GM Stage 1 Hoax?
02-06-2009, 01:11 PM
#52
Senior Member
my stage 1 rocks
sorry you had such a bad experience w/ your stage 1 install....
I have stage 1 w/ all the other mods listed below.... I dyno'd on an uncalibrated Dyno (dynojet?) before the tune and pushed 225 HP to the wheels..... and my car was running very close to Stage 2 only cars then!!! that's why I think I was pushing more than 225 at the time. There was a a Stage 2 + at the dyno w/ me that day and I think he only put down 235-237 that day.
06 Black tuned my car and I can beat a Stage 2 only(no other mods) car as I sit. I think Stage 2 alone puts 240 to the wheels? So if I can beat a Stage 2 only car I am probably putting 245 to the wheels.... maybe I can get some $$$ to get her dyno'd by summer time
Oh, and w/ my tune.... I have a 7500 RPM redline
and she pulls up to my 7200 shift point w/ ease 
maybe they did not reflash your ECU or maybe it just the combination of mods that had installed.... or maybe the dyno is not calibrated correctly!! but my Stage 1 is fast!!
I have stage 1 w/ all the other mods listed below.... I dyno'd on an uncalibrated Dyno (dynojet?) before the tune and pushed 225 HP to the wheels..... and my car was running very close to Stage 2 only cars then!!! that's why I think I was pushing more than 225 at the time. There was a a Stage 2 + at the dyno w/ me that day and I think he only put down 235-237 that day.
06 Black tuned my car and I can beat a Stage 2 only(no other mods) car as I sit. I think Stage 2 alone puts 240 to the wheels? So if I can beat a Stage 2 only car I am probably putting 245 to the wheels.... maybe I can get some $$$ to get her dyno'd by summer time
Oh, and w/ my tune.... I have a 7500 RPM redline
and she pulls up to my 7200 shift point w/ ease maybe they did not reflash your ECU or maybe it just the combination of mods that had installed.... or maybe the dyno is not calibrated correctly!! but my Stage 1 is fast!!
02-06-2009, 01:12 PM
#53
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I bought stage 1 and there was a definite increase. I would see if they can reflash the stage tune then put a uncut airbox back on it if it doesn't change anything.
There are reason's to buy just stage 1.....I bought a used STG2 pulley , hub and belt , it saved me over a hundred bucks.
There are reason's to buy just stage 1.....I bought a used STG2 pulley , hub and belt , it saved me over a hundred bucks.
02-06-2009, 01:15 PM
#54
god damn there is so much fail in this thread...different days on the dyno will yield different numbers. does the car feel faster? i bet it does. sometimes the dyno is also set-up differently. i hate how everyone uses a dyno to nutswing, a dyno is a tuning tool...nothing more
02-06-2009, 01:15 PM
#55
[QUOTE=ebristol;3428140]I want one of these guys to go the dyno and spin their engines to 8k! Then they would make some SERIOUS hp!!!QUOTE]
? Why, the argument is that you can make peak hp at 7k rpms, I believe you can and I did. I dont however believe there is power to be had (with my mods) after 7k-7200, I'm right at my peak where I am right now.
Remain calm
? Why, the argument is that you can make peak hp at 7k rpms, I believe you can and I did. I dont however believe there is power to be had (with my mods) after 7k-7200, I'm right at my peak where I am right now.
Remain calm
Last edited by recklessactn; 02-06-2009 at 01:33 PM. Reason: Cant go to 72k rpms :-)
02-06-2009, 01:15 PM
#56
I bought stage 1 and there was a definite increase. I would see if they can reflash the stage tune then put a uncut airbox back on it if it doesn't change anything.
There are reason's to buy just stage 1.....I bought a used STG2 pulley , hub and belt , it saved me over a hundred bucks.
There are reason's to buy just stage 1.....I bought a used STG2 pulley , hub and belt , it saved me over a hundred bucks.
02-06-2009, 01:21 PM
#58
god damn there is so much fail in this thread...different days on the dyno will yield different numbers. does the car feel faster? i bet it does. sometimes the dyno is also set-up differently. i hate how everyone uses a dyno to nutswing, a dyno is a tuning tool...nothing more
I recongize i fail
02-06-2009, 01:25 PM
#59
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[QUOTE=ebristol;3428140]No **** it makes power. Do you think I was saying that after 6500 the car shuts off? 
It does not make peak power at 7k with the M62 and stock cams.
Thanks for the informative post. I needed someone with brains to help me out here! lol
I want one of these guys to go the dyno and spin their engines to 8k! Then they would make some SERIOUS hp!!!
you know as well as i do i can only try.. and 8K revlimit FTMFW!!!!!!!!
It does not make peak power at 7k with the M62 and stock cams.
Thanks for the informative post. I needed someone with brains to help me out here! lol
I want one of these guys to go the dyno and spin their engines to 8k! Then they would make some SERIOUS hp!!!
you know as well as i do i can only try.. and 8K revlimit FTMFW!!!!!!!!
02-06-2009, 01:34 PM
#62
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Unfortunately, GM likes to over glorify their stage kits. Im thinking that maybe there is something wrong. Not to burst ur bubble, but youll be hard pressed to see 30 whp gain from the stage 1 kit to begin with. GM over exxagerates these things for what reason? I dont have a clue.
I also have a feeling that a lot of people will be disappointed with their LNF stage 1 upgrades, and as a result will shift their money to the psychotune.
I also have a feeling that a lot of people will be disappointed with their LNF stage 1 upgrades, and as a result will shift their money to the psychotune.
02-06-2009, 01:36 PM
#63
Unfortunately, GM likes to over glorify their stage kits. Im thinking that maybe there is something wrong. Not to burst ur bubble, but youll be hard pressed to see 30 whp gain from the stage 1 kit to begin with. GM over exxagerates these things for what reason? I dont have a clue.
I also have a feeling that a lot of people will be disappointed with their LNF stage 1 upgrades, and as a result will shift their money to the psychotune.
I also have a feeling that a lot of people will be disappointed with their LNF stage 1 upgrades, and as a result will shift their money to the psychotune.
02-06-2009, 01:41 PM
#64
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02-06-2009, 01:53 PM
#65
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The fact that it only made 296 whp with IC piping and stage 1 will have peoples panties in a bunch.
And no, the Cobalt wont make more power than the Sol/Sky. It will make the same power as the HHR SS. Also, Crate engine depot has posted the following about the LNF stage 1 kit:
290HP @ 5,200 RPM
Solstice SKY torque ratings:
MT 340 lb,-ft of torque @ 3,600 RPM
AT 325 lb,-ft of torque @ 3,600 RPM
HHR torque ratings:
MT 315 lb,-ft of torque @ 4,800
AT 315 lb,-ft of torque @ 4,800
02-06-2009, 02:28 PM
#67
the thing is though everyone on here thinks theyre going to make over 300 whp with stage 1. The stage kit has been hyped up as much.
The fact that it only made 296 whp with IC piping and stage 1 will have peoples panties in a bunch.
And no, the Cobalt wont make more power than the Sol/Sky. It will make the same power as the HHR SS. Also, Crate engine depot has posted the following about the LNF stage 1 kit:
290HP @ 5,200 RPM
Solstice SKY torque ratings:
MT 340 lb,-ft of torque @ 3,600 RPM
AT 325 lb,-ft of torque @ 3,600 RPM
HHR torque ratings:
MT 315 lb,-ft of torque @ 4,800
AT 315 lb,-ft of torque @ 4,800
The fact that it only made 296 whp with IC piping and stage 1 will have peoples panties in a bunch.
And no, the Cobalt wont make more power than the Sol/Sky. It will make the same power as the HHR SS. Also, Crate engine depot has posted the following about the LNF stage 1 kit:
290HP @ 5,200 RPM
Solstice SKY torque ratings:
MT 340 lb,-ft of torque @ 3,600 RPM
AT 325 lb,-ft of torque @ 3,600 RPM
HHR torque ratings:
MT 315 lb,-ft of torque @ 4,800
AT 315 lb,-ft of torque @ 4,800
02-06-2009, 02:54 PM
#68
Senior Member
not yet... this year hopefully.... I run her up near my 7500 redline, smooth and pull nicely!
if you are coming to the next midwest meet I'll take you for a ride and you can judge for yourself how she runs.... and maybe we can line me up against a stage 2 car!!!
Bryan has a great tune on her
if you are coming to the next midwest meet I'll take you for a ride and you can judge for yourself how she runs.... and maybe we can line me up against a stage 2 car!!!
Bryan has a great tune on her
02-06-2009, 02:58 PM
#69
not yet... this year hopefully.... I run her up near my 7500 redline, smooth and pull nicely!
if you are coming to the next midwest meet I'll take you for a ride and you can judge for yourself how she runs.... and maybe we can line me up against a stage 2 car!!!
Bryan has a great tune on her
if you are coming to the next midwest meet I'll take you for a ride and you can judge for yourself how she runs.... and maybe we can line me up against a stage 2 car!!!
Bryan has a great tune on her
02-06-2009, 03:06 PM
#71
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where did u read this? Theyre all the same HP, regardless of car. The only differences is TQ. Look here:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P2292C179.aspx
why would they make JUST the SS/TC higher in hp? Makes no sense.
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P2292C179.aspx
why would they make JUST the SS/TC higher in hp? Makes no sense.
02-06-2009, 03:18 PM
#72
Member
Thread Starter
In the video it is obvious that the car is hitting the rev-limiter after every pull, which means that he did not shift early.
Does anyone besides me have before and after dyno pulls for GM stage 1? The only other dyno graphs I have seen to compare the two was GM's graphs. I have 3 axis accelerometer data that I can post to show how it "felt" to drive the stock Cobalt, and how it feels to drive the Stage 1. The peak and steady-state g-forces are almost exactly the same between stage 1 and stock. It is just that the stage 1 keeps near-max hp to about 6700 rpm and then it falls off as you hit the rev-limiter. My 1/4 mile times are faster with stage 1 than stock, but only slightly faster (about 0.2 seconds faster).
Does anyone besides me have before and after dyno pulls for GM stage 1? The only other dyno graphs I have seen to compare the two was GM's graphs. I have 3 axis accelerometer data that I can post to show how it "felt" to drive the stock Cobalt, and how it feels to drive the Stage 1. The peak and steady-state g-forces are almost exactly the same between stage 1 and stock. It is just that the stage 1 keeps near-max hp to about 6700 rpm and then it falls off as you hit the rev-limiter. My 1/4 mile times are faster with stage 1 than stock, but only slightly faster (about 0.2 seconds faster).
02-06-2009, 03:55 PM
#73
Senior Member
In the video it is obvious that the car is hitting the rev-limiter after every pull, which means that he did not shift early.
Does anyone besides me have before and after dyno pulls for GM stage 1? The only other dyno graphs I have seen to compare the two was GM's graphs. I have 3 axis accelerometer data that I can post to show how it "felt" to drive the stock Cobalt, and how it feels to drive the Stage 1. The peak and steady-state g-forces are almost exactly the same between stage 1 and stock. It is just that the stage 1 keeps near-max hp to about 6700 rpm and then it falls off as you hit the rev-limiter. My 1/4 mile times are faster with stage 1 than stock, but only slightly faster (about 0.2 seconds faster).
Does anyone besides me have before and after dyno pulls for GM stage 1? The only other dyno graphs I have seen to compare the two was GM's graphs. I have 3 axis accelerometer data that I can post to show how it "felt" to drive the stock Cobalt, and how it feels to drive the Stage 1. The peak and steady-state g-forces are almost exactly the same between stage 1 and stock. It is just that the stage 1 keeps near-max hp to about 6700 rpm and then it falls off as you hit the rev-limiter. My 1/4 mile times are faster with stage 1 than stock, but only slightly faster (about 0.2 seconds faster).
02-06-2009, 04:36 PM
#74
Member
Thread Starter
Does anyone think that a reason for my power not increasing more towards redline with GM Stage 1 is because of the restrictive stock exhaust manifold? In other words, if I installed a header, would the power keep increasing toward redline at 7,000 rpm instead of hitting a plateau near 6,700 rpm?
02-06-2009, 04:49 PM
#75
Senior Member
I am excited to see your dyno graphs. Thanks.
Does anyone think that a reason for my power not increasing more towards redline with GM Stage 1 is because of the restrictive stock exhaust manifold? In other words, if I installed a header, would the power keep increasing toward redline at 7,000 rpm instead of hitting a plateau near 6,700 rpm?
Does anyone think that a reason for my power not increasing more towards redline with GM Stage 1 is because of the restrictive stock exhaust manifold? In other words, if I installed a header, would the power keep increasing toward redline at 7,000 rpm instead of hitting a plateau near 6,700 rpm?
those items allow the stage 1 package to breathe.... the results will be much better!
much more important is the tune..... get a custom tune and maybe the tuner can help you keep making power to 7K..... making power all the way to 7K is not as important to me as the way the car runs.... I run beyond 7K and it pulls hard all the way.... I know the tune has made a HUGE difference!
your question is more aimed at a pro tuner than me.... we got some great tuners on here,
contact one of them.... they know what is truly possible