2.0L LSJ Performance Tech 205hp Supercharged SS tuner version. 200 lb-ft of torque.

The truth about the twinscrew swap

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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 03:00 PM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by lsjwannabe
will our stock cams make power to 7k
My car still makes power to 7K as most cars here do.

Jmc007, I'm not saying that run would have hit 350whp as the projection I made clearly doesn't shove the number up that high. I will go ahead and state that it would have hit the 300whp mark however, and I have already stated I think I'll be around 330-340whp on the Mustang Dyno as well.

I guess I'll be able to let you know either way in a real short amount of time though!
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 03:08 PM
  #102  
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from the dyno's i have seen power usually drops off around 6500 rpms.
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 03:28 PM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by lsjwannabe
from the dyno's i have seen power usually drops off around 6500 rpms.
Looking at my last dyno, you are correct with this statement. I apologize. I feel though that it has more to do with the M62 running out of huff than anything else. Like I said I'll know soon enough, and will post all my results for everyones viewing pleasure or put downs. Till then everybody relax and have an ice cold brew, it's Friday!

Originally Posted by Jmc007
Man no offense but this projected graph is nothing but an error ... You'll never see 350whp coming out from the stock head, unless it will be a very unefficient setup, like a HUGE turbo or a serious shot of nitrous. Exhaust ports and cam lift dimension are the bottleneck.

Also, a Mustang dyno is usually 9-10% lower than a Dynojet, so please forget definitly about 350whp on a Mustang Dyno. Think about 275-300whp on a Mustang dyno with all bolt-ons, thus with a very good setup.
Just for your information the turbo car that is in Canada made 403whp on a stock head and bottom end at 22psi with a GT2871R.

Last edited by 2K5SS/SC?; Aug 3, 2007 at 03:28 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 03:37 PM
  #104  
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keeping an eye on this thread*
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 03:44 PM
  #105  
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Originally Posted by SSKobald
keeping an eye on this thread*
Same here.
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 04:17 PM
  #106  
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hmm..

well the TVS units spin 20k continous...
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 04:30 PM
  #107  
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Originally Posted by Witt
Its alright. The lsa imo is fine. DSMs would suffer from exhaust reversion long before I would ever see a boost bleed effect due to overlap.

I only hope its on video, kinda like those guys blowing up plastic intake manifolds.
Plus we don't have EGRs and rely on slight exhaust gas reversion for cooling cylinder temps; of course that's not a concern to someone going for power but it would be an effect of using such a cam.
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 04:38 PM
  #108  
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Originally Posted by boooobOOO
If you guys want real power get a v8 swap. Why waste your money on a 4 banger
if your offering ideas like that your in the wrong thread / wrong forums
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 04:39 PM
  #109  
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booooooobooo is probably wasey or awd haha

i'm intrigued to see what this and a TVS swap would do, more options for you guys the better hell the 2.4's have more options then you guys right now haha

cant wait to see numbers on any and everything
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 04:46 PM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by boooobOOO
If you guys want real power get a v8 swap. Why waste your money on a 4 banger
well isn't that special.
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 04:50 PM
  #111  
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silly question, i was looking at the 2 dimensioning drawings for the 1200ax and 1600ax blowers and from what i can see the outlet on the blowers is very similar, the only major difference is the inlet side.

whats the feasability of upgrading from the 1200 to the 1600?
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 05:07 PM
  #112  
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well you figure if this setup puts down 330whp, thats pretty much just like an LS2 anyway not to mention if you swapped one in and made the car RWD with all the weight your adding you would need an LS7 to offset the weight

LS7 = 14k
Twin Screw = 3k

Eco>v8
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 05:12 PM
  #113  
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Originally Posted by Rodimus_Prime
well you figure if this setup puts down 330whp, thats pretty much just like an LS2 anyway not to mention if you swapped one in and made the car RWD with all the weight your adding you would need an LS7 to offset the weight

LS7 = 14k
Twin Screw = 3k

Eco>v8
LAWL on the ricerness of that statement but.. it's sooo true.. haha

it's mostly personal taste though
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 05:12 PM
  #114  
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Originally Posted by 2K5SS/SC?
Let's take a look at the dyno Rebel did already with a little projection I laid over it. I hope we can all at least agree they weren't tuned all the way yet, and that the blower will make power all the way to redline by looking at the graph in comparison to everyone else dynos on here.

Now here is what I came up with. Looking at this as a fair projection of how the dyno would have ended the car would have clearly made at least 300whp. Take my mods and add some timing and I think 350whp is very do-able.



You'll NEVER make 350 to the wheels on the stock head. Not a chance in hell.
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 05:21 PM
  #115  
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agreed ^^^^
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 05:36 PM
  #116  
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Originally Posted by 2K5SS/SC?
Looking at my last dyno, you are correct with this statement. I apologize. I feel though that it has more to do with the M62 running out of huff than anything else. Like I said I'll know soon enough, and will post all my results for everyones viewing pleasure or put downs. Till then everybody relax and have an ice cold brew, it's Friday!



Just for your information the turbo car that is in Canada made 403whp on a stock head and bottom end at 22psi with a GT2871R.
403whp is maybe true (in fact it's very possible at 22 PSI on a turbo), but nonetheless there is a LOT of loss caused by the stock head. But if it would have been me putting down those kind of numbers, let me say that I would have post several dyno charts everywhere over the forums. It's simply weird hearing people saying : "One guy know a guy who know a guy who puts 350 or 400 whp, but we never see the dyno charts ...". Again I trust it, but these guys should be more enthusiast and post their charts !
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 05:39 PM
  #117  
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im just wondering why every one of thse threads turns into a turbo vs supercharger thread? Why not just let those who want to supercharge try and figure this out without entertaining the turbo vs sc argument all the time?
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 05:42 PM
  #118  
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Originally Posted by Jmc007
403whp is maybe true (in fact it's very possible at 22 PSI on a turbo), but nonetheless there is a LOT of loss caused by the stock head. But if it would have been me putting down those kind of numbers, let me say that I would have post several dyno charts everywhere over the forums. It's simply weird hearing people saying : "One guy know a guy who know a guy who puts 350 or 400 whp, but we never see the dyno charts ...". Again I trust it, but these guys should be more enthusiast and post their charts !
I do agree about all the hear-say but no offense man there's a world out side of ss.net and ALOTA ppl dont understand this. So just because u dont see dyno sheets on here doesnt mean they dont exist.

2K5SS/SC? - show these biatches what's up.

I must admit i was intially disappointed with the numbers of the twinscrew but looking at the specs of the 1200AX and considering this was the FIRST tuning session, 280whp is pretty good on a STOCK SS/SC.
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 07:27 PM
  #119  
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Originally Posted by 2K5SS/SC?
My car still makes power to 7K as most cars here do.

Jmc007, I'm not saying that run would have hit 350whp as the projection I made clearly doesn't shove the number up that high. I will go ahead and state that it would have hit the 300whp mark however, and I have already stated I think I'll be around 330-340whp on the Mustang Dyno as well.

I guess I'll be able to let you know either way in a real short amount of time though!

Cant' wait to see the numbers you put down...lucky man to get the first one!

I will follow behind patiently...hopefully the ported head gains me a little extra.
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 11:16 PM
  #120  
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As for the whole Mustang Dyno vs. DynoJet deal: Mustang Dynos average 10% lower on N/A vehicles. On a DynoJet, a F/I car isn't allowed to build full boost and maintain that boost throughout the whole power curve. My personal numbers are from a Mustang Dyno in San Antonio. I put down 227 whp stock. Thus, I'd love to see what the TS puts down on a Mustang Dyno compared to the DynoJet.
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 11:19 PM
  #121  
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ok heres a thought though , would a company start a project with only the hope that there a stupid people (or ignorant) that would just buy the ts because they want a ts
i doubt this rebel has done their homework i imagine and ts is worth ir b/c it cost them more than 3k to make the kit
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Old Aug 3, 2007 | 11:54 PM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by RG4
He had acces to them b/c he was had made both of these car . 2 he does do the tuning for these cars . rebel is 2 guys doing work on are cars . i have know these guys for long time now, and i complete trust these guys , there are not here to screw u guys , they just want theses cars to go fast and be safe .

yea car makes power to 7 grand with TS
QUOTE=2K5SS/SC?;1291150]This my friend is the gentleman that helped fabricate and tune both of Rebel's twinscrew and turbo cars. He is quite knowledgeable since I've been in contact with him, and I certainly do not doubt his word for one moment. How do I know this, I know only because I'm awaiting the twinscrew to reach my doorstep since I've been in on this project since December. [/QUOTE]



hey hey hey, never did i say rebel was out to screw anyonea. you post and that you say you have had money in it since december, when rebels site went up 4 or 5 months ago? Guess you misunderstood my post. as i understood it, the 403 hp turbo swap spoken above was done at tag. i would love to have this verified. and you say it was a fabricator/tuner, would this be the very same one selling parts while working elsewhere in the same industry? I just want to know whod i'd be dealing with over there. pm me a screen name here then, that would be fine.
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 12:29 AM
  #123  
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Originally Posted by firestorm
QUOTE=2K5SS/SC?;1291150]This my friend is the gentleman that helped fabricate and tune both of Rebel's twinscrew and turbo cars. He is quite knowledgeable since I've been in contact with him, and I certainly do not doubt his word for one moment. How do I know this, I know only because I'm awaiting the twinscrew to reach my doorstep since I've been in on this project since December.


hey hey hey, never did i say rebel was out to screw anyonea. you post and that you say you have had money in it since december, when rebels site went up 4 or 5 months ago? Guess you misunderstood my post. as i understood it, the 403 hp turbo swap spoken above was done at tag. i would love to have this verified. and you say it was a fabricator/tuner, would this be the very same one selling parts while working elsewhere in the same industry? I just want to know whod i'd be dealing with over there. pm me a screen name here then, that would be fine.[/QUOTE]

I wasn't trying to be mean in the post, just informative. Sorry if I came off that way, but it seems lately I'm always trying to defend myself here. If you do some video searching on youtube.com with Rebel Auto Worx, there is some informative stuff in their videos. The thing I noticed most is that the Rebel kit uses the same turbo, and the piping on TAG's final kit looks damn near identical to Rebel's. Not to mention Mase stopped working with TAG after some bad blood, and went to seek Rebel's help to finish the kit. I'll send you a PM with what I think really happened behind the scenes.

BoominIt, I can't wait to get that kit as I'm sure you're excited as well. The only reason why I'll be getting mine first is to finish up the testing, and put down some hard numbers for them. Otherwise I would of had to wait just a bit longer.

P7X, I'll do my best to squeeze every ounce of power I can SAFELY from this thing!
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 12:45 AM
  #124  
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Originally Posted by lsjwannabe
First i would like to say i am in no way intending this to be negative i am just stating some facts that i think everyone should know before they do something stupid to there car. When you look at what they have done it is pretty impressive 280whp at 5800 rpms and only 20* change in iat2 temps seems good but what we don't know is how fast that blower is going to spin so i have taken the trouble of showing you how fast you will spin the blower with all the different size pullies assuming you run a 7k redline.

2.9 ( the one they dyno'd with) 15,086 rpms

2.8 15,625 rpms

2.7 16,203 rpms

2.6 16,826 rpms

2.5 17,500 rpms (i believe they said that is the smallest they would run)

This blower is rated by lysholm at 14,000 continuous rpms and 15,000 max so it is already at its peak on the 2.9. With the increased rpm's comes more heat so i bet you would have seen a little more change in temp if they would have ran it to 7k nothing huge though.
Also when you are running a twinscrew above its rated rpms the blower is likely to sieze because of the tight clearence between the rotors.








In the end it is up to you i just would not want to ruin a perfectly good blower running it to hard
This post right here is basically saying EXACTLY what I've been saying since the first time someone mentioned using a 1200AX. It spins too slow to make any kind of REAL power. Thats why I've always been saying the W75AX (although they no longer make it) is a far better choice because of its 20,000 rpm limit. Think about this, 20,000 rpm = 2.5" pulley with 8000 rpm rev limit!!!
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 12:54 AM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by 2K5SS/SC?
BoominIt, I can't wait to get that kit as I'm sure you're excited as well. The only reason why I'll be getting mine first is to finish up the testing, and put down some hard numbers for them. Otherwise I would of had to wait just a bit longer.

P7X, I'll do my best to squeeze every ounce of power I can SAFELY from this thing!
I talked to Mase earlier he told me the scoop. I will wait the additional week to get mine powder coated black.
When is your dyno going to happen?
Make sure you get a vid as well!
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