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HARROP TVS, What You Need To Know & FAQ

Old 06-23-2010, 10:37 AM
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im running a 2.8 on mine no problems whatsoever, im running with the idea of dropping down a size or two to pick up some more tq and a bit more top end... but im wondering what all can be run with the stock setup, how low can you go
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Old 06-23-2010, 10:51 AM
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K sounds good. I'll pick up a 2.8" and go from there...
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Old 07-01-2010, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by ebristol View Post
Its perfectly fine on a very conservative tune...

But your car wont make any power because you will only be able to run 15-16 degrees of timing. If you try to run more timing your car will knock like Jehovah's Witness.
You win the prize. I'm still knocking a tiny bit on 13* total timing. The car feels OK, but I'm not sure if I should maybe just go back to the stock 80mm pulley and increase timing. I did look at some logs when I was on the 80mm pulley though, and I was getting about 4-7* of KR on the timing map of 21* total I was running. WTF? Apparently the 93 octane pump gas is **** around here or something... Possibly something wrong with my car? It won't take timing like the champ that it should...

What's better, more airflow, or more timing?

Damn E85 UN-availability!
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Old 07-01-2010, 04:28 PM
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so can you use the stock exsaughst? i'm really not a big fan of the ricer sound
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Old 07-01-2010, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by scotch89 View Post
so can you use the stock exsaughst? i'm really not a big fan of the ricer sound
Stock exhaust would kill the power on a TVS. I believe people have only dyno'd about 280-300 with the stock exhaust. A 3" exhaust can sound good and not ricer when done properly.
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Old 07-01-2010, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by csementuh View Post
Stock exhaust would kill the power on a TVS. I believe people have only dyno'd about 280-300 with the stock exhaust. A 3" exhaust can sound good and not ricer when done properly.
I did 330 on my stock catback

ZZP midlength header & downpipe with high flow cat.
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Old 07-01-2010, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by sput View Post
I did 330 on my stock catback

ZZP midlength header & downpipe with high flow cat.
I know it's possible, but I believe he was asking about stock exhaust. The manifold and downpipe are the largest restriction (as is the head). Exhaust gases slow as they cool, so a small restriction towards the end won't cause as much of a problem as a bottleneck right against the head will. The full 3" exhaust really helps top end power.

Anyone have any insight into my 2.8" pulley problem? The TVS is showing me it sucks without some serious octane for timing... I still love it though.

Here's my thread on hpt forums if anyone can help! http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30128
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Old 07-01-2010, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by csementuh View Post
I know it's possible, but I believe he was asking about stock exhaust. The manifold and downpipe are the largest restriction (as is the head). Exhaust gases slow as they cool, so a small restriction towards the end won't cause as much of a problem as a bottleneck right against the head will. The full 3" exhaust really helps top end power.

Anyone have any insight into my 2.8" pulley problem? The TVS is showing me it sucks without some serious octane for timing... I still love it though.

Here's my thread on hpt forums if anyone can help! http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30128
You really do need that bump in octane for the TVS. I could only advance my timing to 16* on 93 octane.
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Old 07-01-2010, 11:37 PM
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Originally Posted by csementuh View Post
I know it's possible, but I believe he was asking about stock exhaust. The manifold and downpipe are the largest restriction (as is the head). Exhaust gases slow as they cool, so a small restriction towards the end won't cause as much of a problem as a bottleneck right against the head will. The full 3" exhaust really helps top end power.

Anyone have any insight into my 2.8" pulley problem? The TVS is showing me it sucks without some serious octane for timing... I still love it though.

Here's my thread on hpt forums if anyone can help! http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30128
Originally Posted by sput View Post
You really do need that bump in octane for the TVS. I could only advance my timing to 16* on 93 octane.
what spark plugs are you guys running???
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Old 07-02-2010, 12:13 AM
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^^ I'm running BKR7E's gapped to about ~.32

I got the P0300 Random Cylinder Misfire twice tonight while tuning and logging. I usually get that code once every week or so.

I swapped back to the stock 80mm TVS pulley and I was able to run 15* of timing.

My plugs have less than 1000 miles on them, but when I pulled them they were white around the base of the plug (where the socket goes to unscrew them), and they had some carbon on the based of the metal around the ceramic. I cleaned them with brake cleaner and threw them back in.

I have the BKR8EIX Iridium plugs too, I could make try those plugs too since they're 2 step colder. Not sure how well they'll work though considering the coppers are better for boost.

Any advice..? I'm trying to get my TVS running right, and it's being a PITA!
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Old 07-02-2010, 12:31 AM
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Originally Posted by csementuh View Post
^^ I'm running BKR7E's gapped to about ~.32

I got the P0300 Random Cylinder Misfire twice tonight while tuning and logging. I usually get that code once every week or so.

I swapped back to the stock 80mm TVS pulley and I was able to run 15* of timing.

My plugs have less than 1000 miles on them, but when I pulled them they were white around the base of the plug (where the socket goes to unscrew them), and they had some carbon on the based of the metal around the ceramic. I cleaned them with brake cleaner and threw them back in.

I have the BKR8EIX Iridium plugs too, I could make try those plugs too since they're 2 step colder. Not sure how well they'll work though considering the coppers are better for boost.

Any advice..? I'm trying to get my TVS running right, and it's being a PITA!
mine too, so much so that im back to the m62 for a while so i dont have to worry about **** anymore



plug chart
http://www.mudinmyblood.net/forum/im...park_plugs.jpg
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:00 AM
  #237  
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Whats causing you guys so much trouble?
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by fast98 View Post
Whats causing you guys so much trouble?
That's what I'd like to know...

I can't run **** for timing without knock on 93, and I'm getting some P0300 misfires. Any suggestions would be appreciated!

Also does anyone know anything about the 'VE Maximum' table under Engine>Airflow>Dynamic Airflow in HP Tuners 2.23 BETA. It appears this table can be zero'd out if you aren't using VE and are running MAF only, but I'm not sure. This might help some fueling issues where the PCM tries to use a VE table that isn't accurate.
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:55 AM
  #239  
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I was able to get 17* out of pump gas. Started running meth shortly there after and was able to hold 25.5*.

I also had the p0300 from time to time. Nothing ever got rid of it. I played with plug gaps and was able to reduce the misfire but not eliminate it. They're a pain in the ass with bigger injectors. But if you're not misfiring under throttle I wouldn't worry about it.

My TVS car ran just like a factory car though. partial throttle all the way to WOT.
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:09 AM
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Well that sounds good, I wish I had the same luck...

Stupid question of the day... Is it 'OK' to run the TVS 80m pulley with a GM Stage 2 belt? I used the S2 belt on my 2.8" TVS pulley, and I swapped back to stock 80mm pulley last night. The pulley fit but just barely, and the tensioner is definitely towards the bottom of its travel. Is this safe, or am I stressing the tensioner and/or putting too much pressure on the pulleys?
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by csementuh View Post
Well that sounds good, I wish I had the same luck...

Stupid question of the day... Is it 'OK' to run the TVS 80m pulley with a GM Stage 2 belt? I used the S2 belt on my 2.8" TVS pulley, and I swapped back to stock 80mm pulley last night. The pulley fit but just barely, and the tensioner is definitely towards the bottom of its travel. Is this safe, or am I stressing the tensioner and/or putting too much pressure on the pulleys?
You're good.
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:37 AM
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^ Great!

Now I need to get this tune dialed in...

OK.. So meth. Is it as simple as leaning out your PE modifier AFR a bit and running some more timing top end? Seems like suchhh a hassle for a daily driver.

Advice on meth kits? Progressive needed? The trunk kits are so much more expensive it doesn't seem worthwhile. I'll entertain the notion of meth though, but likely won't go there.
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:44 AM
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I can get you a devilsown kit with trunk mount tank for a great price. Just let me know which kit....I would suggest a progressive kit.
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by fast98 View Post
I can get you a devilsown kit with trunk mount tank for a great price. Just let me know which kit....I would suggest a progressive kit.
Well PM me a price please and I'll mill it around a bit...

Price for both please.

Is the progressive harder to tune for since it doens't come on all at once? How do you know how/when to lean up your AFR since the kits are boost controlled and not RPM like the PE AFR?
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by csementuh View Post
Well PM me a price please and I'll mill it around a bit...

Price for both please.

Is the progressive harder to tune for since it doens't come on all at once? How do you know how/when to lean up your AFR since the kits are boost controlled and not RPM like the PE AFR?
Perhaps I've been doing this wrong the whole time.. but i kept my PE the same and tuned my maf curve to bring the afr back to the commanded PE..
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Old 07-02-2010, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by 383_Stroker View Post
Perhaps I've been doing this wrong the whole time.. but i kept my PE the same and tuned my maf curve to bring the afr back to the commanded PE..
Hmm, not sure which is right, but I was under the belief that adjusting your fueling using the MAF curve was 'raping' the tables, sorta like giving the MAF 30% more fuel when running E85 instead of just changing your stoich ratio.

Changing the MAF scaling should however change the other calculations that the PCM makes for cylinder airmass and other stuff, because you are effectively lying to the PCM and telling it it's getting more air, and to inject more gas. This is bad. The MAF frequency table is a AIR table, not a FUEL table.

Maybe some expert meth tuner can chime in..?
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Old 07-06-2010, 04:27 PM
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justt posting so i can get to this thread easier, but i do have a question. im gonna put in my order for the kit from ottp and i also want to buy hp tuners. is there anyone one here willing to let me get or even sell me a decent tune to run with that i can load with hp tuners? i dunno if i can trust my self doing my own tunes with it yet and it seems like i can save money that way instead of taking my car to get fine tuned on a dyno for hundreds of dollars
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Old 07-06-2010, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by startingline05 View Post
justt posting so i can get to this thread easier, but i do have a question. im gonna put in my order for the kit from ottp and i also want to buy hp tuners. is there anyone one here willing to let me get or even sell me a decent tune to run with that i can load with hp tuners? i dunno if i can trust my self doing my own tunes with it yet and it seems like i can save money that way instead of taking my car to get fine tuned on a dyno for hundreds of dollars
If you buy hpt from us with the kit we can help you tune it.
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Old 07-06-2010, 06:01 PM
  #249  
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if you keep getting the p0300. you have issues. either in the tune, or mechanical. i run 14 degree's on a 2.9 pulley on 91 octane with zero issues. e85 is a different story.

if you get the fuel control wrong you will get random misfires for no reason. if you have a **** harness, or injectors. this will do it. 2step colder plugs are not needed for your level. i am right on the edge of needing them.

leak down and compression test. then go from there. it doesn't stray much from a m62 tune file. just needs more maf work to compensate for the cfm difference. and timing drop due to cylinder pressures.
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Old 07-06-2010, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Area47 View Post
if you keep getting the p0300. you have issues. either in the tune, or mechanical. i run 14 degree's on a 2.9 pulley on 91 octane with zero issues. e85 is a different story.

if you get the fuel control wrong you will get random misfires for no reason. if you have a **** harness, or injectors. this will do it. 2step colder plugs are not needed for your level. i am right on the edge of needing them.

leak down and compression test. then go from there. it doesn't stray much from a m62 tune file. just needs more maf work to compensate for the cfm difference. and timing drop due to cylinder pressures.
Thanks for the insight Bryan. Could bad plugs cause the cylinder misfires? I have a Caspers harness that's a couple years old, and new 80's from OTTP. I'm still a little confused by why I can barely run any timing. I think I'm still on 13 or 14 * on 93 with the 80mm pulley. I could barely run any on the 2.8". Bad knock sensor(s) or something maybe?
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