Where's my 7000 rpm's ??
09-06-2006, 10:42 PM
#126
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For those that have ANY issue with dealers denying that the car is supposed to be flashed or if there is a question about the technical specs here they are straight from those that had a hand designing it,
09-06-2006, 10:47 PM
#127
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For everyone still wondering about the spark plug gap here it is in all its glory. Clint was in agreement that a wider gap improves performance but has the side affect of much shorter life overall. If you wanna be safe with the plugs you buy use this gap. I won't be changing mine cus I would rather have the performance and 10 bucks every so often is no issue with me.
09-06-2006, 10:50 PM
#128
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The following is for those that are getting ripped off by dealerships charging 6 or more hours of work installing the GM stage kits. The expected install is ~2.5~to~3~ hours and anything over 4 and your getting way ripped off. If this is the case for you refer them to this info and you should be golden.
edited: as stated below by clint's first post you should still expect a slight markup of about 20% for your total when you pay for the job.
edited: as stated below by clint's first post you should still expect a slight markup of about 20% for your total when you pay for the job.
Last edited by OniMirage; 09-07-2006 at 12:02 PM.
09-06-2006, 11:31 PM
#132
Originally Posted by OniMirage
The following is for those that are getting ripped off by dealerships charging 6 or more hours of work installing the GM stage kits. The expected install is ~2.5~to~3~ hours and anything over 4 and your getting way ripped off. If this is the case for you refer them to this info and you should be golden.
I think I'm going to talk to them tomorrow and if the issue is not resolved, I am calling GM and putting in a complaint that I am being ripped off... being charged $400 for an install that should take 3.5 hours.. and they didn't even do it all! In fact the part that takes the LONGEST is the part they didn't do!
And in document form.
09-06-2006, 11:48 PM
#134
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hey man i got a question for you...how could he not have noticed you had a smaller pully on there if the stage 2 comes with a new pully??? if he didn't notice he would hav taken it off and replaced it with the one that comes wth the kit.
09-07-2006, 12:12 AM
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Originally Posted by cobalt06ss_sc
hey man i got a question for you...how could he not have noticed you had a smaller pully on there if the stage 2 comes with a new pully??? if he didn't notice he would hav taken it off and replaced it with the one that comes wth the kit.
09-07-2006, 01:43 AM
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YAY Eric FTW!.
Mechanics typically work under a pro-rated system. They get told how long the exceptable amount of time is for the work and if they get it done early you still pay for the expected time not the actual time spent. I t should work the same if they take longer.
Mechanics typically work under a pro-rated system. They get told how long the exceptable amount of time is for the work and if they get it done early you still pay for the expected time not the actual time spent. I t should work the same if they take longer.
09-07-2006, 08:13 AM
#140
Originally Posted by cobalt06ss_sc
hey man i got a question for you...how could he not have noticed you had a smaller pully on there if the stage 2 comes with a new pully??? if he didn't notice he would hav taken it off and replaced it with the one that comes wth the kit.
09-07-2006, 09:41 AM
#141
Just got back from my Stage2 Reflash. Got them to Print me out a sheet on how long he took on each part install.
2.5 hours to R&R S/C, press off pulley, press on new pulley, reinstall S/C
1.0 to remove spark plugs, regap, install new spark plugs
0.8 to remove and install new Belt
1.7 to remove and install new injectors
Customer was billed $76.94/hr instead of 79.95 standard rate... Customer was also not billed shop supplies which would have been $15.00 allowable by State of Ohio.
And it's all hand written... they just used one OPCODE...
J0250 Replaced the supercharger drive pulley, all four spark plugs, installed updated belt, and other parts provided by customer.
Looks pretty custom to me! Not to mention the .8 of an hour today for the reflash... although that amount of time is legit in my eyes.
Help me out here guys... am I being ripped off? I sure feel like it... 6.5+ hours of labor. Suggested course of Action?
2.5 hours to R&R S/C, press off pulley, press on new pulley, reinstall S/C
1.0 to remove spark plugs, regap, install new spark plugs
0.8 to remove and install new Belt
1.7 to remove and install new injectors
Customer was billed $76.94/hr instead of 79.95 standard rate... Customer was also not billed shop supplies which would have been $15.00 allowable by State of Ohio.
And it's all hand written... they just used one OPCODE...
J0250 Replaced the supercharger drive pulley, all four spark plugs, installed updated belt, and other parts provided by customer.
Looks pretty custom to me! Not to mention the .8 of an hour today for the reflash... although that amount of time is legit in my eyes.
Help me out here guys... am I being ripped off? I sure feel like it... 6.5+ hours of labor. Suggested course of Action?
09-07-2006, 10:35 AM
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The belt shouln't take an experienced mechanic more than 5-10 minutes, and the injectors *maybe* an hour from what I've seen. If you have a press, the s/c work shouldn't take more than 1.5 hrs...all in all, if a dealership charges you more than 3 hours of labor, something's wrong.
09-07-2006, 10:35 AM
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Where did the spark plugs come from? I think you paid a little too much.
Oh just noticed you provided them. They shouldnt charge you for the reflash thought, that was there own fault.
Oh just noticed you provided them. They shouldnt charge you for the reflash thought, that was there own fault.
09-07-2006, 10:42 AM
#144
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I would go to another dealer and ask about the opcode to see if something pulls up. it may be a custom entry like you said. Since all the info and even correct opcodes are mentioned in my posts you could easily argue a refund of some kind if you called GM after confirming with another dealer. The issue though is that though this information may be useful you need to remember that you already paid so it may be tough to get it reversed.
You should have been charged about 4 hours worth of labor since it appears you had them install new plugs as well so 76.95 x 2 =153.90 overcharged. If it took the tech longer than normal to do the job the tech shouldn't have touched your car and you shouldn't have had to pay for the extra time for him to scratch his ass trying to figure it out.
You should have been charged about 4 hours worth of labor since it appears you had them install new plugs as well so 76.95 x 2 =153.90 overcharged. If it took the tech longer than normal to do the job the tech shouldn't have touched your car and you shouldn't have had to pay for the extra time for him to scratch his ass trying to figure it out.
09-07-2006, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by USMCFieldMP
Just got back from my Stage2 Reflash. Got them to Print me out a sheet on how long he took on each part install.
2.5 hours to R&R S/C, press off pulley, press on new pulley, reinstall S/C
1.0 to remove spark plugs, regap, install new spark plugs
0.8 to remove and install new Belt
1.7 to remove and install new injectors
Customer was billed $76.94/hr instead of 79.95 standard rate... Customer was also not billed shop supplies which would have been $15.00 allowable by State of Ohio.
And it's all hand written... they just used one OPCODE...
J0250 Replaced the supercharger drive pulley, all four spark plugs, installed updated belt, and other parts provided by customer.
Looks pretty custom to me! Not to mention the .8 of an hour today for the reflash... although that amount of time is legit in my eyes.
Help me out here guys... am I being ripped off? I sure feel like it... 6.5+ hours of labor. Suggested course of Action?
2.5 hours to R&R S/C, press off pulley, press on new pulley, reinstall S/C
1.0 to remove spark plugs, regap, install new spark plugs
0.8 to remove and install new Belt
1.7 to remove and install new injectors
Customer was billed $76.94/hr instead of 79.95 standard rate... Customer was also not billed shop supplies which would have been $15.00 allowable by State of Ohio.
And it's all hand written... they just used one OPCODE...
J0250 Replaced the supercharger drive pulley, all four spark plugs, installed updated belt, and other parts provided by customer.
Looks pretty custom to me! Not to mention the .8 of an hour today for the reflash... although that amount of time is legit in my eyes.
Help me out here guys... am I being ripped off? I sure feel like it... 6.5+ hours of labor. Suggested course of Action?
Not including spark plugs. (It only takes 10 minutes to do them yourself or to get a buddy to
)
09-07-2006, 11:37 AM
#147
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Originally Posted by USMCFieldMP
Yeah, i should have done the spark plugs myself... they where gonna have the hood up, didn't think they would rob me... didn't even think about it.
Although it could be done in 2 hours, Stage 2 at the dealership is 4 hours tops.
09-07-2006, 11:54 AM
#148
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Lies, Myths And Misdemeaners
First let me introduce myself
My name is Clint Mielke. I am a certified GM World Class Technician, 1 of only 8 in the state of Arizona. I,ve worked for Chevrolet for 23 years, 18 of which at my current location, Bill Heard Chevrolet-Scottsdale. For those of you who don't know what that means, let me explain. ASE certifies technicians in general areas, GM training goes beyond that. World Class dignity is the highest honor, achieved by tremendous training and effort.
In an effort to help some of you understand, I've shared information with onimirage. I feel some of you don't understand what this information means. The labor time information I passed along was based on GM warranty claim guidelines. The truth is that you should be getting charged 20% above these numbers, or about 3.6-4.0 hours for a proper install. Your responsibility as a consumer is to shop price. While I admit some may get overcharged, it's mostly due to the confusion and lack of clear guidlines. A personal note to whomever posted a belt should only take 5-10 minutes to install, I'll bring a stopwatch and watch you do it, obviously you've never done one.
What I will do
I will help, guide and assist those of you who ask. I can help with technical questions, or give advice as to GM recommended guidlines associated with GM performance issues. I will not however take a stance on non-GM or aftermarket performance enhancements, these should be left on your conscience, not mine.
Clint
My name is Clint Mielke. I am a certified GM World Class Technician, 1 of only 8 in the state of Arizona. I,ve worked for Chevrolet for 23 years, 18 of which at my current location, Bill Heard Chevrolet-Scottsdale. For those of you who don't know what that means, let me explain. ASE certifies technicians in general areas, GM training goes beyond that. World Class dignity is the highest honor, achieved by tremendous training and effort.
In an effort to help some of you understand, I've shared information with onimirage. I feel some of you don't understand what this information means. The labor time information I passed along was based on GM warranty claim guidelines. The truth is that you should be getting charged 20% above these numbers, or about 3.6-4.0 hours for a proper install. Your responsibility as a consumer is to shop price. While I admit some may get overcharged, it's mostly due to the confusion and lack of clear guidlines. A personal note to whomever posted a belt should only take 5-10 minutes to install, I'll bring a stopwatch and watch you do it, obviously you've never done one.
What I will do
I will help, guide and assist those of you who ask. I can help with technical questions, or give advice as to GM recommended guidlines associated with GM performance issues. I will not however take a stance on non-GM or aftermarket performance enhancements, these should be left on your conscience, not mine.
Clint
09-07-2006, 12:00 PM
#149
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Originally Posted by GMWORLDCLASS
First let me introduce myself
My name is Clint Mielke. I am a certified GM World Class Technician, 1 of only 8 in the state of Arizona. I,ve worked for Chevrolet for 23 years, 18 of which at my current location, Bill Heard Chevrolet-Scottsdale. For those of you who don't know what that means, let me explain. ASE certifies technicians in general areas, GM training goes beyond that. World Class dignity is the highest honor, achieved by tremendous training and effort.
In an effort to help some of you understand, I've shared information with onimirage. I feel some of you don't understand what this information means. The labor time information I passed along was based on GM warranty claim guidelines. The truth is that you should be getting charged 20% above these numbers, or about 3.6-4.0 hours for a proper install. Your responsibility as a consumer is to shop price. While I admit some may get overcharged, it's mostly due to the confusion and lack of clear guidlines. A personal note to whomever posted a belt should only take 5-10 minutes to install, I'll bring a stopwatch and watch you do it, obviously you've never done one.
What I will do
I will help, guide and assist those of you who ask. I can help with technical questions, or give advice as to GM recommended guidlines associated with GM performance issues. I will not however take a stance on non-GM or aftermarket performance enhancements, these should be left on your conscience, not mine.
Clint
My name is Clint Mielke. I am a certified GM World Class Technician, 1 of only 8 in the state of Arizona. I,ve worked for Chevrolet for 23 years, 18 of which at my current location, Bill Heard Chevrolet-Scottsdale. For those of you who don't know what that means, let me explain. ASE certifies technicians in general areas, GM training goes beyond that. World Class dignity is the highest honor, achieved by tremendous training and effort.
In an effort to help some of you understand, I've shared information with onimirage. I feel some of you don't understand what this information means. The labor time information I passed along was based on GM warranty claim guidelines. The truth is that you should be getting charged 20% above these numbers, or about 3.6-4.0 hours for a proper install. Your responsibility as a consumer is to shop price. While I admit some may get overcharged, it's mostly due to the confusion and lack of clear guidlines. A personal note to whomever posted a belt should only take 5-10 minutes to install, I'll bring a stopwatch and watch you do it, obviously you've never done one.
What I will do
I will help, guide and assist those of you who ask. I can help with technical questions, or give advice as to GM recommended guidlines associated with GM performance issues. I will not however take a stance on non-GM or aftermarket performance enhancements, these should be left on your conscience, not mine.
Clint
09-07-2006, 12:26 PM
#150
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No kidding with changing the belt. It took me alomost an hour to do it myself.
Now, I can have it done in 15 minutes with help. Thats after doing 6 of them with lots of little cuts and one big one.
p.s. thanks Onimirage & Clint
Now, I can have it done in 15 minutes with help. Thats after doing 6 of them with lots of little cuts and one big one.
p.s. thanks Onimirage & Clint