Feeler- Solid Front and Rear Strut Mounts.
Qwik, no hard feelings, never meant to pose that way to you. Just wanted to have some possible clarification. The point was after you stated it was a typo; you went on to saying the "highest" 6000 series aluminum was 6070, which was our point that it is not, 6463 is...
BTW that is a very informative post, lot of good info for the newbie trying to learn the basics on how the "metal" numbering system works. Steel uses the same method.
BTW that is a very informative post, lot of good info for the newbie trying to learn the basics on how the "metal" numbering system works. Steel uses the same method.
HOLY ****! Theres a bearing in there!!!!!! BRAVO!
They still dont do what we need. Wouldnt pressed in from the bottom or retained with a collar/plate been a better setup than welded?
They still dont do what we need. Wouldnt pressed in from the bottom or retained with a collar/plate been a better setup than welded?
IMO, or at least for them to be worthwhile to me in any way....its needs to be caster adjustable, or at least provide an additional fixed amount of caster at bare minimum.
Senior Member
Joined: 09-24-08
Posts: 519
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From: Upstate NY
Okay, heres my opinion, the solid mounts, even with spherical bearings are pointless. Just because steel is stronger than rubber isnt a real reason to upgrade, there would be so little benefit from fixed solid mounts that it wouldnt be worth it to take out your struts to install them.
The camber plate/spherical bearing ones make a little more sense. However if you asked around I dont think youd find many guys complaining about need more camber. Using stock bolts with the splines filed off or one of the already available "alignment kit" bolts, its pretty simple to get enough camber. Not a FAIL, but still not needed.
If you turn your camber plate 90*, it becomes a caster plate......this is something that raced or aggresively driven Cobalt needs imo. It would be nice to be able to get 4.5-6* of caster without resorting to modifying factory parts or your chassis. This would be a clean elegant solution if done well.
The Camber/caster plate(while I am sure most people would wnat this of the products youve come up with) would need further revision from your current design. As it sits nowyour plate would mount under the strut tower just like stock and it would require a nut/bolt be used to secure plate, meaning youd have to get your hand and a tool up in the strut tower AND under the hood at the same time to adjust caster. It cant go on the top in its current state because its flat, the top of the tower is flared where the stock mount goes. Design a way around these flaws, use a spherical bearing, and you may yet have a product some people will want.
The camber plate/spherical bearing ones make a little more sense. However if you asked around I dont think youd find many guys complaining about need more camber. Using stock bolts with the splines filed off or one of the already available "alignment kit" bolts, its pretty simple to get enough camber. Not a FAIL, but still not needed.
If you turn your camber plate 90*, it becomes a caster plate......this is something that raced or aggresively driven Cobalt needs imo. It would be nice to be able to get 4.5-6* of caster without resorting to modifying factory parts or your chassis. This would be a clean elegant solution if done well.
The Camber/caster plate(while I am sure most people would wnat this of the products youve come up with) would need further revision from your current design. As it sits nowyour plate would mount under the strut tower just like stock and it would require a nut/bolt be used to secure plate, meaning youd have to get your hand and a tool up in the strut tower AND under the hood at the same time to adjust caster. It cant go on the top in its current state because its flat, the top of the tower is flared where the stock mount goes. Design a way around these flaws, use a spherical bearing, and you may yet have a product some people will want.
What I am interested in is, will these two different methods of adjusting camber affect the bump/roll steer of a car differently?
Hope I didn't steer off topic too much.
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Joined: 11-22-08
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From: Orlando Florida
the camber plates allow for an easier adjustment and also allow for a further line of movement so no matter how low you lower the car it will be abl to accommodate the drop. as far as the adjuwsmment goes it will allow for a safer way to lower the car. one other thing the mounts then gets changed from rubber to a spherical bearing.
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Joined: 03-17-08
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From: Passing you
The camber plate/spherical bearing ones make a little more sense. However if you asked around I dont think youd find many guys complaining about need more camber. Using stock bolts with the splines filed off or one of the already available "alignment kit" bolts, its pretty simple to get enough camber. Not a FAIL, but still not needed.
Is there a reference for the alignment kit? Is one version the Ingalls on turbo tech's site?
http://www.turbotechracing.com/produ...dcategory=5627
Thanks for being patient.
JK
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Joined: 02-03-08
Posts: 3,454
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From: Port Perry Ontario
In terms of camber bolts vs camber plates, what does a camber plate provides (other than more camber angles) over the camber bolts in terms of performance (not ease of adjustments)?
What I am interested in is, will these two different methods of adjusting camber affect the bump/roll steer of a car differently?
Hope I didn't steer off topic too much.
What I am interested in is, will these two different methods of adjusting camber affect the bump/roll steer of a car differently?
Hope I didn't steer off topic too much.
New Member
Joined: 12-08-08
Posts: 103
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From: Brighton, MI
In terms of camber bolts vs camber plates, what does a camber plate provides (other than more camber angles) over the camber bolts in terms of performance (not ease of adjustments)?
What I am interested in is, will these two different methods of adjusting camber affect the bump/roll steer of a car differently?
Hope I didn't steer off topic too much.
What I am interested in is, will these two different methods of adjusting camber affect the bump/roll steer of a car differently?
Hope I didn't steer off topic too much.
Newb to Cobalts here, but I run Camber plates on my current car (Saabaru). The reason why I got them was first, for more camber than I could get from bolts, and second, to be able to fairly quickly add camber for autocross events and then remove it for daily driving. Toe is also affected, but I do my own alignments and pick settings that work for me. I run -1.8* daily and more for autocross. Adding camber is saving my autocross tires, so it's worth it to me.
When I get my car, I'd be interested in another set much like what's being discussed here. My current ones add varying amounts of caster/camber, depending on how they are mounted in the 3 strut tower holes. They can be rotated to any of 3 positions on each side, and swapped side to side. Don't know if that's possible with this car, but it adds possibilities. I would want a bearing up there, and not mind solid mounts at all. As for marks on the plates, they almost have to be reference-only. Lower cars have a different camber curve than stock ones do.
The other thing that would be desirable in my mind is for them to work with stock-type struts, for people who don't get coilovers. This just means that there's enough clearance inside the tower without having to go to a skinny strut to reach your desired setting.
What do you mean "splines filed off"?
Is there a reference for the alignment kit? Is one version the Ingalls on turbo tech's site?
http://www.turbotechracing.com/produ...dcategory=5627
Thanks for being patient.
JK
Is there a reference for the alignment kit? Is one version the Ingalls on turbo tech's site?
http://www.turbotechracing.com/produ...dcategory=5627
Thanks for being patient.
JK
What I am interested in is, will these two different methods of adjusting camber affect the bump/roll steer of a car differently?
.
.
How do these provide a safer way to lower the car?
Last edited by Maven; Dec 15, 2008 at 07:33 PM.
Thread Starter
New Member
Joined: 11-22-08
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From: Orlando Florida
Have you ever installed camber bolts into the bottom of a strut? I installed some on my car and snapped them in half at 75lbs. So knowing that they are supposed to go to 133, I would assume that the design of the bolts is not the greatest.
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Joined: 03-17-08
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From: Passing you
I find the plates interesting but they seem a bit excessive for just a minor amount of camber. If I were doing lowering/race springs then maybe (yes I track the car) - see below.
http://www.hart-photography.com/phot...ewImage=524272
http://www.hart-photography.com/phot...ewImage=523510
http://www.hart-photography.com/phot...ewImage=523512
http://www.hart-photography.com/phot...ewImage=523738
http://www.hart-photography.com/phot...ewImage=523776
http://www.hart-photography.com/phot...ewImage=523787
http://www.hart-photography.com/phot...ewImage=523843
http://www.hart-photography.com/phot...ewImage=523888
JK
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Joined: 12-08-08
Posts: 103
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From: Brighton, MI
No, there will be virtually no difference in any behavior of the suspension regardless of which method you use. I say virtually because, strictly technically speaking, there will be a "measurable"(as opposed to tangible) difference in steering axis inclination when using plates as opposed to bolts. This will obviously affect pivot radius,roll center, etc,,,.....but not in any way worth chasing after or taking the time to analyze imo.In fact you would actually be forced to use BOTH the plates and bolts, because youd need to adjust both struts to the exact same point on the plates so you didnt move the kinematic roll center off the centrline of the chassis. and then youd still need to set camber SOOOO much of what you and I discuss is WAAAAYYYYYYY beyond any effort any reasonable person is going to put into a stock type suspension, especially a TC, that while enjoyable and great fodder for the interwebz, its really all academic. If youre planning on running any kind of stock class, T2, etc.....you wont even be able to use any of these pieces anyway.
Last edited by Racerdad; Dec 16, 2008 at 08:49 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
Senior Member
Joined: 02-03-08
Posts: 3,454
Likes: 1
From: Port Perry Ontario
here is what you need:
http://www.ground-control-store.com/...ion.php?II=148
used on all cobalt grand am race cars and time attack since 05. cant beat success. 399 a pair. awesome
http://www.ground-control-store.com/...ion.php?II=148
used on all cobalt grand am race cars and time attack since 05. cant beat success. 399 a pair. awesome
Last edited by qwikredline; Jan 12, 2009 at 11:43 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
here is what you need:
http://www.ground-control-store.com/...ion.php?II=148
used on all cobalt grand am race cars and time attack since 05. cant beat success. 399 a pair. awesome
http://www.ground-control-store.com/...ion.php?II=148
used on all cobalt grand am race cars and time attack since 05. cant beat success. 399 a pair. awesome
Thread Starter
New Member
Joined: 11-22-08
Posts: 66
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From: Orlando Florida
Price is $220 shipped. Here is a pic of the bottom.
these are made for the coil-over version. That thing going into the bearing is a special machined piece.
These were the first made, the second set wont look so home grown.
these are made for the coil-over version. That thing going into the bearing is a special machined piece.
These were the first made, the second set wont look so home grown.
Last edited by dohc v6; Jan 13, 2009 at 12:24 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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