My experience with ZZP
Member
Joined: 05-28-09
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
From: Fayetteville, NC
I am writing this for a few reasons, and I will be editing it through out the day as I get my thoughts together, my emails in order, and as I get actual time to write this.
This post is ment to be informative but there are parts that might come off as me bitching and complaining. But trust me, you would be too if you had been going through what I have. I am going to try and be as objective as possible. I will point out the mistakes I made as well as the mistakes this vendor made.
To begin with, I will tell you what prompted me to use this vendor vs a supporting vendor of this website. I initially went with DDM for my engine build. I talked with Dave almost every other day about options, price, timeframe ect...We agreed on everything and the build began. However unforeseen problems started to crop up delaying the build more and more. This was not Daves fault, this was not my fault. Had this not been my daily driver I would have continued to wait as I know Dave does great work. But my borrowed car was going away soon and I had to have an engine. Dave understood, refunded the entire amount and ate the cost on the custom pistons. I will talk more about Dave later in this post.
Now I have all my money back, no engine, and a blown motor in my Sky. Enter ZZP. I talk with them, they say they have an engine ready to ship on Friday. I say lets do it and send them the money. This engine, however, is more expensive, with less quality parts than what DDM was going to deliver. But I was in a hurry and they assured me that this engine could handle 800whp with fuel and a turbo.
Fast forward a week. The engine gets delivered and the swap begins. The shop doing the swap had never done an ecotec before so they were learning as they went. I dont have a problem with that because they were great on other platforms. Once the swap was finished, and the car was started, we were constantly getting a Low fuel pressure check engine light. (this is the part that is not ZZP's fault) I trouble shoot the issue with Matt from ZZP for a few days, and we finally discover that the plunger for the HPFP had been left in the old engine, therefore the HPFP was not pumping, and the engine was running on 60psi from the LPFP. I fixed this problem and I was sent on my way to break in the engine.
Per Matt M at ZZP, I used the break in oil they sent me for 500 miles with easy boosting. Taking it very easy on the engine... During this 500 mile break in the engine lost 1.75 quarts of oil. That is when I started the email chain with Matt about the oil loss.
The oil loss issue spanned many many emails. Most of them were trouble shooting steps that I completed and reported back to Matt. The last few emails were me and Matt discussing warranty info. Basically, what was expected of me and what ZZP was prepared to do. During our email exchanges, several times Matt insinuated that I was wasting his valuable time with my oil problem. I was also accused of doing something wrong and that was probably the cause of the oil loss issue. Several times I have pointed out that he is in a customer service position and he should not talk to paying customers, especially ones who fork over $7,000, like that. He then defended himself in a very argumentative mannor and I could see that this was going to go nowhere. I basically just accepted that I was dealing with a child who was in a position of authority over my warranty engine work. The last email I sent them basically said Thanks for nothing, this is the end of our business relationship.
Matt informed me that they would perform the work, at my cost of around $800 for engine removal and replacement. They would only cover the part that was bad. So even if it was their fault for the oil issue, as in, the rings are bad, or the valve seals are bad, I would be responsible for all the labor and shipping costs. This would put the total around $2000 for warranty work. WARRANTY work.... lol what a joke. However they said they may "work" with me on this. Well, if work with me means they will pay to ship it, fix it and ship it back then I am all for it. However, knowing what I know now about their company, I think I will have work done, at my expense, somewhere else.
By the way... here is the Better Business Bureau link to ZZP
Z Z Performance Business Review in Wyoming, MI - Western Michigan BBB
Once I get to work, I will forward the emails to my home address and post references to all of what I said.
This post is ment to be informative but there are parts that might come off as me bitching and complaining. But trust me, you would be too if you had been going through what I have. I am going to try and be as objective as possible. I will point out the mistakes I made as well as the mistakes this vendor made.
To begin with, I will tell you what prompted me to use this vendor vs a supporting vendor of this website. I initially went with DDM for my engine build. I talked with Dave almost every other day about options, price, timeframe ect...We agreed on everything and the build began. However unforeseen problems started to crop up delaying the build more and more. This was not Daves fault, this was not my fault. Had this not been my daily driver I would have continued to wait as I know Dave does great work. But my borrowed car was going away soon and I had to have an engine. Dave understood, refunded the entire amount and ate the cost on the custom pistons. I will talk more about Dave later in this post.
Now I have all my money back, no engine, and a blown motor in my Sky. Enter ZZP. I talk with them, they say they have an engine ready to ship on Friday. I say lets do it and send them the money. This engine, however, is more expensive, with less quality parts than what DDM was going to deliver. But I was in a hurry and they assured me that this engine could handle 800whp with fuel and a turbo.
Fast forward a week. The engine gets delivered and the swap begins. The shop doing the swap had never done an ecotec before so they were learning as they went. I dont have a problem with that because they were great on other platforms. Once the swap was finished, and the car was started, we were constantly getting a Low fuel pressure check engine light. (this is the part that is not ZZP's fault) I trouble shoot the issue with Matt from ZZP for a few days, and we finally discover that the plunger for the HPFP had been left in the old engine, therefore the HPFP was not pumping, and the engine was running on 60psi from the LPFP. I fixed this problem and I was sent on my way to break in the engine.
Per Matt M at ZZP, I used the break in oil they sent me for 500 miles with easy boosting. Taking it very easy on the engine... During this 500 mile break in the engine lost 1.75 quarts of oil. That is when I started the email chain with Matt about the oil loss.
The oil loss issue spanned many many emails. Most of them were trouble shooting steps that I completed and reported back to Matt. The last few emails were me and Matt discussing warranty info. Basically, what was expected of me and what ZZP was prepared to do. During our email exchanges, several times Matt insinuated that I was wasting his valuable time with my oil problem. I was also accused of doing something wrong and that was probably the cause of the oil loss issue. Several times I have pointed out that he is in a customer service position and he should not talk to paying customers, especially ones who fork over $7,000, like that. He then defended himself in a very argumentative mannor and I could see that this was going to go nowhere. I basically just accepted that I was dealing with a child who was in a position of authority over my warranty engine work. The last email I sent them basically said Thanks for nothing, this is the end of our business relationship.
Matt informed me that they would perform the work, at my cost of around $800 for engine removal and replacement. They would only cover the part that was bad. So even if it was their fault for the oil issue, as in, the rings are bad, or the valve seals are bad, I would be responsible for all the labor and shipping costs. This would put the total around $2000 for warranty work. WARRANTY work.... lol what a joke. However they said they may "work" with me on this. Well, if work with me means they will pay to ship it, fix it and ship it back then I am all for it. However, knowing what I know now about their company, I think I will have work done, at my expense, somewhere else.
By the way... here is the Better Business Bureau link to ZZP
Z Z Performance Business Review in Wyoming, MI - Western Michigan BBB
Once I get to work, I will forward the emails to my home address and post references to all of what I said.
Another thing to realize...not sure who said it, but don't ever plan to build a car and not be willing to fork over money to see it through to the end. I am not saying spend money recklessly, but know that **** happens. Two months ago, my timing chain finally took a crap in its pants. It was luckily covered under warranty, but I was more than prepared to do whatever to fix it.
Think about all the thought that went into producing the LSJ and LNF motors...GUESS WHAT THEY STILL HAD PROBLEMS! So yea, think about that. GM spending a crap ton to research and develop a platform and it still has issues. You a regular guy trying to build a motor. lol really dude? If its too expensive...sell your car and find a new hobby.
Senior Member
Joined: 06-16-09
Posts: 1,179
Likes: 0
From: Sherrodsville, OH
zzp had nothing but the utmost respect for me during my time dealing with them. I was to tow my car up there to have them build it towards the end of november. I had serious truck issues and could not get them my car until towards the end of january i believe. Tim was nothing but understanding with my. My finished motor sat in the corner of their shop for two months while i got my truck working again. Due to my work and school schedule i couldnt pick up my car during the normal business hours. Tim had no problem coming in early on a saturday morning to get me my car. Not only that but he came outside in 9 degree weather to help me load it and made sure i got on my way. ZZP has been nothing but great for me, and i cant see how or why they would treat anyone else badly. Matt has even been more then patient with me getting my car tuned, and put up with all the dumb question emails i sent him. I will most definitely be going back for more, and they will be the only shop getting my money in the future. I feel like people are way to quick to jump on the bandwagon.
Member
Joined: 05-28-09
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
From: Fayetteville, NC
Not to play the Redline LSJs but yea...it is a saturn...just sayin' what he said lol. Either way I guess it all falls under the umbrella of GM. I am just looking at it like...sooooo either you have the money to spend on your car and just don't want to. Or you have the money, but don't want to risk finding out the motor got messed up and its your fault. I would consider this guy's thread a FAIL if he finds out it was something the shop he went to did. I think when the problem is resolved we should know what caused it and why. With pics and proof. Because after all it sounds like no one really knows what is causing the oil loss for sure. Am I right or am I right?
#kanyeshrug
#kanyeshrug
Thread Starter
New Member
Joined: 10-21-10
Posts: 82
Likes: 0
From: lexington
I just wanted to get my story out. I knew going into this that it would be bad. This forum seems to be owned by ZZP. The mods are in their pocket. I am sorry, but you are. Calling my situation bull **** and complaining that you have to baby sit me.... good lord. Grow up. Sorry you are missing your beer pong championship to deal with me.
Member
Joined: 05-28-09
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
From: Fayetteville, NC
zzp had nothing but the utmost respect for me during my time dealing with them. I was to tow my car up there to have them build it towards the end of november. I had serious truck issues and could not get them my car until towards the end of january i believe. Tim was nothing but understanding with my. My finished motor sat in the corner of their shop for two months while i got my truck working again. Due to my work and school schedule i couldnt pick up my car during the normal business hours. Tim had no problem coming in early on a saturday morning to get me my car. Not only that but he came outside in 9 degree weather to help me load it and made sure i got on my way. ZZP has been nothing but great for me, and i cant see how or why they would treat anyone else badly. Matt has even been more then patient with me getting my car tuned, and put up with all the dumb question emails i sent him. I will most definitely be going back for more, and they will be the only shop getting my money in the future. I feel like people are way to quick to jump on the bandwagon.
Senior Member
Joined: 06-16-09
Posts: 1,179
Likes: 0
From: Sherrodsville, OH
I just wanted to get my story out. I knew going into this that it would be bad. This forum seems to be owned by ZZP. The mods are in their pocket. I am sorry, but you are. Calling my situation bull **** and complaining that you have to baby sit me.... good lord. Grow up. Sorry you are missing your beer pong championship to deal with me.
Former Vendor
Joined: 06-03-08
Posts: 4,169
Likes: 8
From: Grand Rapids, MI
I just wanted to get my story out. I knew going into this that it would be bad. This forum seems to be owned by ZZP. The mods are in their pocket. I am sorry, but you are. Calling my situation bull **** and complaining that you have to baby sit me.... good lord. Grow up. Sorry you are missing your beer pong championship to deal with me.
Member
Joined: 05-28-09
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
From: Fayetteville, NC
I just wanted to get my story out. I knew going into this that it would be bad. This forum seems to be owned by ZZP. The mods are in their pocket. I am sorry, but you are. Calling my situation bull **** and complaining that you have to baby sit me.... good lord. Grow up. Sorry you are missing your beer pong championship to deal with me.
I just wanted to get my story out. I knew going into this that it would be bad. This forum seems to be owned by ZZP. The mods are in their pocket. I am sorry, but you are. Calling my situation bull **** and complaining that you have to baby sit me.... good lord. Grow up. Sorry you are missing your beer pong championship to deal with me.
you wanted to get your story out? you mean your one sided experience about how you went about things the wrong way?
ZZP does not own this site. but unlike members, they pay much more than the $14.99 for a platinum membership and dungeon access. so you're damn right they're going to have privileges. as does any paying vendor on this site. hell even Powell came in here and said you went about this all wrong, oh geez they must be owned by zzp as well. get a hold of yourself guy... you're making yourself look worse saying the things you are
and until the day comes where i'm paid by someone to voice my own personal opinion based on my experience and that of other satisfied customers off zzp, i am in no ones pocket.
New Member
Joined: 09-28-11
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
From: USA
Ban me if you want, but who here can honestly say this is a good place to put an injector? If trying to state my opinion on something like this is a "personal vendetta" then there is something pretty eff'd up going on here. This is not personal, this is fact. It's basic physics. It's basic chemistry. Spraying an atomized mixture into a hole like this WILL turn it back into a liquid and it will pour out the passageway. Is that a personal attack? No, that's Basic Chem 101.
So far everyone that has read my post that was deleted said it was NOT false, slanderous, personal attacks or anything else but a factual review of a product. Too bad nobody but ZZP got to read it.
By silencing people's opinions you only spread ignorance.
So far everyone that has read my post that was deleted said it was NOT false, slanderous, personal attacks or anything else but a factual review of a product. Too bad nobody but ZZP got to read it.
By silencing people's opinions you only spread ignorance.
Senior Member
Joined: 01-26-10
Posts: 947
Likes: 0
From: Toronto
I still LOL everytime I think of GMtech saying most Cobalt owners are poor and will never spend money.
I've sunk quite a bit of money into the car with zzp parts and it's still going.
If that's what you're hinting at - WTF do you own a sky or two? Shouldn't you have a Ferrari?
I've sunk quite a bit of money into the car with zzp parts and it's still going.
If that's what you're hinting at - WTF do you own a sky or two? Shouldn't you have a Ferrari?
Senior Member
Joined: 05-15-10
Posts: 3,994
Likes: 2
From: South Charleston, WV
Lol, I don't think I'll have this issue but what is the best way to route the pcv valve? I noticed with you guys kit I was not able to hook the big turbo intake up to the stock pcv valve line.
Thread Starter
New Member
Joined: 10-21-10
Posts: 82
Likes: 0
From: lexington
Its hard to hold a conversation here when mods are obviously biased. I honestly don't care what becomes of this thread. I had no idea how deep zzp has control over the moderation of cobalt ss. I have said what I wanted, take it for what its worth or don't. Arguing with people who argue just to argue is not worth my time.
Its hard to hold a conversation here when mods are obviously biased. I honestly don't care what becomes of this thread. I had no idea how deep zzp has control over the moderation of cobalt ss. I have said what I wanted, take it for what its worth or don't. Arguing with people who argue just to argue is not worth my time.
Just my two cents, you have no argument against zzp in this thread.
Former Vendor
Joined: 06-03-08
Posts: 4,169
Likes: 8
From: Grand Rapids, MI
Its hard to hold a conversation here when mods are obviously biased. I honestly don't care what becomes of this thread. I had no idea how deep zzp has control over the moderation of cobalt ss. I have said what I wanted, take it for what its worth or don't. Arguing with people who argue just to argue is not worth my time.
Senior Member
Joined: 07-13-10
Posts: 884
Likes: 0
From: Bogalusa
Its hard to hold a conversation here when mods are obviously biased. I honestly don't care what becomes of this thread. I had no idea how deep zzp has control over the moderation of cobalt ss. I have said what I wanted, take it for what its worth or don't. Arguing with people who argue just to argue is not worth my time.
If you were smart you would take on the cost to ship it to zzp. Have them diagnose things and prove to you the shop did something wrong that installed it and have them send you proof of that fact. File a court case which in nj cost you 25$ and go take your case to court and get all your money for the install back and punitative damage against the shop.
Just my two cents, you have no argument against zzp in this thread.
Just my two cents, you have no argument against zzp in this thread.