To the op here is some valuable insight.

My setup was pretty close to yours 2.5" vs 2.6" cti vs cia

On the dyno i was on i made 253 whp on the m62 with a 12.3 afr and 23* timing max. The car trapped 108~110 at the track all summer long.

On the same dyno i made 313 whp with the tvs with a 2.75" on a 11.0 afr and 16* timing on 93 pump gas with no meth. The car trapped 113+ all summer long even with problems with shifting gears at high rpms.

The car made 336 whp on meth with a 12.3 afr and 23* timing. Never tracked it at this point

The car had a 2.5" ring put on it and timing had to be pulled because of spark blowout under heavy load (top of 3rd gear). To run the car effectively it had to use race gas, 110 in my experience.

My trans gave up but not becuase of the tvs, i had a early verison of the driveshaft shop stage 2 axles and cv grease leaked into my trans and caused it to bite the dust.

The motor was 100% stock internals and all.

I hope this offers you good insight for what you can expect from going from your setup to a tvs

 

Zoomer...you really gotta cut it out... All your posts start this crap. Matt. M's posts are fine, as is your other co worker (i believe he said he makes the HE's) who posts here, but all your posts start fights...and its not the audience...i kinda defended you for a wile, because at first it was just the OTTP nutswingers....but your just too much dude. Im gonna keep buying from ZZP, dont get me wrong, but man....have your co workers post for you from now on

 

ATleast its the owner digging the grave for himself .

 

I believe my posts start debates because I have a strong personality, strong opinion and some people here are heavily biased against me. I refuse to sell parts that I don't believe work and I speak my mind which offends people who want to believe something does what it doesn't. People believe that every time I post "you don't need that" or "this will dyno XXX" people think I'm pushing my parts. I'm not. I never recommended or even implied a single time in this thread that the user should buy a twin charged kit. I haven't put any other members down in the way people do to me every time I post. I never post "owned" "wasted" "in your face" "loser" or anything childish that i see posted here constantly, yet I'm consistently flamed for being "unprofessional".

You also have to understand that this is my personality. It's who I am. I listen to others when they speak like an adult and want to have a rational conversation. I correct consumers when they post in error. This style of mine hasn't changed in 9 years of business. I post the same and I heard the same things like "digging your own grave" or "killing his business" etc for years. Yet every year we grow larger (having started ZZP with 1 product) and even in this struggling economy we're releasing new products (6 new products on the front page for Cobalt this month), investing in R&D and revenues are increasing. I believe it's because many people trust ZZP and know that we are ultimately out to help them as a consumer. Eventually people will see that ZZP is doing unique things and serving the customer base very well, dynos and track times will no longer be doubted, attitudes on the forum will change and sales will continue to increase. Every year we do better and anyone who believes they can run a better company should give it a go or send me a PM with a business plan because I'd love to hear it

 

I'm not even arguing one way or the other - I'm just saying that you've shot your credibility so badly with random arguments like this I'm not sure why you're still talking.

Keep in mind the average of those 10 people were delivered in something like 30 days of receipt - not many recreational tuners can just hunker down and crank out the most efficient tune in that amount of time. Those were just "I got it running" numbers.

I'm still of the mind that most TVS owners will not see more than 310 WHP without meth, porting, or professional tuning, but that's just a theory. (keep in mind most of the TVS owners are people who just bought through the GB and have no experience tuning at all)

Ever talk to Josh at OTTP before? How about Aaron at TTR? Vince from Trifecta / Dan from Clear Image?

These are just three of your competitors who are just as successful (if not moreso) and are viewed in a much more positive light. While they may not be out to "educate" people as you claim to be, you have to realize that your personality is pretty abrasive, and that turns people off pretty quickly - especially when people have options to turn to (such as the above).

 

He's right about one thing though. He does provide his opinion..., even when it's not necessary. You are the only one who provided someone with a twincharging kit, and that idea quickly went to the graveyard. I always wondered why that is? Why abandon something you see having so much potential to you? You as well as I know that the turbo has more potential, yet you continue to beat that point into the ground. A simple point of reading the content in the thread would stop you from being challenged in the way you seem to like so much.

And until I can get back to my car and finish things, how am I going to know what the car does? I said many times that I am deployed and still won't be back for some months. Attention to detail friend. Research gets better, and the community is better informed. End of story.

 

We haven't abandoned the twin charged kit at all. It's done. Our fastest build and I'm guessing the fastest car on CSS.net will be running our twin charged. We have been working lately on 2.4 liter turbo kits and intercooler options, a supercharger kit for the 2.4, and another 2.0 turbo option that doesn't use the blower. Then we're doing the same stuff for the Ion. Takes a long time to do all the dyno testing, fixture building, wriiting files for each injector size and MAF option, ect. Our dyno runs nearly non stop on R&D projects and only comes off a couple times a day for customer cars.

We have people that will be running ZZP builds on the track and dynos. We expect to quickly take every HP record, and every track record for NA, supercharged, turbo, 2.0 LSJ, 2.0 LNF, 2.4L. We'll be doing a lot all while we're building mods for the Grand Prix, LS1s and closing out our GA and G6 programs. It's a lot of work for only ~20 people...

 

OK Ill take that bet..... Your not the only ones with a trick up your sleeve. What do ya say first one to a time slip proven 11 wins?

 

I dyoned twice within 2 months and that was still on the wrong pulley size and a tune that was done on the drive there, so needless to say they were far from perfect. Also those dynos were on a mustang dyno so they typically read what 18% lower than dynojet? So that puts me at what 332whp? If you want to compare apples to apples.

SO your saying that ZZP doesn't sell the TVS because it doesnt work? I don't think your serving your customer base that well through making opinions that not only make you look stupid but can be proven stupid also. My opinion of ZZP went down enough after I purchased its poorly welded, poorly fitting 3 inch exhaust. I'd love to see your supposed supercharged build that beats the rest of us on TVS blowers.

 

they are going to copy the twinscrew blower . quote that.

 

i personally feel that ZZP shouldn't be commenting in this thread. this thread is about the TVS, which ZZP doesn't sell and from what i understand.... THEY HAVE NO EXPERIENCE WITH IT! the OP is wanting more information about the TVS, not turbo, not twincharge..... so ZZP stay out of it! from what i've read it seems that ZZP is sidebusting a possible sale of the TVS, isn't that not allowed on here?

 

I think we can all say the biggier turbos out perform the TVS but it really comes down to what your goals are and what your money situation is. Plus not everybody want to join the turbo cars like all the other people want to do something different. For me the TVS would put me where I want to be as far a power and it is relativly cheap than going turbo for same gains. We need not bash our fellow members that isn't what this forum is about.

 

highest supercharged eh?

 

i can hear Area cracking his knuckles all the way from here....

 

more informative **** less bullshit pl0x.
getting tired of evrytime i see tvs discussions
that it digress from the topic.

less opinions more facts. ty

 

everyone with a TVS should show Zoomer there dyno numbers to show him how good the TVS is. It is good, reliable performance, and u still get whine.

 

So who does have experience with it? Who is allowed to post in this thread? Would it be you, someone who doesn't have a TVS? Or just people who have them? Would it be the people dyno'ing less than 300 who say it's really over 300 because their car wasn't tuned, or they didn't push it, or they didn't have on the right pulley, or they ran race gas, or something was wrong with their car and they will dyno more later? Are those the guys that should post?

ALL I AM SAYING is that any customer should expect to achieve similar results to other people running the same part. Not the standout lowest dyno, not the highest number, but around what MOST people are achieving. Do I need special qualifications to make this statement? Do I need to be a doctor to say that living to 120 years old isn't realistic? Do I need to be a pilot to say that flying to the moon in an airplane isn't realistic? WTF do I need qualifications to post in this thread for? All I'm telling a guy is what the forum ALREADY says. Go the dyno or horsepower threads and you'll see that TVS guys are not dynoing 350WHP. Why in the hell would my statement be a bash or get flamed? It's just a fact about what the boards already say.
The guys disagreeing with me actually proved my point correct because they have a TVS and dyno'd below 300 and are trying to say that they don't count. So what does this mean? You're allowed to post in this thread only if you have a TVS but you get to dismiss the results of your car and talk about hypothetical numbers? Be real guys and give this guy some useful information. That's all I'm doing, try it.
sure it'll be fun. I love the challege and anticipation of competition on the forums. Probably my favorite part of the scene.
Stop putting words in my mouth and paper racing your car. I NEVER said the TVS doesn't work or that is sucks. My only comment was that it is not a good choice for someone wanting 350WHP+. Your post confirms that as you're talking about tunes on the way to the dyno, mustang dynos at 18% (never heard that before, why not make it 30% and top 350WHP?), having the wrong pulley size, etc. That's all you hear from 90% of TVS guys. Look man, you're blower makes more power than an M62, it's a great product if your goal is making a little more power, I'm not denying any of that. But don't spam the boards with this continuous box of excuses spanning over a year as to why every TVS guy, save about 2 are not dynoing high.

I never claimed ZZP wouldn't run a TVS. We will. We're going to dyno test the TVS vs. turbo vs. M62 vs. twin screw and report how they compare at the same boost level and how much boost you can run w/o KR, efficiency, etc. All to give you guys accurate information with no financial benefit; all the while being bashed.

In terms of racing we'll be on an M62. Not only will we run track times faster than TVS guys but it will be easy. Deja vue from the 3800 market. Although using an M62 against TVS guys would be really tough and pose a serious handicap. Maybe I should rethink that...hmmm....guess time will tell
I couldn't possibly begin to save all the names and quotes of the people on this forum that will be eating their words and backpeddling on statements.
we'll never be able to compete with area unless it's at the same dyno, same time. Otherwise he'll say that he only releases street numbers or claim we have a happy dyno, etc. Generally when ZZP does stuff like this we dyno here at our dyno, report the numbers, then get called liars and told our dyno reads high, then we either go dyno at another shop or if people are serious doubters we drive to a mod/dyno day somewhere and don't say anything til we make the pull. After we dyno a few times and run at the track, people stop doubting. What we won't do is make a laundry list of excuses for not hitting a certain dyno number. We won't paper race our cars and brag about numbers that are not yet done on an actual dyno.
Why me? I think everyone here likes to see dyno numbers.
Although you may want to reconsider your statement since it's already been done and proves my point:
https://www.cobaltss.net/forums/show...light=official

It is good, reliable performance but it is not a 350WHP product.

 

For that money you could go for Turbo and get 360+. Not saying one or the other is better just another option.

 

You power hungry tuners are all a bunch of silly bitches. It doesn't matter what the topic actually is, if someone mentions WHP, this **** gets out of hand. Between the paper racers, dyno queens, and track ******, everyones saying something different it seems.

If all the bitching would just stop until summer when ALL the different set ups can get to the track, threads would be a hell of a lot less cluttered with bullshit and e-peen stroking. The only set up that's been proven time and time again is the turbo and m62. We all know the limits of both, however, the TVS and twincharge crowds are still growing. (sadly, the twin-charge has a total of two cars... Zooomer, release the kit for self installs already.) No one gives a damn about the twinscrew anymore, lets face it.

No on knows how much the TVS can put out to it's maximum, because it hasn't been pushed on a built engine yet and raced back to back. Same with the twin-charge. All we've seen are dyno sheets. Hell, I can mimick that in photoshop if I wanted too.(not saying they're not real...) Until it gets back to track season, no one is going to ever agree with each other.

Oh, and Zooomer, if you're going to provide dyno sheets, take each set-up to the track as well. THEN we can see what set up is the best for "350WHP+" applications. If you're going to **** away the money, do it right.

 

I believe Witt has a TVS on his built engine. I think he sold his car and got a Mustang. I dunno if it ever dyno'd.

IMO the Dyno is the best tool for judging power. Track times have to many variables to use as a consistent judge of HP / TQ

 

I am glad Zoomer takes the time to express his thoughts and opinions, alot of you should be thinking twice before expressing yours as most of it is pointless. So far I have heard happy dyno, stingy dyno therefore.... BULLSHIT!! I have read all the posts and you guys are picking the fight, Zoomer is not selling anything on this thread at all, he is stating exactly what he feels is good knowledge, half of you guys havent even seen a TVS and your making comments on them? HTF does that make any sense according to your logic??
Whatever, I am looking forward to this year and the developments of ZZP and other Supporting vendors, and what I expect to see is alot of you guys eating crow and calling foul!! But thats what seperates the men from the boys.
I also agree that these claims should be taken to the track, funny how there is almost no videos posted of TVS cars at the drag strip, except for an ION REDLINE. Also Area stated a good point, what are your needs, half of you dont have any needs other than "I want alot of power!"

 

Well then, I stand corrected, damn knows I don't claim to know it all.

and I agree. Dyno is a fun tool and a great resource for tuning. What your car runs in the 1/4 is what determines who wins. 500whp doesn't mean anything if you can't get traction or can't shift worth a damn.


Me, personally, I just want to go "i own a 300+whp cobalt".


that's it.

 

^best post of this entire worthless thread.

 

that's what i'm thinking.... there isn't really any point to have a 500whp Cobalt monster if you cant get traction to get down the track or if your coming out of a turn and when you hit you spin and lose control.

a Cobalt with 300+whp is a very nasty machine, it wouldn't be the fastest thing (because there is always someone out there that'll be faster) but it will be one hell of a ride. 300+whp w/ traction will net you 12s all day

 

I know a turbo will make more power thats easy to figure out.The tvs can make anywere from 300 to 425 whp ,If you buy a fully cnc ported head and nice cams, header,full 3 inch catless exhust and some one who can tune i dont see why you could not put down 400 whp.