What did everyone Pay?
Senior Member
Joined: 10-15-04
Posts: 701
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From: Calgary, AB
Originally Posted by BlueVillain
If you negotiate price, what do you get as far as knowledge?
Nothing? You still don't know the payment.
Dealerships can twist whatever number they want to until they are blue in the face. What does it matter, so can the doctor performing heart surgery.
The simplest thing I can tell you, and this is from all of the people I see coming into my dealership making the same mistakes that inevitably some of you will make, is that you will walk out of the dealership paying more a month than you had originally wanted to and you will regret it.
It's called buyers remorse and I see it every day.
In the last message he did say to arm yourself with information.
PLEASE BY ALL MEANS INFORM YOURSELF.
That is what this is.
If you negotiate on price, do you then know if it fits into your monthly budget?
No, no no and hell no.
Even the most experienced car buyer will tell you that if you negotiate on price and not on payment you're still leaving yourself to get screwed.
There's only so many numbers involved in the equation. If you want to pay less for the vehicle then tell them that when they tell you what it costs you to own it.
If you're expecting $250 a month with $0 down and you haggle the salesman from $25,000 to $23,500, it doesn't matter what math I throw at it, you're not getting a $250 monthly payment.
(23,500 / 72 = 326.28 and this isn't even counting interest)
Here's a fact that everyone is missing. YOU STILL HAVE TO SIGN THE PAPERWORK.
If you don't want to go to 72 months, don't sign the paperwork,
If you don't want your payments higher than $326.28, then don't sign the paperwork. But you could have saved yourself a whole lot of trouble by asking what the payment is before you argued about price.
But you're not going to know exactly what payment you qualify for until they tell you what apr they quote you with.
Now I don't know the laws in your particular state, but in North Carolina a dealer is limited to within 3 points of the approval by the bank. Which means if Wachovia or Bank of America approve your loan for $23,500 at 4.9% the dealership can charge a max of 7.9% (and they will try to "hold points" on you, it's how they make a living).
Back to what I said before: IF YOU DON'T WANT A 7.9% FINANCE RATE, THEN DON'T SIGN THE PAPERWORK.
But at least now you know that $23,500 for 60 months at 4.9% is 442.40 and nowhere near your expected payment of $250.
Now when the dealer comes back at you with $442.40 you say "I was trying to be around $250" and they will work with you to get you closer to your payment.
Better yet, if you tell them you want to be around $250 (or whatever payment you were comfortable with) they will know before hand that you need to be looking at an LS instead of the SS/SC (because even our "twisting" can't get $23,500 down to that payment even if we go 84 months).
Instead, people instinctively negotiate price and it take twice as long.
So in the example before, you take a test drive, they write up the deal, you negotiate, they come back to $23,500, you agree, they check your credit, the submit to bank, they sit you down and tell you what your payment is.
This normally averages about three hours. (and let's not get started on how long it takes. We know it takes a long time, there's nothing we can do about it)
Now you sit down and the guy (or girl) tells you $442.40 and suggests GAP and an Extended Warranty (if you don't know, ask) which takes your payment to $480.05 (on the negotiated $23,500).
Worst case scenario:
Now you pick up your jaw from the floor and are all pissed off at the dealersip because "they are trying to rip you off." You storm off and tell your friends how "horrible" the dealership is, and now the dealership has lost two customers.
Best case scenario:
You tell them you want $250. They tell you to look at a LS instead of an SS/SC and you have to do another Demo, they'll quote you a price, you'll forget to negotiate, because now you know to negotiate payment instead of price (and you will, I see it every day) and you walk out at $327.87 (because anything is better than $480.05 a month). In this situation the dealership actually held a point and you just signed up at 5.9 for 60 months financing $17,000. This will take another 3 hours taking your total to 6, and you drove home in less of a vehicle than you expected paying more than you expected and you're still pissed off at the dealership.
How about this one.
You walk into the dealership and say you want a cobalt at $250 a month. The salesman suggests a nice LS Coupe with a sunroof and you take a test drive. The show you numbers because you don't negotiate price. You sign the numbers page "upon agreed payment" and they check your credit, show you a payment of $320.03 on 4.9 for 60 months. You negotiate payment, not price and say you want $250 a month and they come back with $264.04 for 3.75 at 72 months. You drive off happy in a nice vehicle that you like with a payment that fits your budget. AND YOU DIDN'T NEGOTIATE PRICE.
I hope this helps, I'm not trying to start fights or call names. I'm not trying to make the dealership any money. I'm trying to educate you on the entire process, so you'll not make the same mistakes everybody else is making.
Villain
Who is only trying to help by stating what is obvious to him.
Nothing? You still don't know the payment.
Dealerships can twist whatever number they want to until they are blue in the face. What does it matter, so can the doctor performing heart surgery.
The simplest thing I can tell you, and this is from all of the people I see coming into my dealership making the same mistakes that inevitably some of you will make, is that you will walk out of the dealership paying more a month than you had originally wanted to and you will regret it.
It's called buyers remorse and I see it every day.
In the last message he did say to arm yourself with information.
PLEASE BY ALL MEANS INFORM YOURSELF.
That is what this is.
If you negotiate on price, do you then know if it fits into your monthly budget?
No, no no and hell no.
Even the most experienced car buyer will tell you that if you negotiate on price and not on payment you're still leaving yourself to get screwed.
There's only so many numbers involved in the equation. If you want to pay less for the vehicle then tell them that when they tell you what it costs you to own it.
If you're expecting $250 a month with $0 down and you haggle the salesman from $25,000 to $23,500, it doesn't matter what math I throw at it, you're not getting a $250 monthly payment.
(23,500 / 72 = 326.28 and this isn't even counting interest)
Here's a fact that everyone is missing. YOU STILL HAVE TO SIGN THE PAPERWORK.
If you don't want to go to 72 months, don't sign the paperwork,
If you don't want your payments higher than $326.28, then don't sign the paperwork. But you could have saved yourself a whole lot of trouble by asking what the payment is before you argued about price.
But you're not going to know exactly what payment you qualify for until they tell you what apr they quote you with.
Now I don't know the laws in your particular state, but in North Carolina a dealer is limited to within 3 points of the approval by the bank. Which means if Wachovia or Bank of America approve your loan for $23,500 at 4.9% the dealership can charge a max of 7.9% (and they will try to "hold points" on you, it's how they make a living).
Back to what I said before: IF YOU DON'T WANT A 7.9% FINANCE RATE, THEN DON'T SIGN THE PAPERWORK.
But at least now you know that $23,500 for 60 months at 4.9% is 442.40 and nowhere near your expected payment of $250.
Now when the dealer comes back at you with $442.40 you say "I was trying to be around $250" and they will work with you to get you closer to your payment.
Better yet, if you tell them you want to be around $250 (or whatever payment you were comfortable with) they will know before hand that you need to be looking at an LS instead of the SS/SC (because even our "twisting" can't get $23,500 down to that payment even if we go 84 months).
Instead, people instinctively negotiate price and it take twice as long.
So in the example before, you take a test drive, they write up the deal, you negotiate, they come back to $23,500, you agree, they check your credit, the submit to bank, they sit you down and tell you what your payment is.
This normally averages about three hours. (and let's not get started on how long it takes. We know it takes a long time, there's nothing we can do about it)
Now you sit down and the guy (or girl) tells you $442.40 and suggests GAP and an Extended Warranty (if you don't know, ask) which takes your payment to $480.05 (on the negotiated $23,500).
Worst case scenario:
Now you pick up your jaw from the floor and are all pissed off at the dealersip because "they are trying to rip you off." You storm off and tell your friends how "horrible" the dealership is, and now the dealership has lost two customers.
Best case scenario:
You tell them you want $250. They tell you to look at a LS instead of an SS/SC and you have to do another Demo, they'll quote you a price, you'll forget to negotiate, because now you know to negotiate payment instead of price (and you will, I see it every day) and you walk out at $327.87 (because anything is better than $480.05 a month). In this situation the dealership actually held a point and you just signed up at 5.9 for 60 months financing $17,000. This will take another 3 hours taking your total to 6, and you drove home in less of a vehicle than you expected paying more than you expected and you're still pissed off at the dealership.
How about this one.
You walk into the dealership and say you want a cobalt at $250 a month. The salesman suggests a nice LS Coupe with a sunroof and you take a test drive. The show you numbers because you don't negotiate price. You sign the numbers page "upon agreed payment" and they check your credit, show you a payment of $320.03 on 4.9 for 60 months. You negotiate payment, not price and say you want $250 a month and they come back with $264.04 for 3.75 at 72 months. You drive off happy in a nice vehicle that you like with a payment that fits your budget. AND YOU DIDN'T NEGOTIATE PRICE.
I hope this helps, I'm not trying to start fights or call names. I'm not trying to make the dealership any money. I'm trying to educate you on the entire process, so you'll not make the same mistakes everybody else is making.
Villain
Who is only trying to help by stating what is obvious to him.
When you are buying you need to negotiate (if possible):
Price
Interest
Term
If you are stupid enough to look at payments only you don't even bother to check out options such as leasing vs buying. Just because leasing is cheaper per month doesn't mean it is best option for the person getting the car. You are probably the same kind of sales person who will talk someone into getting a better car with a lease when the person wanted to purchase, even though they are spending more money on interest now than when they were going to purchase the car (just a scenario, obviously rates move all the time).
For me, I'm not a ******* and I know what my monthly budget, driving habits, etc are for me. I've also owened American and know depreciation can be a bitch. That is why I TELL my salesman I want a 48 month 24,000km/year lease. He tells me the residual will be 39% and the lease rate will be 2.8%. These are not negotiable, so now I deal for the best price, and to waive things such as tire tax etc so that I leave the place with more money and lower payments than if I had blindly signed the papers like someone foolishly has suggested over and over.
Member
Joined: 01-18-05
Posts: 292
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From: Piedmont Triad, NC
Originally Posted by b-spot
Thanks, but I'm pretty sure my university economics courses showed me that either a lease or a purchase on a car is a pretty simple thing and a 4 variable formula could replace all your ramblings and provide more information to people here.
When you are buying you need to negotiate (if possible):
Price
Interest
Term
If you are stupid enough to look at payments only you don't even bother to check out options such as leasing vs buying. Just because leasing is cheaper per month doesn't mean it is best option for the person getting the car. You are probably the same kind of sales person who will talk someone into getting a better car with a lease when the person wanted to purchase, even though they are spending more money on interest now than when they were going to purchase the car (just a scenario, obviously rates move all the time).
For me, I'm not a ******* and I know what my monthly budget, driving habits, etc are for me. I've also owened American and know depreciation can be a bitch. That is why I TELL my salesman I want a 48 month 24,000km/year lease. He tells me the residual will be 39% and the lease rate will be 2.8%. These are not negotiable, so now I deal for the best price, and to waive things such as tire tax etc so that I leave the place with more money and lower payments than if I had blindly signed the papers like someone foolishly has suggested over and over.
When you are buying you need to negotiate (if possible):
Price
Interest
Term
If you are stupid enough to look at payments only you don't even bother to check out options such as leasing vs buying. Just because leasing is cheaper per month doesn't mean it is best option for the person getting the car. You are probably the same kind of sales person who will talk someone into getting a better car with a lease when the person wanted to purchase, even though they are spending more money on interest now than when they were going to purchase the car (just a scenario, obviously rates move all the time).
For me, I'm not a ******* and I know what my monthly budget, driving habits, etc are for me. I've also owened American and know depreciation can be a bitch. That is why I TELL my salesman I want a 48 month 24,000km/year lease. He tells me the residual will be 39% and the lease rate will be 2.8%. These are not negotiable, so now I deal for the best price, and to waive things such as tire tax etc so that I leave the place with more money and lower payments than if I had blindly signed the papers like someone foolishly has suggested over and over.
What I've been saying the whole time is to negoitate once you know what the payment is.
You can only know what the payment is if you know what the rate is. If you know what the rate is, then you don't need help with this. For the rest of you who don't know what rate you qualify for, don't negotiate price before you know what the payment is.
7.9% is an average rate. Some people qualify for it and some people don't. Not everybody qualifys for a lease, let alone a lease at 2.8%. Lease terms are often not negotiable.
Finance rates on a "buy" (not a lease) ARE NEGOTIABLE unless they are a special rate through GMAC.
YES, YOU CAN NEGOTIATE ALL THREE FACTORS!!!
But unless you know what they make your price you're wasting everybody's time.
How many times do I have to say it (and I know I'm long-winded, it doesn't bother me)
IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO NEGOTIATE PRICE BEFORE YOU KNOW WHAT RATE YOU QUALIFY FOR.
IF YOU KNOW WHAT RATE YOU QUALIFY FOR THEN FIGURING PAYMENTS IS EASY.
IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT RATE YOU QUALIFY FOR, THEN NEGOTIATING PRICE DOESN'T HELP YOU UNTIL YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR RATE IS.
Then you can do your "simple math" that is not quite so simple for the people on here who asked the original question "what did you pay for your Cobalt?!?"
I apologize if my assumptions aren't blatant.
If you don't know what payment to expect, then you probably don't know what rate you qualify for. If you don't know what rate you qualify for then you're probably not extremely familiar with the process.
If you are extremely familiar with the process then you already know what your payment is.
I hope your university logic tought you that.
Those of you who are not familiar with rates and terms and everything else do themselves no good by negotiating on price and as you said yourself not on rates.
Dealerships nowadays make more money in the finance office because of "intelligent" people like yourself who don't negotiate payments, because they already negotiated price. Now the dealership makes nothing on the sale and tons on the financing.
I'm just trying to show everybody the truth as I see it.
If you already know the truth, then why call people names?
Villain
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Joined: 02-12-05
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From: long island, ny
kinda off topic here but i have a question for any salespeople or anyone who might know. im 22 and screwed up my credit. i want to buy a ss/sc. my dad who has excellent credit is willing to co-sign for me. i was just wondering if my credit is shot and the car is going under my name, would him co-signing for me keep the car at a reasonable interest rate?
Senior Member
Joined: 10-15-04
Posts: 701
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From: Calgary, AB
^ Villian,
If I come into your dealership to buy a car I'm not going to waste your time haggling on price unless I know this is the vehicle I'm getting (even if you don't know that yet). I'll ask for the MSRP while I'm car shopping, and the rate. Since I'm leasing, as you said the rate is not negotiable, so I'll ask for that too as I realize 3% on 20,000 is a big difference from 8% on 20,000 somehwere else.
Only once I know what I want am I going to worry about the price, because really, whatever you save probably isn't going to make or break the deal for you (although that is a great negotiating tactic).
I don't know of anyone who goes to buy a car, signs the paper work then says "Oh ****! You want $500 from me every month!?"
So in response to your question: How the heck are you supposed to negotiate those three amazingly simple things if you don't know what they equate to?!?
I bring a calculator along.
If I come into your dealership to buy a car I'm not going to waste your time haggling on price unless I know this is the vehicle I'm getting (even if you don't know that yet). I'll ask for the MSRP while I'm car shopping, and the rate. Since I'm leasing, as you said the rate is not negotiable, so I'll ask for that too as I realize 3% on 20,000 is a big difference from 8% on 20,000 somehwere else.
Only once I know what I want am I going to worry about the price, because really, whatever you save probably isn't going to make or break the deal for you (although that is a great negotiating tactic).
I don't know of anyone who goes to buy a car, signs the paper work then says "Oh ****! You want $500 from me every month!?"
So in response to your question: How the heck are you supposed to negotiate those three amazingly simple things if you don't know what they equate to?!?
I bring a calculator along.
Senior Member
Joined: 10-15-04
Posts: 701
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From: Calgary, AB
Originally Posted by inhale
kinda off topic here but i have a question for any salespeople or anyone who might know. im 22 and screwed up my credit. i want to buy a ss/sc. my dad who has excellent credit is willing to co-sign for me. i was just wondering if my credit is shot and the car is going under my name, would him co-signing for me keep the car at a reasonable interest rate?
Member
Joined: 01-18-05
Posts: 292
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From: Piedmont Triad, NC
Originally Posted by b-spot
^ Villian,
If I come into your dealership to buy a car I'm not going to waste your time haggling on price unless I know this is the vehicle I'm getting (even if you don't know that yet). I'll ask for the MSRP while I'm car shopping, and the rate. Since I'm leasing, as you said the rate is not negotiable, so I'll ask for that too as I realize 3% on 20,000 is a big difference from 8% on 20,000 somehwere else.
Only once I know what I want am I going to worry about the price, because really, whatever you save probably isn't going to make or break the deal for you (although that is a great negotiating tactic).
I don't know of anyone who goes to buy a car, signs the paper work then says "Oh ****! You want $500 from me every month!?"
So in response to your question: How the heck are you supposed to negotiate those three amazingly simple things if you don't know what they equate to?!?
I bring a calculator along.
If I come into your dealership to buy a car I'm not going to waste your time haggling on price unless I know this is the vehicle I'm getting (even if you don't know that yet). I'll ask for the MSRP while I'm car shopping, and the rate. Since I'm leasing, as you said the rate is not negotiable, so I'll ask for that too as I realize 3% on 20,000 is a big difference from 8% on 20,000 somehwere else.
Only once I know what I want am I going to worry about the price, because really, whatever you save probably isn't going to make or break the deal for you (although that is a great negotiating tactic).
I don't know of anyone who goes to buy a car, signs the paper work then says "Oh ****! You want $500 from me every month!?"
So in response to your question: How the heck are you supposed to negotiate those three amazingly simple things if you don't know what they equate to?!?
I bring a calculator along.
I've sold cars to hundreds (if not thousands) of people and the one thing I've encountered in every vehicle I've sold through financing is that 0$ is better than what they left with. Don't get me wrong, I just sold a C6 for $7,000 out the door, but that is very rare. 9 times out of 10 people have negative equity which they don't really understand, they have fair to midland credit and they think it should cost less than it actually does. Sadly enough, I've even turned people away because I thought they would put themselves in a worse situation than they already are. But what I've never done is say "you can't negotiate price."
I could count the number of people who brought a calculator with them to buy a car on one hand. The number of people who bought a car even though they didn't know their own credit history well, is hundreds of times more often.
I think the calculator is a great idea. I think that your salesman should be up front with you and tell you that this loan for five years will cost you $3,285.26 in interest over the life of the loan. I think that often it's not fair what people pay for cars, but it's a fact of life that they need reliable transportation and their credit is not as great as some of yours is.
Also, I think a lot of times people want too much for what they expect to spend. Again, the number of calculator-wielders is only a percentage of people who want the 4wd Z71 Tahoe for $350 a month, and yes, this happens at least once a day. If you've never met them, please, by all means, I'll loan you my office for a day. They go over everything, don't even blink at a $40,000 sticker and I think they understand that their payments are going to be upwards of $600 to $800 a month. This happens way way way more than people who already know their payment. And no, these people don't sign paperwork, they get angry and leave, and that doesn't help anybody.
So when people ask about payments I often explain the whole thing to them. Because if I can educate you on how to buy a car, you'll truly see what kind of deal I'm making you, instead of just buying one because the other dealer was asking too much.
If every customer I sold cars to were as educated as you are then my job could be done by a trained monkey. But as it remains, a salespersons commission is based largely upon people who don't know what they are doing. That's why I said, finance rates are negotiable, prices are negotiable, terms are negotiable (but they don't do as much good) but they don't mean anything if you don't understand what your payment would be.
(And again, if you knew what your payment would be, you wouldn't be asking about it on here, would you?)
One of the first things I said was, because I knew this would happen, "I'm not trying to start a riot" and I'm not. I'm trying to help everybody out, and it seems like those people who don't know how to calculate payments need more help than the rest of us, and that's okay.
Villain
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Joined: 01-12-05
Posts: 568
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From: Cincinnati
Villian, here's one for you...... No haggleing (sp) no nothing JUST $49 over invoice. and yes I got my car ordered and waiting for it. Its a chevy dealer and one of the large ones in the US. so MSRP means nothing. All it means is a suggested retail. I could show you all sorts of ideams that DO NOT sell for MSRP, but it would talk the rest of my life to show you them all, and I think my time is more valuable than reading and debating the importance of making sure my dealer gets every dime of money he can. This is just simple business practice, sell at a fair price and you will get more customers, THUS more sales and more profit from take less profit from one sale. It all in the numbers. I NEVER deal with dealers that are lazy A**es and expect me to pay MSRP so they can have a large take home to go one vacation. Work like everyone else does, sorry but I'm not going to blow rainbows up some dealers a** because he thinks has something that I would like and he's going to get what ever he wants for it. I have always laughed at the dealers that charge $5,000 + over MSRP for a car that is in short supply, the car is ONLY worth MSPR, actualy loan value. So you will never find me paying more than I have to, yes I do make sure my dealer gets a fair profit, I'm not going to rape him.
Member
Joined: 01-18-05
Posts: 292
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From: Piedmont Triad, NC
Originally Posted by b-spot
I got my first car when I had no credit history at all. My dad co-signed and they didn't care about my credit anymore, just his. Its because if you default, he is on the hook and they know he has the money to make up for it (assuming your dad has good credit).
They will give you a loan because they think you will repay it. And the finance rates they give you will be based on the risk they take in giving you money to buy the car of your choice. The more they expect you to NOT pay them back is the higher rate they will charge.
If your credit is really bad, you may not qualify for a loan at all.
The idea that they will give you a loan because your father has money is also ridiculous. There are tremendous amount of variables, much more than "Debt-to-net" or income alone. Further, he said his father had good credit, not a lot of money. It's none of your business how much money he has "to make up for it."
Inhale, just refer to my private message and if you have any more questions, please feel free to ask.
Villain
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Joined: 01-18-05
Posts: 292
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From: Piedmont Triad, NC
Originally Posted by Archplsm
Villian, here's one for you...... No haggleing (sp) no nothing JUST $49 over invoice. and yes I got my car ordered and waiting for it. Its a chevy dealer and one of the large ones in the US. so MSRP means nothing. All it means is a suggested retail. I could show you all sorts of ideams that DO NOT sell for MSRP, but it would talk the rest of my life to show you them all, and I think my time is more valuable than reading and debating the importance of making sure my dealer gets every dime of money he can. This is just simple business practice, sell at a fair price and you will get more customers, THUS more sales and more profit from take less profit from one sale. It all in the numbers. I NEVER deal with dealers that are lazy A**es and expect me to pay MSRP so they can have a large take home to go one vacation. Work like everyone else does, sorry but I'm not going to blow rainbows up some dealers a** because he thinks has something that I would like and he's going to get what ever he wants for it. I have always laughed at the dealers that charge $5,000 + over MSRP for a car that is in short supply, the car is ONLY worth MSPR, actualy loan value. So you will never find me paying more than I have to, yes I do make sure my dealer gets a fair profit, I'm not going to rape him.
All I've ever argued here was to not haglle price before you know payment. Why is that so freakin hard to understand.
Don't haggle price before you understand what that $500 actually means.
If you want to tell me nobody pays sticker, fine I agree with that.
If you want to tell me everything you know about buying cars, fine, tell me that. But let me ask you this:
Did you haggle price when he told you $49 over invoice?
No, you didn't. And that was my point all along, because you thought it wouldn't do any good. I've sold hundreds of vehicles for under invoice because the guy down the street sells everything from Corvettes to Aveos for $49 over invoice. Yet the point is that I sold hundreds of vehicles that he didn't.
If I told you that you could do better than $49 over invoice, by hundreds of dollars, would you wait until after I told you the payment to ask me how much under invoice?
Here is the point and hide your eyes if you don't like it.
IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO HAGGLE PRICE BEFORE YOU KNOW WHAT THE PAYMENT IS.
IF YOU KNOW WHAT THE PAYMENT IS, THEN HAGGLE PRICE.
IF YOU KNOW WHAT THE PAYMENT IS, WHY THE F*** ARE YOU IN HERE ASKING WHAT THE PAYMENT IS?!?
If you know what the payment is it's easy to buy a car.
If you don't know the payment, then price has nothing to do with buying a car, because you don't know if you can afford a $25,000 Cobalt SS SUPERCHARGED or just the $17,000 LS COUPE with the 1sb package.
So take note and listen a bit.
Villain
And congratulations on your new Cobalt purchase.
New Member
Joined: 09-01-04
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From: Bloomingburg, NY
another thing that people don't understand is that the salesman needs to make a living, and while he/she wants to give u the best deal, they need to pay bills also... they get paid on a commission... if they sell every car for cost, they make almost nothing, and that doesn't pay the bills... another thing, if the salesman spends 4hrs with u, and u end up buying nothing, he just worked 4hrs for nothing... would u work 4hrs for nothing? even if u buy a car, and get it for $49 over cost, he just made less than $10 for 4hrs work... and also, if the dealer gave every car away for under cost, how long do u think they will be in business? all anyone wants is a fair deal, both the dealer and the customer...
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Joined: 01-21-05
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From: Indianapolis, IN
Originally Posted by inhale
kinda off topic here but i have a question for any salespeople or anyone who might know. im 22 and screwed up my credit. i want to buy a ss/sc. my dad who has excellent credit is willing to co-sign for me. i was just wondering if my credit is shot and the car is going under my name, would him co-signing for me keep the car at a reasonable interest rate?
New Member
Joined: 02-27-05
Posts: 20
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From: Lake Oswego, OR
yea i probably should not get involved but incase ppl haven't noticed I don't think Villian is talking about accepting a higher price so that dealers make more money...
I believe he is saying that you should accept the dealer's price until you see the monthly payments, because if you demand a lower price right from the start the monthly payments will be more.... if I understood correctly.
and then once the dealer has told you your monthly payments, then that is when you negotiate the price.
I believe he is saying that you should accept the dealer's price until you see the monthly payments, because if you demand a lower price right from the start the monthly payments will be more.... if I understood correctly.
and then once the dealer has told you your monthly payments, then that is when you negotiate the price.
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Joined: 02-20-05
Posts: 756
Likes: 0
From: Austin Tx
Originally Posted by aka_Matt
another thing that people don't understand is that the salesman needs to make a living, and while he/she wants to give u the best deal, they need to pay bills also... they get paid on a commission... if they sell every car for cost, they make almost nothing, and that doesn't pay the bills... another thing, if the salesman spends 4hrs with u, and u end up buying nothing, he just worked 4hrs for nothing... would u work 4hrs for nothing? even if u buy a car, and get it for $49 over cost, he just made less than $10 for 4hrs work... and also, if the dealer gave every car away for under cost, how long do u think they will be in business? all anyone wants is a fair deal, both the dealer and the customer...
The imports have been doing it for years and they don't seem to be having hard times. I agree that you shouldnt take out a car and beat the **** out of it and not intend to buy it, but dealers arn't going to go under by selling at MSRP. If they sold more (which they would) at MSRP they could make the same amount and benefit the company they work for in the mean time.
New Member
Joined: 11-19-04
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
From: Mentor, OH
Example of the deal I'm looking at getting
The following is an example of what I'll be asking for when I walk in to purchase my 2005 Cobalt SS Supercharged.
Cobalt SS Supercharged
MSRP: $21,995
Publicly Listed Invoice Price: $20,602
Holdback (Using 3%): $618.06
$20,602.00 - $618.06 = $19,983.94
$19,983.94 - $6,595.04 (Down Payment) = $13,388.90
$13,388.90 X 6.75% (Tax) = $903.75
$13,388.90 + $903.75 = $14,292.65
$14,292.65 + $100.00 (Dealer Document Fee) + $25.00 (Estimate of Title Fee) = $14,417.65
$14,417.65 would be the amount financed
The following is straight from www.chevrolet.com.,
When you finance through your dealer and GMAC. For 5.9% APR, monthly payment for every $1000 you finance is $19.29 for 60 months.
$14.418 X $19.29 = $278.12
Estimate of Monthy Payment: $278.12
Cobalt SS Supercharged
MSRP: $21,995
Publicly Listed Invoice Price: $20,602
Holdback (Using 3%): $618.06
$20,602.00 - $618.06 = $19,983.94
$19,983.94 - $6,595.04 (Down Payment) = $13,388.90
$13,388.90 X 6.75% (Tax) = $903.75
$13,388.90 + $903.75 = $14,292.65
$14,292.65 + $100.00 (Dealer Document Fee) + $25.00 (Estimate of Title Fee) = $14,417.65
$14,417.65 would be the amount financed
The following is straight from www.chevrolet.com.,
When you finance through your dealer and GMAC. For 5.9% APR, monthly payment for every $1000 you finance is $19.29 for 60 months.
$14.418 X $19.29 = $278.12
Estimate of Monthy Payment: $278.12
Senior Member
Joined: 10-15-04
Posts: 701
Likes: 0
From: Calgary, AB
Originally Posted by BlueVillain
I honestly doubt that any major lending institution would give you a loan expecting you to default on it.
They will give you a loan because they think you will repay it. And the finance rates they give you will be based on the risk they take in giving you money to buy the car of your choice. The more they expect you to NOT pay them back is the higher rate they will charge.
If your credit is really bad, you may not qualify for a loan at all.
The idea that they will give you a loan because your father has money is also ridiculous. There are tremendous amount of variables, much more than "Debt-to-net" or income alone. Further, he said his father had good credit, not a lot of money. It's none of your business how much money he has "to make up for it."
Inhale, just refer to my private message and if you have any more questions, please feel free to ask.
Villain
They will give you a loan because they think you will repay it. And the finance rates they give you will be based on the risk they take in giving you money to buy the car of your choice. The more they expect you to NOT pay them back is the higher rate they will charge.
If your credit is really bad, you may not qualify for a loan at all.
The idea that they will give you a loan because your father has money is also ridiculous. There are tremendous amount of variables, much more than "Debt-to-net" or income alone. Further, he said his father had good credit, not a lot of money. It's none of your business how much money he has "to make up for it."
Inhale, just refer to my private message and if you have any more questions, please feel free to ask.
Villain
Exactly what I said. Now stop being a douche and trying to pick fights with people that know exactly what they are talking about.
Site Founder
Joined: 03-17-04
Posts: 7,650
Likes: 2
From: NE OH Near Cleveland
Ok, your immature language is forcing me to lock this thread!
I asked you nicely to stop and what do you guys do?
The language you guys use is not acceptable and in violation of the board rules. You guys are going to force me to put the filters up!
Grow up!
(For those that actually contributed to the thread, feel free to start a new one and lets hope it wont get filled with trash again)
I asked you nicely to stop and what do you guys do?
The language you guys use is not acceptable and in violation of the board rules. You guys are going to force me to put the filters up!
Grow up!
(For those that actually contributed to the thread, feel free to start a new one and lets hope it wont get filled with trash again)
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