The truth about the twinscrew swap
Senior Member
Joined: 02-15-07
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 0
From: Woodbridge, VA
yea. ive given up i think, unless something miraculous happens.
So that means... TS prolly out, I dont want to go through the hassle of the procharger, I don't want to go turbo; I guess TVS is the only option left. I hope they dont **** me over too!
So that means... TS prolly out, I dont want to go through the hassle of the procharger, I don't want to go turbo; I guess TVS is the only option left. I hope they dont **** me over too!
Senior Member
Joined: 02-05-06
Posts: 727
Likes: 0
From: Kakabeka Falls, Ontario
you dont seem to understand. No one is arguing that the twinscrew or the procharger can push out more CFM with less heat and power draw. What you dont understand is that not matter how much air you force at the engine, its still only going to be able to take in so much air at a time.
PSI is a measure of resistence, its the resistence of air to get into the engine. 10 PSI on a 2.0 ecotec is a different CFM of air than 10 PSI on a 2.2L ecotec. PSI is what causes heat in the superchargers. Heat causes a wall, heat causes loss of HP, heat causes blown engines.
But if you have one LSJ with a procharger, and one LSJ with a twinscrew, and one LSJ with an eaton, all 3 engines are reading 10 PSI, all 3 engines will be taking in the exact same amount of air. While someone engines will produce more HP than others, due to the amount of heat produced and the power draw or efficiency of the blower.
PSI is not a measure of HP potential, CFM is, but its main concern is how much CFM the engine can take in. Lets say you have 2 LSJ motors with M62 blowers. One engine is entirely stock, its make 12.5 PSI. Its making 205WHP. The other engine has a stock pulley, full exhaust, heavily modified head, oversized valves, and a free flowing intake. The second engineis only making 10 PSI, because the free flowing engine is able to take in more air per revolution than the stock one due to the flowing head. Now lets say this modified engine is making 240WHP at 10psi. Now why is it making more HP? Its using the same blower, same amount of CFM. But what has changed is the engine. Its now more efficient. Less heat is produced when compressing the air. The air moves more easily through the engine.
This is the same effect the TVS will have. Less heat is being produced along with less power draw. Thats the only thing increasing HP. The CFM is not creating anymore HP at the same PSI of the m62. So when/if the TVS comes out and makes 22 PSI if you have an m62 making 22 PSI, both blowers will be moving the exact same CFM of air. The only difference is the TVS will take 30-40 less HP to move the same amount of air.
Do you now understand why it doesnt matter what type of FI your using. There will still always be the limits of the stock head as a major wall? And that just because one FI type moves more CFM doesnt mean the engine can ingest the extra CFM?
PSI is a measure of resistence, its the resistence of air to get into the engine. 10 PSI on a 2.0 ecotec is a different CFM of air than 10 PSI on a 2.2L ecotec. PSI is what causes heat in the superchargers. Heat causes a wall, heat causes loss of HP, heat causes blown engines.
But if you have one LSJ with a procharger, and one LSJ with a twinscrew, and one LSJ with an eaton, all 3 engines are reading 10 PSI, all 3 engines will be taking in the exact same amount of air. While someone engines will produce more HP than others, due to the amount of heat produced and the power draw or efficiency of the blower.
PSI is not a measure of HP potential, CFM is, but its main concern is how much CFM the engine can take in. Lets say you have 2 LSJ motors with M62 blowers. One engine is entirely stock, its make 12.5 PSI. Its making 205WHP. The other engine has a stock pulley, full exhaust, heavily modified head, oversized valves, and a free flowing intake. The second engineis only making 10 PSI, because the free flowing engine is able to take in more air per revolution than the stock one due to the flowing head. Now lets say this modified engine is making 240WHP at 10psi. Now why is it making more HP? Its using the same blower, same amount of CFM. But what has changed is the engine. Its now more efficient. Less heat is produced when compressing the air. The air moves more easily through the engine.
This is the same effect the TVS will have. Less heat is being produced along with less power draw. Thats the only thing increasing HP. The CFM is not creating anymore HP at the same PSI of the m62. So when/if the TVS comes out and makes 22 PSI if you have an m62 making 22 PSI, both blowers will be moving the exact same CFM of air. The only difference is the TVS will take 30-40 less HP to move the same amount of air.
Do you now understand why it doesnt matter what type of FI your using. There will still always be the limits of the stock head as a major wall? And that just because one FI type moves more CFM doesnt mean the engine can ingest the extra CFM?
If you do not take into account the output temperature of the blower / turbo / centri at every PSI level, engine RPM, etc, etc. (It can get really complicated really fast!), talking about CFM's between different setups is almost pointless.
Member
Joined: 07-24-05
Posts: 387
Likes: 0
From: new orleans
Customer service is not up to standard with this company.
They make false claims and have crappy machine work.
Most likely expect the unexperienced supposed engineer to take another month or two to fix the snout leak that should have been machined right from the begining.
Overall its been a year now with no working product and no refund. From my experience with this company they are not professional nor practice standard business policies.
They make false claims and have crappy machine work.
Most likely expect the unexperienced supposed engineer to take another month or two to fix the snout leak that should have been machined right from the begining.
Overall its been a year now with no working product and no refund. From my experience with this company they are not professional nor practice standard business policies.
Last edited by BoomInIt; Jan 19, 2008 at 04:20 PM. Reason: .
Senior Member
Joined: 07-08-05
Posts: 6,200
Likes: 0
From: Niceville, FL
BoomInIt, I've been waiting longer than you have and I'm still being fairly patient on this matter. I've been in contact with Mase and he's actively working it. He's working with PSE Superchargers right now to get it right. He is was awaiting a new snout kit oiling setup right now to arrive. This should solve the issue we were having. They are very contactable and will call you back within minutes if you call them. So far there have been no false claims made, and from having the kit on my car the machining is actually pretty damn good.
I understand that you're upset as I was for awhile too. This setup isn't nearly as easy as making a turbo kit, so it requires more time to make sure it's right. If you want to discuss it some more just PM me bro.
I understand that you're upset as I was for awhile too. This setup isn't nearly as easy as making a turbo kit, so it requires more time to make sure it's right. If you want to discuss it some more just PM me bro.
Senior Member
Joined: 10-12-06
Posts: 3,089
Likes: 0
From: Saskatchewan
Maybe it's been mentioned already, but this point is moot, as they use the smallest pulley they think should run on the twin screw right now. This isn't meant to be a swap where you need to get a smaller pulley later to get the full effect. So, by design, the 2.9 is as small as you should go (so it's as small as they did go).
So - it's not stupid to get this kit. It's stupid to but a smaller pulley on it than the one they provide.
So - it's not stupid to get this kit. It's stupid to but a smaller pulley on it than the one they provide.
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