howl noise remains after replacing hubs
11-26-2019, 12:20 PM
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howl noise remains after replacing hubs
Ok so I'm having a weird issue with my 08SS. Has approx 120k on it. Stock size tires on the stock LNF wheels. I have a rather loud howl (think 'woo-woo-woo' type noise) when turning both left and right, but it only happens at full steering wheel lock. Thought it was my front bearings, so I replaced those about 1k miles ago. The noise did not change at all after replacing those. Still happens under same conditions and same volume as before. Didn't see any issues with anything else when I was replacing the hubs though. I gave a once over to things like my end links, bushings, fender liners (to see if there were any rub marks), etc. I guess I should note that I haven't done anything with the front struts or the upper mount/bearing there. And my upper mount is rather rusty (I drive this in winter), but would that even cause symptoms like I have?
Any thoughts on what might be causing this? It's getting very annoying and is embarrassing in parking lots haha. Any input is appreciated!
Any thoughts on what might be causing this? It's getting very annoying and is embarrassing in parking lots haha. Any input is appreciated!
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01-29-2020, 11:48 PM
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Sorry for the late response. Yes it seems to happen regardless of speed. Though, to be fair, I haven't gone super fast in a parking lot full lock. Also, I'm starting to get a vibration when driving above 60ish. I know it's not the hubs or brakes. Could worn CVs cause that as well? The roads out here in WNY are not the best and I've hit my fair share of potholes over the years (have owned the car for about 8 or so). Not sure if that could have anything to do with it too.
Are the GM axles discontinued at this point (CED shows them on backorder and ZZP shows LSJ but not LNF axles)? If so, what is a good replacement?
Are the GM axles discontinued at this point (CED shows them on backorder and ZZP shows LSJ but not LNF axles)? If so, what is a good replacement?
01-30-2020, 08:14 AM
#7
Sorry for the late response. Yes it seems to happen regardless of speed. Though, to be fair, I haven't gone super fast in a parking lot full lock. Also, I'm starting to get a vibration when driving above 60ish. I know it's not the hubs or brakes. Could worn CVs cause that as well? The roads out here in WNY are not the best and I've hit my fair share of potholes over the years (have owned the car for about 8 or so). Not sure if that could have anything to do with it too.
Are the GM axles discontinued at this point (CED shows them on backorder and ZZP shows LSJ but not LNF axles)? If so, what is a good replacement?
Are the GM axles discontinued at this point (CED shows them on backorder and ZZP shows LSJ but not LNF axles)? If so, what is a good replacement?
I don't have an LNF but I get my axles from Napa. They are beefier than carquest/advance which I have snapped. And if you do break them you can get them replaced on warranty.
If your axle is actually what is causing the vibration you would think it would have significant slop in one of the CV joints. Might be worth putting the suspected front corner up in the air and grabbing the shaft and giving it a wiggle to see if there is any play. If the axles actually are what's causing the shake the joint could be about ready to fall apart.
01-30-2020, 11:44 AM
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I mean you can pick up axles from rockauto or a local parts store, they're not likely to be as strong as the OEMs (the ones I got from rockauto were definitely thinner, but fine for the last 30-40k and still have no issues). If you're not racing/launching all the time they'll be fine.
01-30-2020, 12:20 PM
#9
You may be able to have the axles reconditioned (i.e. rebuilt). I did this for my 2.8 manual Cavalier RS. I went to buy replacement axles and so that they were much less stout looking. The parts guy said they could recondition the axles. When I got them back they looked like new.
01-30-2020, 01:24 PM
#10
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There is a place called The Driveshaft Shop. They make custom axles. If you send in your stock axles, they can clone them or beef them up. I used them for the axles on my Bug (F23 trans to Miata spindles) and they have held up great with racing and 400hp. I think they were around $650 for the pair and are rated up to 500hp. I know its not the cheapest option but may be the most reliable.
01-30-2020, 01:42 PM
#11
$83 Napa axle with lifetime warranty for free replacement vs. $325 for custom axles. I've changed the axles out on my car many times and it's really a relatively easy job and can be done in about an hour in a parking lot with single jack stand.
For those custom axles do they also utilize a more robust CV joint? Besides the carquest axle I snapped the only issues I have with Napa axles are with the CV joint getting boogered up.
For those custom axles do they also utilize a more robust CV joint? Besides the carquest axle I snapped the only issues I have with Napa axles are with the CV joint getting boogered up.
02-01-2020, 12:36 PM
#13
I replaced my wheel hubs and it howled right after too...ended ultimately being my old lady once she saw my invoices for all my parts. 🤣🙌
but in all seriousness I had to replace my hubs 4 times so you may have gotten a faulty part, tranny may be going, or some kind of drivetrain issue.
but in all seriousness I had to replace my hubs 4 times so you may have gotten a faulty part, tranny may be going, or some kind of drivetrain issue.
04-20-2020, 02:44 PM
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Ok I had some time to mess with the car again. Here is an update. This weekend I replaced the following items: front struts, strut mounts/bearings, sway bar endlinks, outer tie rods, swapped back to my summer wheels/tires, and got an alignment. Wiggled axles around to see about excess play or movement. They seem solid as far as we could tell. Howl noise still present and vibration still present.
So I took the car and rode around with my father in an empty parking lot. Performed many tight left and right hand turns to produce the sound. Basically drove in tight circles with the steering wheel fully one way for a bunch of turns, then the same thing in the other direction. Probably about 15 circles in each direction. The howl occurs both directions and seems to lessen when letting off gas while turning and will get louder if I keep accelerating while turning. My father rode inside for some turns then got out and listened outside as well. He seems to think it's a bearing issue. So Slowbalt2000 might be right with diff bearings.
We then did highway driving to attempt to diagnose the vibration I'm getting above 60. Ran different speeds and different gears/rpms to see how it reacted. So like 60mph in 3rd, then 4th, then 5th. 70mph in 3rd, then 4th, then 5th, etc. The vibration seems to be consistent in frequency, but increases in intensity the faster I go. So the vibrational pattern remains consistent but it becomes more 'violent' as speed increases if that makes sense. I feel the vibration mostly in my seat and in the floor. I don't feel it much in the steering wheel and it doesn't wobble the wheel at all (again, swapping wheel/tire setups doesn't affect the vibration at all). I assume bad bearings in the trans could very well cause vibration. And I might be feeling it more in the seat and floor from rear trans mount?
I may bite the bullet and have the dealer diagnose it. I think they're charging $80 or so diagnostic fee around me. It may be something easier than ripping into the trans (maybe that intermediate shaft bearing that the pass axle is attached to??). But if they say internal trans bearings I guess the trans will be coming out again (which sucks since we had it out about 3 years ago to do TOB. Clutch and all other associated items were done at that time too).
I'm just getting very frustrated with the vibration and noise and also my shifter is getting sloppy to where I can wiggle it around some while still in gear (roll pin issue?? Not easy to get to on LNF from what I can tell). I'm getting to the point of wanting to sell the car. Keep debating if it's worth dropping money on a new trans, have the car down a while to get this trans rebuilt, or just moving on to something new. Have owned the car for 8 of the 12 years of its life. Got it with 20k(ish) miles and it now has about 125k.
So I took the car and rode around with my father in an empty parking lot. Performed many tight left and right hand turns to produce the sound. Basically drove in tight circles with the steering wheel fully one way for a bunch of turns, then the same thing in the other direction. Probably about 15 circles in each direction. The howl occurs both directions and seems to lessen when letting off gas while turning and will get louder if I keep accelerating while turning. My father rode inside for some turns then got out and listened outside as well. He seems to think it's a bearing issue. So Slowbalt2000 might be right with diff bearings.
We then did highway driving to attempt to diagnose the vibration I'm getting above 60. Ran different speeds and different gears/rpms to see how it reacted. So like 60mph in 3rd, then 4th, then 5th. 70mph in 3rd, then 4th, then 5th, etc. The vibration seems to be consistent in frequency, but increases in intensity the faster I go. So the vibrational pattern remains consistent but it becomes more 'violent' as speed increases if that makes sense. I feel the vibration mostly in my seat and in the floor. I don't feel it much in the steering wheel and it doesn't wobble the wheel at all (again, swapping wheel/tire setups doesn't affect the vibration at all). I assume bad bearings in the trans could very well cause vibration. And I might be feeling it more in the seat and floor from rear trans mount?
I may bite the bullet and have the dealer diagnose it. I think they're charging $80 or so diagnostic fee around me. It may be something easier than ripping into the trans (maybe that intermediate shaft bearing that the pass axle is attached to??). But if they say internal trans bearings I guess the trans will be coming out again (which sucks since we had it out about 3 years ago to do TOB. Clutch and all other associated items were done at that time too).
I'm just getting very frustrated with the vibration and noise and also my shifter is getting sloppy to where I can wiggle it around some while still in gear (roll pin issue?? Not easy to get to on LNF from what I can tell). I'm getting to the point of wanting to sell the car. Keep debating if it's worth dropping money on a new trans, have the car down a while to get this trans rebuilt, or just moving on to something new. Have owned the car for 8 of the 12 years of its life. Got it with 20k(ish) miles and it now has about 125k.
04-21-2020, 06:09 PM
#15
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Ok I had some time to mess with the car again. Here is an update. This weekend I replaced the following items: front struts, strut mounts/bearings, sway bar endlinks, outer tie rods, swapped back to my summer wheels/tires, and got an alignment. Wiggled axles around to see about excess play or movement. They seem solid as far as we could tell. Howl noise still present and vibration still present.
So I took the car and rode around with my father in an empty parking lot. Performed many tight left and right hand turns to produce the sound. Basically drove in tight circles with the steering wheel fully one way for a bunch of turns, then the same thing in the other direction. Probably about 15 circles in each direction. The howl occurs both directions and seems to lessen when letting off gas while turning and will get louder if I keep accelerating while turning. My father rode inside for some turns then got out and listened outside as well. He seems to think it's a bearing issue. So Slowbalt2000 might be right with diff bearings.
We then did highway driving to attempt to diagnose the vibration I'm getting above 60. Ran different speeds and different gears/rpms to see how it reacted. So like 60mph in 3rd, then 4th, then 5th. 70mph in 3rd, then 4th, then 5th, etc. The vibration seems to be consistent in frequency, but increases in intensity the faster I go. So the vibrational pattern remains consistent but it becomes more 'violent' as speed increases if that makes sense. I feel the vibration mostly in my seat and in the floor. I don't feel it much in the steering wheel and it doesn't wobble the wheel at all (again, swapping wheel/tire setups doesn't affect the vibration at all). I assume bad bearings in the trans could very well cause vibration. And I might be feeling it more in the seat and floor from rear trans mount?
I may bite the bullet and have the dealer diagnose it. I think they're charging $80 or so diagnostic fee around me. It may be something easier than ripping into the trans (maybe that intermediate shaft bearing that the pass axle is attached to??). But if they say internal trans bearings I guess the trans will be coming out again (which sucks since we had it out about 3 years ago to do TOB. Clutch and all other associated items were done at that time too).
I'm just getting very frustrated with the vibration and noise and also my shifter is getting sloppy to where I can wiggle it around some while still in gear (roll pin issue?? Not easy to get to on LNF from what I can tell). I'm getting to the point of wanting to sell the car. Keep debating if it's worth dropping money on a new trans, have the car down a while to get this trans rebuilt, or just moving on to something new. Have owned the car for 8 of the 12 years of its life. Got it with 20k(ish) miles and it now has about 125k.
So I took the car and rode around with my father in an empty parking lot. Performed many tight left and right hand turns to produce the sound. Basically drove in tight circles with the steering wheel fully one way for a bunch of turns, then the same thing in the other direction. Probably about 15 circles in each direction. The howl occurs both directions and seems to lessen when letting off gas while turning and will get louder if I keep accelerating while turning. My father rode inside for some turns then got out and listened outside as well. He seems to think it's a bearing issue. So Slowbalt2000 might be right with diff bearings.
We then did highway driving to attempt to diagnose the vibration I'm getting above 60. Ran different speeds and different gears/rpms to see how it reacted. So like 60mph in 3rd, then 4th, then 5th. 70mph in 3rd, then 4th, then 5th, etc. The vibration seems to be consistent in frequency, but increases in intensity the faster I go. So the vibrational pattern remains consistent but it becomes more 'violent' as speed increases if that makes sense. I feel the vibration mostly in my seat and in the floor. I don't feel it much in the steering wheel and it doesn't wobble the wheel at all (again, swapping wheel/tire setups doesn't affect the vibration at all). I assume bad bearings in the trans could very well cause vibration. And I might be feeling it more in the seat and floor from rear trans mount?
I may bite the bullet and have the dealer diagnose it. I think they're charging $80 or so diagnostic fee around me. It may be something easier than ripping into the trans (maybe that intermediate shaft bearing that the pass axle is attached to??). But if they say internal trans bearings I guess the trans will be coming out again (which sucks since we had it out about 3 years ago to do TOB. Clutch and all other associated items were done at that time too).
I'm just getting very frustrated with the vibration and noise and also my shifter is getting sloppy to where I can wiggle it around some while still in gear (roll pin issue?? Not easy to get to on LNF from what I can tell). I'm getting to the point of wanting to sell the car. Keep debating if it's worth dropping money on a new trans, have the car down a while to get this trans rebuilt, or just moving on to something new. Have owned the car for 8 of the 12 years of its life. Got it with 20k(ish) miles and it now has about 125k.
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