took me about 3 months and today I sometimes do cause the clunk. It drives me crazy just like most of you, but at least I know what I did wrong.
j. Is there anyway to minimize the clunk without having to manually synchronize? Possibly if you switch from 1st to 2nd very quickly, leaving less time for the engine to wind down. Of course for shifting down you still have to rev up.
k. Why is my HHR SS like this? Why can't it be like my Honda stick shift? :-)
This is because your HHR SS is a high performance racing inspired vehicle. For explanation please read the provided Wiki link. I have included below an important paragraph from the article which pertains to this topic:
Manual transmission - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Even though automobile and light truck transmissions are now almost universally synchronized, transmissions for heavy trucks <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truck> and machinery, motorcycles, and for dedicated racing <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_racing> are usually not. Non-synchronized transmission <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-synchronous_transmission> designs are used for several reasons. The friction material, such as brass <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass> , in synchronizers is more prone to wear and breakage than gears, which are forged steel, and the simplicity of the mechanism improves reliability and reduces cost. In addition, the process of shifting a synchromesh transmission is slower than that of shifting a non-synchromesh transmission. For racing of production-based transmissions, sometimes half the teeth (or dogs <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_(engineering)> ) on the synchros are removed to speed the shifting process, at the expense of greater wear."
Regards,
Chris
11-01-2012, 04:54 PM
#9
Hi everyone, This is a posting I made to HHR SS forum so some the comments are not necessarily meant for this forum.
Please read the following carefully:.
1. The clunk noise you hear after you switch gears and engage at the new speed is 100% normal. Your dealer is right. It is not crappy chevy/saab/swedish design or quality. Nothing is broken.
2. High performance transmission/clutch all act the same way i.e. Ferraris, Porsche's etc.
3. After some time, I now drive my manual HHR/Cobalt SS mostly without hearing any clunk, whether I'm slowly accelerating or driving competitively.
I have posted a similar response to this 2 years ago on HHRSS forum site. The reason why you hear the clunk is because the speed of the engine is drastically different then the speed of the car's transaxle for the new gear you are engaging.
Depending on your style of driving, you will hear the clunk while switching from 1st-2nd or from 2nd to 3rd but not always for 3rd to 4th or 4th to 5th. Why? Because at higher speeds the engine is at lower RPM relative to the transaxle speed, therefore the speeds are somewhat similar. You release the clutch and there is no clunk.
How to avoid the clunk:
This may require you to learn a new method of driving manual.
Illl stick to hearing the noise . Thank u
lol
a. You take off on 1st gear
b. when its time to switch gears, release the clutch and change gears as usual.
c. now the trick is releasing the clutch to continue at 2nd gear
-while releasing the clutch do not wait for it to engage, instead start slowly pushing the gas pedal. This allows the speed of input shaft to match the speed of the engine at 2nd gear. Make sure the engine starts spinning again before or while you start re-engaging the cluth.
- the trick is figuring out where exactly does the clutch grip and when the speed has to be more or less matching with the input shaft. You will learn with experience.
d. the result: you will not hear a clunk.
e. The first time you try to do this you may rev your engine too high or not high enough. With time you will learn how much gas is needed. The clunk sound will tell you whether or not you are synchronized.
f. Repeat the same process for 2nd to 3rd.
g. For 4th and 5th gears you will notice that the manual synchronization you are having to perform is not so necessary at higher gears since the engine is at lower RPM at higher speeds.
h. When downshifting, the same rules apply otherwise you will hear the clunk at any gear you are shifting to, including 4th. When downshifting from 5th to 4th remember your engine will spin faster therefore you must rev the engine up before you engage 4th. Don't be surprised to hear the clunk at speeds of 80 mph or higher.
i. How long does it take to get used to this new method of shifting? It took me about 3 months and today I sometimes do cause the clunk. It drives me crazy just like most of you, but at least I know what I did wrong.
j. Is there anyway to minimize the clunk without having to manually synchronize? Possibly if you switch from 1st to 2nd very quickly, leaving less time for the engine to wind down. Of course for shifting down you still have to rev up.
k. Why is my HHR SS like this? Why can't it be like my Honda stick shift? :-)
This is because your HHR SS is a high performance racing inspired vehicle. For explanation please read the provided Wiki link. I have included below an important paragraph from the article which pertains to this topic:
Manual transmission - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Even though automobile and light truck transmissions are now almost universally synchronized, transmissions for heavy trucks <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truck> and machinery, motorcycles, and for dedicated racing <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_racing> are usually not. Non-synchronized transmission <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-synchronous_transmission> designs are used for several reasons. The friction material, such as brass <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass> , in synchronizers is more prone to wear and breakage than gears, which are forged steel, and the simplicity of the mechanism improves reliability and reduces cost. In addition, the process of shifting a synchromesh transmission is slower than that of shifting a non-synchromesh transmission. For racing of production-based transmissions, sometimes half the teeth (or dogs <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_(engineering)> ) on the synchros are removed to speed the shifting process, at the expense of greater wear."
Regards,
Chris
Please read the following carefully:.
1. The clunk noise you hear after you switch gears and engage at the new speed is 100% normal. Your dealer is right. It is not crappy chevy/saab/swedish design or quality. Nothing is broken.
2. High performance transmission/clutch all act the same way i.e. Ferraris, Porsche's etc.
3. After some time, I now drive my manual HHR/Cobalt SS mostly without hearing any clunk, whether I'm slowly accelerating or driving competitively.
I have posted a similar response to this 2 years ago on HHRSS forum site. The reason why you hear the clunk is because the speed of the engine is drastically different then the speed of the car's transaxle for the new gear you are engaging.
Depending on your style of driving, you will hear the clunk while switching from 1st-2nd or from 2nd to 3rd but not always for 3rd to 4th or 4th to 5th. Why? Because at higher speeds the engine is at lower RPM relative to the transaxle speed, therefore the speeds are somewhat similar. You release the clutch and there is no clunk.
How to avoid the clunk:
This may require you to learn a new method of driving manual.
Illl stick to hearing the noise . Thank u
lola. You take off on 1st gear
b. when its time to switch gears, release the clutch and change gears as usual.
c. now the trick is releasing the clutch to continue at 2nd gear
-while releasing the clutch do not wait for it to engage, instead start slowly pushing the gas pedal. This allows the speed of input shaft to match the speed of the engine at 2nd gear. Make sure the engine starts spinning again before or while you start re-engaging the cluth.
- the trick is figuring out where exactly does the clutch grip and when the speed has to be more or less matching with the input shaft. You will learn with experience.
d. the result: you will not hear a clunk.
e. The first time you try to do this you may rev your engine too high or not high enough. With time you will learn how much gas is needed. The clunk sound will tell you whether or not you are synchronized.
f. Repeat the same process for 2nd to 3rd.
g. For 4th and 5th gears you will notice that the manual synchronization you are having to perform is not so necessary at higher gears since the engine is at lower RPM at higher speeds.
h. When downshifting, the same rules apply otherwise you will hear the clunk at any gear you are shifting to, including 4th. When downshifting from 5th to 4th remember your engine will spin faster therefore you must rev the engine up before you engage 4th. Don't be surprised to hear the clunk at speeds of 80 mph or higher.
i. How long does it take to get used to this new method of shifting? It took me about 3 months and today I sometimes do cause the clunk. It drives me crazy just like most of you, but at least I know what I did wrong.
j. Is there anyway to minimize the clunk without having to manually synchronize? Possibly if you switch from 1st to 2nd very quickly, leaving less time for the engine to wind down. Of course for shifting down you still have to rev up.
k. Why is my HHR SS like this? Why can't it be like my Honda stick shift? :-)
This is because your HHR SS is a high performance racing inspired vehicle. For explanation please read the provided Wiki link. I have included below an important paragraph from the article which pertains to this topic:
Manual transmission - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Even though automobile and light truck transmissions are now almost universally synchronized, transmissions for heavy trucks <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truck> and machinery, motorcycles, and for dedicated racing <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_racing> are usually not. Non-synchronized transmission <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-synchronous_transmission> designs are used for several reasons. The friction material, such as brass <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass> , in synchronizers is more prone to wear and breakage than gears, which are forged steel, and the simplicity of the mechanism improves reliability and reduces cost. In addition, the process of shifting a synchromesh transmission is slower than that of shifting a non-synchromesh transmission. For racing of production-based transmissions, sometimes half the teeth (or dogs <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_(engineering)> ) on the synchros are removed to speed the shifting process, at the expense of greater wear."
Regards,
Chris
11-01-2012, 11:35 PM
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I rev first higher than the other gears. Usually around 3500 like stated above. I was getting pissed at myself because I have had the car for like a year and I still felt as though I hadn't gotten this transmission/clutch down yet. The information posted above makes sense to me because I've driven plenty of manuals and havewnt had any problems other than this car. I feel like rev matching is very important to be able to drive it smoothly
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